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Week 3 of the Sky Poker Premiership - off we go again.
Tikay10
Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 160,174
in Poker Chat
New week, slate wiped clean, here's how it looks after Day 1, as at midnight on Monday.
Premier League Leaderboard - Week 3 day 1 standings
1 @xleex21 100 £1,000
2 @alancarr12 99 £750
3 @MIKEY802 98 £500
4 @JMcCririck 97 £400
5 @railtard11 96 £300
6 @OnlySmells 95 £200
7 @d0wn5wing 94 £100
8 @flashgorm 93 £100
9 @GFKIJKLL 92 £100
10 @MattBates 91 £100
11 @RexRegina 90 £75
12 @WUBBZY1401 89 £75
13 @Rhythm1991 88 £75
14 @mkgunner 87 £75
15 @jackl 86 £75
16 @miniman88 85 £50
17 @LiamRynn 84 £50
18 @K0BAYASHl 83 £50
19 @bearlyther 82 £50
20 @LARSON7 81 £50
21 @DOHHHHHHH 80 £35
22 @mrdavies 79 £35
23 @EvilPingu 78 £35
24 @chipst 77 £35
25 @DaveDcMaid 76 £35
26 @fdf6 75 £30
27 @HayleyR27 74 £30
28 @mongo229 73 £30
29 @cpfc_2010 72 £30
30 @touch_MR 71 £30
31 @kian2107 70 £25
32 @uldonuttin 69 £25
33 @jh16 68 £25
34 @Turbooooo 67 £25
35 @Enzo12 66 £25
36 @SenorBegs 65 £25
37 @raggy94 64 £25
38 @TommyD 63 £25
39 @mikequiz47 62 £25
40 @benc 61 £25
41 @FLUSHCHECK 60 £25
42 @hayleyc2 59 £25
43 @excon09 58 £25
44 @Lancelot11 57 £25
45 @DUTCHESS62 56 £25
46 @Triangle3 55 £25
47 @Itsover4u 54 £25
48 @madprof 53 £25
49 @AWDP 52 £25
50 @stuart477 51 £25
Comments
Championship Leaderboard - Week 3 day 1standings
1 @Limp2Lose 100 £600
2 @LuckyBrahh 99 £400
3 @TimmyRaRa 98 £250
4 @FeelGroggy 97 £200
5 @Thoich 96 £150
6 @Beeboy 95 £100
7 @GSmith13 94 £75
8 @rosiedog00 93 £75
9 @Granite89 92 £75
10 @KingBowl 91 £75
11 @poomaaa 90 £50
12 @gonedoggin 89 £50
13 @Tedson 88 £50
14 @mondo1985 87 £50
15 @psuk1 86 £50
16 @alfarch30 85 £35
17 @bar4004 84 £35
18 @BrayCorp83 83 £35
19 @Whizzewky 82 £35
20 @pokermask 81 £35
21 @mici_d 80 £25
22 @Trimms89 79 £25
23 @garner909 78 £25
24 @CrashHolly 77 £25
25 @jd44 76 £25
26 @zinfan 75 £20
27 @phillips58 74 £20
28 @THEGRID 73 £20
29 @Cammykaze 72 £20
30 @Mayhem357 71 £20
31 @KingOfHart 70 £17.50
32 @melicoere 69 £17.50
33 @SJspanky1 68 £17.50
34 @IMAF1SH 67 £17.50
35 @Aylee 66 £17.50
36 @Zuluste 65 £17.50
37 @beefheart1 64 £17.50
38 @tomred64 63 £17.50
39 @Tsaaaar 62 £17.50
40 @The_Fishhh 61 £17.50
41 @poshcole 60 £17.50
42 @stack_u 59 £17.50
43 @Melina92 58 £17.50
44 @vanpersi05 57 £17.50
