Is it ever right to go all-in without pot odds?

bet72off · May 2014

For example, is playing like a donkey ever a good move to make people avoid you?

Here is an example from the £4K B/H Direct satellite.

We were on the final table with 6 people and the average stack was around 5333 chips with 150/300 blinds. Only 3 places win a £55 seat, 4th pays back the £11 buy-in.

I had 2645 chips before posting, and my big blind was raised. I was worried this would happen a lot, so I went all in without correct pot odds, to make people afraid of raising my blind.

My thinking was that I had a 35% chance of winning the hand (including the fold equity), but if I doubled up, I would nearly knock another player out, and people would be less inclined to steal my blind. If I folded I would be a very short stack with a dwindling fold equity.

It "worked", in that I won the hand and got a lot of walks, even though I would just fold after that if my blind did get raised. I went from being the short stack to the big stack when the tournament finished even though I genuinely didn't see a flop after that. Everyone was playing very tight.

I want people to know I am an unpredictable player, and I am able to call off an all in when my blind is raised and they really don't want the variance.

I was called a donkey here, and maybe it was a terrible play and a moment of madness. But is taking the worst of it ever right?

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
Ozzy1000	Small blind		150.00	150.00	5902.50
bet72off	Big blind		300.00	450.00	2345.00
	Your hole cards	3 7
ra1d	Fold
2day	Raise		900.00	1350.00	2532.50
alex1229	Fold
DaddyPig	Fold
Ozzy1000	Fold
bet72off	All-in		2345.00	3695.00	0.00
2day	All-in		2532.50	6227.50	0.00
2day	Unmatched bet		787.50	5440.00	787.50
bet72off	Show	3 7
2day	Show	Q A
Flop
		10 9 5
Turn
		6
River
		4
bet72off	Win	Straight to the 7	5440.00		5440.00

THEROCK573 · May 2014

poor shove matey im afraid, hes never ever folding once he raises 900 into ur stack size so i dont see what shoving is going to achieve other than risking ur tourney/sat life when ur always going to turn over the worst hand.

people taking notice wont then think, oh we better not raise his blind cos he'll shove, they will just widen there value range agaisnt u

MattBates · May 2014

In Response to Is it ever right to go all-in without pot odds?:

Is it ever right to go all-in without pot odds? For example, is playing like a donkey ever a good move to make people avoid you? Here is an example from the £4K B/H Direct satellite. We were on the final table with 6 people and the average stack was around 5333 chips with 150/300 blinds. Only 3 places win a £55 seat, 4th pays back the £11 buy-in. I had 2645 chips before posting, and my big blind was raised. I was worried this would happen a lot, so I went all in without correct pot odds, to make people afraid of raising my blind. My thinking was that I had a 35% chance of winning the hand (including the fold equity), but if I doubled up, I would nearly knock another player out, and people would be less inclined to steal my blind. If I folded I would be a very short stack with a dwindling fold equity. It "worked", in that I won the hand and got a lot of walks, even though I would just fold after that if my blind did get raised. I went from being the short stack to the big stack when the tournament finished even though I genuinely didn't see a flop after that. Everyone was playing very tight. I want people to know I am an unpredictable player, and I am able to call off an all in when my blind is raised and they really don't want the variance. I was called a donkey here, and maybe it was a terrible play and a moment of madness. But is taking the worst of it ever right? Player Action Cards Amount Pot Balance Ozzy1000 Small blind 150.00 150.00 5902.50 bet72off Big blind 300.00 450.00 2345.00 Your hole cards 3 7 ra1d Fold 2day Raise 900.00 1350.00 2532.50 alex1229 Fold DaddyPig Fold Ozzy1000 Fold bet72off All-in 2345.00 3695.00 0.00 2day All-in 2532.50 6227.50 0.00 2day Unmatched bet 787.50 5440.00 787.50 bet72off Show 3 7 2day Show Q A Flop 10 9 5 Turn 6 River 4 bet72off Win Straight to the 7 5440.00 5440.00
Posted by bet72off

People wont be very afraid of raising your bb when you are out of the sat!

You seem to think you have fold equity but I don't think you do. You won the hand but that doesn't mean its a long term losing play. If you were deeper and jam and did win, people will just think you had a hand

bet72off · May 2014

Good points.

I realized my problem is that I am crazy and try to justify all sorts of losing plays in my head because I am a donk.

Time to reform.

BigBluster · May 2014

In Response to Re: Is it ever right to go all-in without pot odds?:

In Response to Is it ever right to go all-in without pot odds? : People wont be very afraid of raising your bb when you are out of the sat! You seem to think you have fold equity but I don't think you do. You won the hand but that doesn't mean its a long term winning play. If you were deeper and jam and did win, people will just think you had a hand
Posted by MattBates

Agree.

Is it ever right to go all-in without pot odds?

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