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Bluff lines. Help me make people fold?

DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
edited March 2013 in The Poker Clinic


Any thoughts/common mistakes here?

1)
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
fringe107 Small blind  £0.15 £0.15 £43.90
MLBOY Big blind  £0.30 £0.45 £18.60
 Your hole cards
  • Q
  • 9
   
tatohead Fold     
amery08 Fold     
DOHHHHHHH Raise  £0.90 £1.35 £83.91
fringe107 Raise  £3.00 £4.35 £40.90
MLBOY Fold     
DOHHHHHHH Call  £2.25 £6.60 £81.66
Flop
  
  • 2
  • Q
  • A
   
fringe107 Bet  £3.90 £10.50 £37.00
DOHHHHHHH Call  £3.90 £14.40 £77.76
Turn
  
  • 10
   
fringe107 Bet  £8.10 £22.50 £28.90
DOHHHHHHH Call  £8.10 £30.60 £69.66
River
  
  • 8
   
fringe107 Check     
DOHHHHHHH Bet  £26.10 £56.70 £43.56
fringe107 Call  £26.10 £82.80 £2.80
DOHHHHHHH Show
  • Q
  • 9
   
fringe107 Show
  • 8
  • 8
   
fringe107 Win Three 8s £81.00  £83.80
2)
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
tatohead Small blind  £0.15 £0.15 £30.52
coombes01 Big blind  £0.30 £0.45 £30.25
 Your hole cards
  • 3
  • 3
   
ClickItBak Fold     
DOHHHHHHH Raise  £0.90 £1.35 £29.10
megafish Fold     
Lambert180 Fold     
tatohead Fold     
coombes01 Call  £0.60 £1.95 £29.65
Flop
  
  • 6
  • 6
  • 8
   
coombes01 Bet  £1.20 £3.15 £28.45
DOHHHHHHH Call  £1.20 £4.35 £27.90
Turn
  
  • 2
   
coombes01 Bet  £1.50 £5.85 £26.95
DOHHHHHHH Raise  £4.50 £10.35 £23.40
coombes01 Call  £3.00 £13.35 £23.95
River
  
  • 8
   
coombes01 Check     
DOHHHHHHH Bet  £9.00 £22.35 £14.40
coombes01 Call  £9.00 £31.35 £14.95
DOHHHHHHH Show
  • 3
  • 3
   
coombes01 Show
  • J
  • J
   
coombes01 Win Two Pairs, Jacks and 8s £29.78  £44.73
3)

PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
fringe107 Small blind  £0.15 £0.15 £54.15
DOHHHHHHH Big blind  £0.30 £0.45 £64.36
 Your hole cards
  • A
  • 7
   
stacker59 Fold     
Lambert180 Raise  £0.90 £1.35 £40.49
shawsok Fold     
fringe107 Fold     
DOHHHHHHH Call  £0.60 £1.95 £63.76
Flop
  
  • J
  • 3
  • 10
   
DOHHHHHHH Check     
Lambert180 Bet  £1.20 £3.15 £39.29
DOHHHHHHH Raise  £3.90 £7.05 £59.86
Lambert180 Raise  £8.20 £15.25 £31.09
DOHHHHHHH All-in  £59.86 £75.11 £0.00
Lambert180 All-in  £31.09 £106.20 £0.00
DOHHHHHHH Unmatched bet  £23.27 £82.93 £23.27
DOHHHHHHH Show
  • A
  • 7
   
Lambert180 Show
  • Q
  • Q
   
Turn
  
  • 8
   
River
  
  • 3
   
Lambert180 Win Two Pairs, Queens and 3s £81.13  £81.13


4)
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
megafish Small blind  £0.15 £0.15 £18.18
Lambert180 Big blind  £0.30 £0.45 £36.96
coombes01 Sit out     
 Your hole cards
  • 8
  • K
   
tatohead Fold     
ClickItBak Fold     
DOHHHHHHH Raise  £0.90 £1.35 £42.37
megafish Fold     
Lambert180 Raise  £2.40 £3.75 £34.56
DOHHHHHHH Call  £1.80 £5.55 £40.57
Flop
  
  • J
  • 6
  • 8
   
Lambert180 Bet  £3.20 £8.75 £31.36
DOHHHHHHH Call  £3.20 £11.95 £37.37
Turn
  
  • 10
   
Lambert180 Check     
DOHHHHHHH Bet  £7.00 £18.95 £30.37
Lambert180 Call  £7.00 £25.95 £24.36
River
  