45 @Smilodon 56 £17.50
46 @md2k8 55 £17.50
47 @beefy36 54 £17.50
48 @bainy1987 53 £17.50
49 @LitlGenral 52 £17.50
50 @jakadodarr 51 £17.50
League 1 Leaderboard - Week 3 day 1 standings
1 @bigfatfish 100 £350
2 @VlalIlia 99 £250
3 @shad8604 98 £200
4 @johnmonty 97 £150
5 @liamboi11 96 £100
6 @N0tFknEasy 95 £75
7 @A_r_K 94 £50
8 @Morrizi0 93 £50
9 @bellamyf 92 £50
10 @Lottieloux 91 £50
11 @snodgrass1 90 £30
12 @Lugwin396 89 £30
13 @ckd 88 £30
14 @JTDiamond 87 £30
15 @stacker59 86 £30
16 @albaking 85 £20
17 @GREGSTER 84 £20
18 @myjokras00 83 £20
19 @Jac35 82 £20
20 @wi03 81 £20
21 @Jacquelyn 80 £10
22 @Swimmr 79 £10
23 @rspca12 78 £10
24 @bb8888 77 £10
25 @Lalalola 76 £10
26 @flushoff7 75 £10
27 @dai-dull 74 £10
28 @H3nry 73 £10
29 @splashies 72 £10
30 @conga38 71 £10
31 @darryl1976 70 £10
32 @Super_Oli 69 £10
33 @LIAM92446 68 £10
34 @prize66 67 £10
35 @therckt 66 £10
36 @Essexphil 65 £10
37 @nrood92 64 £10
38 @BlairReid 63 £10
39 @rainman215 62 £10
40 @dakky 61 £10
41 @chris85 60 £10
42 @MAXALLY 59 £10
43 @hector45 58 £10
44 @Monty1957 57 £10
45 @Lee982 56 £10
46 @The_Chris 55 £10
47 @AB0151 54 £10
48 @madcal1978 53 £10
49 @mase100 52 £10
50 @LadysManQQ 51 £10
51 @lyonsbob06 50 £7.50
52 @SUPERSNEDD 49 £7.50
53 @Ruttyman 48 £7.50
54 @HOLLYWHIT 47 £7.50
55 @SPRING29 46 £7.50
56 @bakkushan 45 £7.50
57 @beanfish 44 £7.50
58 @adzbo 43 £7.50
59 @harry18110 42 £7.50
60 @Mangelator 41 £7.50
61 @70theo 40 £7.50
62 @thammior 39 £7.50
63 @JBuckyyy 38 £7.50
64 @p_blase 37 £7.50
65 @IH8UButler 36 £7.50
66 @coconuts96 35 £7.50
67 @TopMan12 34 £7.50
68 @-danners- 33 £7.50
69 @jonnyrkd 32 £7.50
70 @AJE222 31 £7.50
71 @JordyAA 30 £7.50
72 @THERAGE27 29 £7.50
73 @fastfood 28 £7.50
74 @wartic 27 £7.50
75 @eon1961 26 £7.50
76 @berry598 25 £7.50
77 @nickd49931 24 £7.50
78 @DeadKen 23 £7.50
79 @Timmy712 22 £7.50
80 @stuart43 21 £7.50
81 @Zoot345 20 £7.50
82 @deuemcwar 19 £7.50
83 @supercrazy 18 £7.50
84 @Chancemomo 17 £7.50
85 @Tropius 16 £7.50
86 @Westy0987 15 £7.50
87 @wineli 14 £7.50
88 @asmithx 13 £7.50
89 @dobiesdraw 12 £7.50
90 @1babydave 11 £7.50
91 @CuriousG 10 £7.50
92 @nash7tx14 9 £7.50
93 @Bax082 8 £7.50
94 @WAKO490 7 £7.50
95 @kd00d 6 £7.50
96 @ourkes 5 £7.50
97 @terrytwomore 4 £7.50
98 @Icf_Nass 3 £7.50
99 @Time4Heros 2 £7.50
100 @Ikelly 1 £7.50
League 2 Leaderboard - Week 3 day 1 standings.
1 @ITSQUADSY 100 £300
2 @mmmacammm 99 £225
3 @Donttelmum 98 £150
4 @leSurge 97 £100
5 @MisClick 96 £80
6 @kelkel29 95 £60
7 @pat041279 94 £40
8 @shirley02 93 £40
9 @robtim 92 £40
10 @Sunday8pm 91 £40
11 @Ferruzo 90 £25
12 @GregUK 89 £25
13 @willis69 88 £25
14 @IVEYJR 87 £25
15 @smartdon 86 £25
16 @HAYSIE 85 £15
17 @mumsie 84 £15
18 @jubb 83 £15
19 @gpc70 82 £15
20 @Dandany 81 £15
21 @Clos82 80 £7.50
22 @ACEGOONER 79 £7.50
23 @ICEMAN501 78 £7.50
24 @Wilfreddo8 77 £7.50
25 @scully1515 76 £7.50
26 @Woebegone 75 £7.50
27 @StayOrGo 74 £7.50
28 @Mattyg1980 73 £7.50
29 @tai-gar 72 £7.50
30 @Sharki0 71 £7.50
31 @steve748 70 £7.50
32 @Tassie279 69 £7.50
33 @scoop73 68 £7.50
34 @calcalfold 67 £7.50
35 @readert016 66 £7.50
36 @alltroll12 65 £7.50
37 @eddie2 64 £7.50
38 @mint2210 63 £7.50
39 @clarke1789 62 £7.50
40 @mmmchips 61 £7.50
41 @Igotsevens 60 £7.50
42 @m4rk 59 £7.50
43 @ROBINAYR 58 £7.50
44 @UTRBABY 57 £7.50
45 @BOMBDOG 56 £7.50
46 @eaturchips 55 £7.50
47 @nigeln 54 £7.50
48 @glencoelad 53 £7.50
49 @Danyo0 52 £7.50
50 @Eslb1610 51 £7.50
51 @tosca21 50 £5
52 @lee100 49 £5
53 @chillidamo 48 £5
54 @GrayZoni 47 £5
55 @cpfcjacqs 46 £5
56 @loopyloo43 45 £5
57 @MacGregor7 44 £5
58 @newbie83 43 £5
59 @Amarie 42 £5
60 @NoEa5yCa5h 41 £5
61 @pearson 40 £5
62 @j3ono 39 £5
63 @Jpody 38 £5
64 @thefall 37 £5
65 @scrumdown 36 £5
66 @-lady-love 35 £5
67 @Wilton 34 £5
68 @Enut 33 £5
69 @jonjac 32 £5
70 @dasman 31 £5
71 @WaveDrill 30 £5
72 @SidV79 29 £5
73 @Mudshark 28 £5
74 @Tannerboy 27 £5
75 @HENDRIK62 26 £5
76 @COBRA207 25 £5
77 @cenachav 24 £5
78 @SLANLEAT 23 £5
79 @_DJ_CALOZ_ 22 £5
80 @OXBOWLER 21 £5
81 @Holzmybeer 20 £5
82 @biggs10 19 £5
83 @LAZLO1 18 £5
84 @denise1967 17 £5
85 @onoo 16 £5
86 @DARWISH 15 £5
87 @johnfish1 14 £5
88 @TH4 13 £5
89 @ROCCO 12 £5
90 @The--Don 11 £5
91 @tomgoodun 10 £5
92 @dangerdai 9 £5
93 @jimmyjazze 8 £5
94 @Gonner69 7 £5
95 @bje_89 6 £5
96 @DEVILCARD 5 £5
97 @NEOPHYTE 4 £5
98 @port30 3 £5
99 @HugoBigone 2 £5
100 @ironman839 1 £5
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It didn't work.
Emailed support about it, before my session, with screenshot.
They say its a problem my end (usual rubbish about clearing the cache and cookies - which hasnt worked of course) and are unable to transfer me over to my chosen league despite the evidence and timings which can be checked by the email times.
Why are there sooooo many software and bug issues with this site?!
Can you bump this to someone in the tech depo please Tikay?
I believe the Sky Suits are already aware, as your e-Mail would have been passed to them, & the advice the reply contained would have come from them & relayed to you by CC. A little harsh to call it "rubbish" imo, but you are entitled to your view. I know of players who have successfully changed Leagues, & note that @Allan23 who thought he had a problem had actually managed it perfectly.
Unfortunately, the Staff cannot change it for you - if they could, they would. My advice - FWIW, (probably very little), is to stay where you are until this week ends then try again after Midnight on Sunday, because if you change now, all your points from yesterday & today would be "wiped".
So many software bugs & issues? Yes, I think we all know that it has a few, let's call them idiosyncrasies. I'm afraid that there's a limit to fixing some of these until the new software arrives, as I may have explained previously. (No, sorry, I don't know when that will be). A wise & elderly man - not me, obviously - once said that if folks want super sexy software they join 'Stars, not Sky. And he was right, it's like a Rolls Royce. The problem is that it's almost impossible for players like us to win there, as we are playing against folks using HEM & over 130 (no exaggeration) other bits of Third Party Software. They know what we will do next in a given situation better then we do & before we do, so it's mighty tough to be a winner there. But here on Sky Poker there are really good promotions, a first class CC service, a forum where our questions all get answered promptly, &, relatively speaking, it's much easier to make a profit at Sky Poker. I never agreed with him of course, just saying what he told me.
It's a matter of balance I suppose, Jack Spratt & his wife.
I'm sorry I can't be more helpful.
I am also a winning player on stars without an HEM, it's not that hard to be a winner there if you know what you are doing, but yes, it is harder.
It's ever so frustrating - I will try again on Sunday night, but I expect the same thing to happen, so I will be stuck in this league now.
You say the customer service is top notch but I have to disagree i'm afraid, in my experience it is pretty slow and problems do not get fixed (software issue still not fixed, and now this - again not fixed), and they are forever telling me to clear my cookies and cache and not accepting there is a problem.
You though, (and this forum in general) is/are awesome - I will give you that kind sir!
They do come out with some nonsense, including the cookies thing - I remember having a 30 minute argument with a CC member of staff a few years back on here about whether 8/15 was longer than 1/2 for Sky Bet promo eligibility, and she was so stubborn that she refused to pass me on to anyone else because she was SO convinced that 8/15 was less than 1/2 and she just wasn't having any of it lol.
However, they really aren't that bad compared to some. If you go onto some of the smaller Casinos, Sportsbooks or Poker sites, there's some woeful CC out there. Sky CC is meh but they're probs still in the top 3 of UK bookies/casinos/Poker sites I've played on just because everywhere else is hopeless.
Trust me, once you've signed up to one of the smaller European casino sites where the CC staff are 2/3 people, none of whom speak English particularly well, and any text that isn't written manually by the CC staff appears in Norwegian (including anything they copy and paste!), you'll realise just how (comparatively) 'good' Sky's CC really are. Yep, that happened to me...
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Part of the reason why most UK gambling sites have poor CC IMO is that sites will be hiring CC staff that are unfamiliar with the gambling industry - This is probably out of necessity because CC type jobs have crazy staff turnover and there's not exactly people queuing up to do that kind of job unless they're desperate for money and they have absolutely no other options. When you consider those things, it's no wonder that CC is awful pretty much anywhere you look.
Although it's far more noticeable in the gambling industry in my experience, it's not limited to the gambling industry either - I've got the 'pleasure' of having to speak to all of my utility providers to cancel contracts before moving next month, and it reminded me just how bad customer care teams are in all industries once you deviate from something that is in the 10% of situations that come up that they are (barely) trained to deal with, or their 'checklist' of things they have to do in certain situations.
I gave 30 days cancellation notice for my ISP the other day, gave the reason that "I'm going to University next month and all my utilities are included in the rent so I don't need your product any more", and they STILL tried to upsell me products with a discount hoping that I wouldn't cancel. I'm also waiting for the inevitable, standard call from Sky TV in a couple of weeks offering me a discount if I renew my TV package instead of leaving. No common sense whatsoever.
Good customer service (e.g. Stars pre-Amaya) is the exception rather than the norm nowadays, unfortunately. At least we're lucky enough to have the forum here for certain issues, not that customer care is its intended purpose.
^^^^
Overall, that's not an unreasonable view of CC in the Gaming Industry.
Note this in particular, which I will return to later;
"Good customer service (e.g. Stars pre-Amaya) is the exception rather than the norm nowadays"
And how were they able to do it so well? Simple - they only sold ONE product - poker.
So all the Staff were trained exclusively to deal with poker.
I've never used 'Stars CC - in fact I've never used any CC, for better or worse as I have a high tolerance to life's trifling annoyances - but now of course, they sell a multitude of Products, so it's much harder to have specialist one-size-fits-all Staff.
Part of the reason why most UK gambling sites have poor CC IMO is that sites will be hiring CC staff that are unfamiliar with the gambling industry - This is probably out of necessity because CC type jobs have crazy staff turnover and there's not exactly people queuing up to do that kind of job......
As chance happens, Gill, my young lady, was made redundant recently, & ended up getting a job with CC for Bet365 in Stoke.
What does she know about Gaming Products? Zilch. Her Gaming experience is once a year on Grand National Day, "I'd like to bet on the grey one please".
And so they gave her - & all other new inductees to CC at Bet 365 - a 10 week Training Course. 10 weeks.
So now, she trots out gaming expressions like a parrot. Rule 4, Accas, dead-heat rules, what is the quick way to work out 11/8 in your head?, Verification, etc.
Does she really understand any of those things though? Of course note. She has a crib sheet in front of her, & a Supervisor on hand nearby.
Imagine the cost of 10 weeks training on full wages for staff who are inclined to have a high turnover rate. Being at the end of a 'phone to irate, angry & often rude Customers ain't a lot of fun, especially as the Staff have to work unsocial hours - weekends, nights, Bank Holidays etc. So yes, the Staff come & go at a fair clip.
Incidentally, Bet365 have a poker site of sorts, but Gill never received any training for Poker, she only knows what I taught her. There you go, volley that one in......
The sheer volume of CC - via 'phone, e-mail, chat, even Twitter - is enormous. A business like SB&G will take several thousand enquiries/complaints every day, & on busy days that can multiply. Each & every week they get tens of thousands of contacts.
So it's very much a volume business.
Almost all of them are nothing to do with Poker, they are Sports Betting or Vegas enquiries. A pure estimate, but I'd suggest in excess of 99.9% of all contacts to SB&G are non poker related. (In fact Bet might just be over 100 times bigger than Poker). How many poker contacts are there daily? I've actually no idea, but I would take good money it rarely exceeds 10 per day, sometimes far less. There was a Stats dispute on a football game recently, the Betting Companies take a feed from OPTA & OPTA got it wrong. Many hundreds of complaints poured in within a 5 minute period. Sky Poker probably don't generate that many Contacts in a month.
So to have staff trained specifically in poker is not really practical or cost-efficient. Imagine the cost of providing 24/7 cover exclusively for poker. To cover that & assuming 3 x 8.5 hour shifts (to allow for handover), then meal breaks, holidays, 40 hour working week etc needs 5 full time staff. What's that? - 5 x £30,000 (a pure guess, I've no idea what the salary is), plus overhead costs, so call it £200,000 per year? Which is fine if needed, but can we really expect a dedicated poker CC Agent to be sat there 24/7 doing a crossword, watching TV or doing their knitting? For sure, they would have nothing to do for almost the entirety of their shift. It just does not make sense to do that.
So no, the CC staff are not poker-specialist, though they do receive training for the poker questions. But as they very rarely get asked to deal with poker specialist stuff, fair to say that they may not be as up to speed as we might wish.
There's something called the Pareto Principle to consider, too;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_principle
Which, in this case, means 80% of the Contacts come from 20% of the Client base.
Sky Poker want & try to do things better and it always hurts when they come up short. And they often do. I think some understanding of the difficulty of the task helps though, hence my banging on & on. Again.
Honestly, clearing your cache & cookies is almost certainly the answer, & Sky Poker can't do that for you, it's your end. And that's not the advice of Customer Care, that comes direct from the Poker Team, as I've discussed it at length with them today.
I would strongly recommend you try that next Monday.