  • 2
   
Lambert180 Check     
DOHHHHHHH All-in  £30.37 £56.32 £0.00
Lambert180 All-in  £24.36 £80.68 £0.00
DOHHHHHHH Unmatched bet  £6.01 £74.67 £6.01
Lambert180 Show
  • A
  • A
   
DOHHHHHHH Show
  • 8
  • K
   
Lambert180 Win Pair of Aces £72.87  £72.87
5)

PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
RD10 Small blind  £0.15 £0.15 £96.13
bet3pm_co Sitout     
shawsok Big blind  £0.30 £0.45 £40.81
 Your hole cards
  • 10
  • 7
   
who_me Fold     
wudibluff Raise  £0.90 £1.35 £42.14
DOHHHHHHH Call  £0.90 £2.25 £29.62
RD10 Call  £0.75 £3.00 £95.38
shawsok Fold     
Flop
  
  • 6
  • 3
  • 2
   
RD10 Check     
wudibluff Bet  £1.80 £4.80 £40.34
DOHHHHHHH Call  £1.80 £6.60 £27.82
RD10 Fold     
Turn
  
  • 2
   
wudibluff Bet  £3.30 £9.90 £37.04
DOHHHHHHH Call  £3.30 £13.20 £24.52
River
  
  • A
   
wudibluff Bet  £8.70 £21.90 £28.34
DOHHHHHHH All-in  £24.52 £46.42 £0.00
wudibluff Call  £15.82 £62.24 £12.52
wudibluff Show
  • 5
  • A
   
DOHHHHHHH Show
  • 10
  • 7
   
wudibluff Win Two Pairs, Aces and 2s £60.44  £72.96


6,348 lost count
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
DOHHHHHHH Small blind  £0.15 £0.15 £36.79
bet3pm_co Big blind  £0.30 £0.45 £41.28
 Your hole cards
  • 4
  • 4
   
denty765 Fold     
vinnybhoy Raise  £0.90 £1.35 £29.55
wudibluff Fold     
frankie700 Fold     
DOHHHHHHH Call  £0.75 £2.10 £36.04
bet3pm_co Fold     
Flop
  
  • 8
  • 10
  • 3
   
DOHHHHHHH Check     
vinnybhoy Check     
Turn
  
  • 9
   
DOHHHHHHH Bet  £1.20 £3.30 £34.84
vinnybhoy Raise  £2.40 £5.70 £27.15
DOHHHHHHH Raise  £5.40 £11.10 £29.44
vinnybhoy Call  £4.20 £15.30 £22.95
River
  
  • A
   
DOHHHHHHH Bet  £9.90 £25.20 £19.54
vinnybhoy All-in  £22.95 £48.15 £0.00
DOHHHHHHH Fold     
vinnybhoy Muck     
vinnybhoy Win  £33.34  £33.34
vinnybhoy Return  £13.05 £1.76 £46.39
Can u help me ? :(

Comments

  • TPTP123TPTP123 Member Posts: 492
    edited March 2013
    probably.. yeah.. but you'll need to edit out some villains names first!!! 

    I are mr bruff. 
  • sam64sam64 Member Posts: 11
    edited March 2013
    (Ryanc7) Go back to basics. If your going to bluff every single time oppo shows the slightest bit of weakness you become pretty easy to play against. 33 = perfect spot to flat turn in my opinion don't know table dynamics but its pretty clear he's trying to get to showdown cheap no need to spew off. Flat less 3 bets - do you flat evey 3 bet as long as you have position? K8 is not a hand I like to flat against 3 bets particularly against lambert - not - no offence - but his 3 bet range crushes all Kx as pop he will only 3 bet u wig about 8 hands lol. If u had 45 I would honor u but K8 is never good. Try to have pre flop control more, maintain aggression, call less, don't spew 3 streets against stations, play a strategy game and play less tables until you understand how to play it. Watch gripsed videos on YouTube. His low limit game is excellent. 
  • BorinLonerBorinLoner Member Posts: 3,863
    edited March 2013
    On the second hand you have to think about your range as the pre-flop raiser and what you would do with the strong hands in that range. You also have to think about a pre-flop caller's range generally, as well as this player's range for then leading out on this flop:

    As the pre-flop raiser there will be fewer two-spade hands in your perceived range than in the caller's range. So when he donks into you on the flop and you flat, you're not really repping a flush draw - Not only are they a small portion of your range but you'd also be likely to raise a donk-bet with them. When you flat, it doesn't make sense for that draw. When you flat it looks like a made hand. i.e. a pair. (Reads on your opponent might mean that you would flat with a draw but when you're trying to rep that draw later in the hand, you need your opponent to be aware that you would flat the flop against them. You also need them to be able to fold their hand with that read in mind)

    Now when you raise the turn it looks weird. This line makes little sense for a pair because you wouldn't raise when the draw comes in, you don't have that many flush draws in your pre-flop range and you didn't play the flop like you had one. So it doesn't make alot of sense for you to have that flush. You wouldn't be waiting for the flush draw to come in before raising some raggy 6 and you wouldn't raise an 8 at all.

    Now the board double-pairs on the river and you suddenly want to rep an 8 or 6? Would you value bet here with a flush given the opponent's line? It looks like you're changing your mind all over the place.

    To be fair you probably get this through if your opponent doesn't have JJ. Considering the way this hand played, this guy is probably just a bad guy to try to bluff.
  • BorinLonerBorinLoner Member Posts: 3,863
    edited March 2013
    I'm not going to chastise you for playing a wide range of hands, in position. I'd agree that K8 isn't a good hand to call 3-bets with, especially if the 3-better has a tight range, but generally your game will benefit more from being a bit flairy and teaching yourself what you can get away with.

    I will say that you don't need to turn value hands into bluffs as often as you seem to. You can just play marginal value hands as bluff catchers if you think oppo has a wide range. That's likely to be more profitable then trying to push them off a fairly narrow range. If oppo has a narrow range, don't play marginal hands. Play big hands and big drawing hands and be happy to give up when your equity is poor.
  • Lambert180Lambert180 Member Posts: 12,197
    edited March 2013
    Love how people still think I'm a nit!

    You should have seen what I 5bet jammed pre with Evil Pingu with earlier :)
  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited March 2013
    stop bluffing !
  • NColleyNColley Member Posts: 1,178
    edited March 2013
    Hand 2 if your gonna bluff then bet it like a man. I wouldn't fold anything that's ahead of 33 vs those sizings.

    Hand 3 is joke bad vs a reg totally overplayed. Call the 3bet and give yourself some options. He gave you a very nice price.
  • Lambert180Lambert180 Member Posts: 12,197
    edited March 2013
    In Response to Re: Bluff lines. Help me make people fold?:
    Hand 2 if your gonna bluff then bet it like a man. I wouldn't fold anything that's ahead of 33 vs those sizings. Hand 3 is joke bad vs a reg totally overplayed. Call the 3bet and give yourself some options. He gave you a very nice price.
    Posted by NColley
    FWIW, the reason I went smaller with my flop 3bet is cos I think Doh will 4bet ship any hands with decent equity including TP hands here cos he doesn't like to give up on a hand, if there's a way he can win it, and I think if I go much bigger I'll put him off doing it.
  • KING2600KING2600 Member Posts: 69
    edited March 2013
    Is this not maybe a case of you giving your opponents too much credit in some cases?
  • GREGHOGGGREGHOGG Member Posts: 7,155
    edited March 2013
    Dohhhhhhh just likes to advertise that he does this sort of thing so next time you call, he will have the nuts imo


  • beanehbeaneh Member Posts: 4,079
    edited March 2013
    1 fold turn
    2 fold flop
    3 wp he played it worse, I prefer a c/c on flop but w/e
    4 check turn you rep a bluff with a weak pair. 
    5 I don't think is terrible by any means, though I doubt they often fold Ax, just fold river 
    6 don't lead the turn. have a reason for betting your hand, 3bet on turn is godawful.
  • pryce6pryce6 Member Posts: 1,058
    edited March 2013
    I think a lot of this is really really bad

    edit: I mean, really really really really bad
  • beanehbeaneh Member Posts: 4,079
    edited March 2013
    In Response to Re: Bluff lines. Help me make people fold?:
    I think a lot of this is really really bad edit: I mean, really really really really bad
    Posted by pryce6

    you missed out a couple of reallys.
  • TPTP123TPTP123 Member Posts: 492
    edited March 2013
    In Response to Re: Bluff lines. Help me make people fold?:
    1 fold turn 2 fold flop 3 wp he played it worse, I prefer a c/c on flop but w/e 4 check turn you rep a bluff with a weak pair.  5 I don't think is terrible by any means, though I doubt they often fold Ax, just fold river  6 don't lead the turn. have a reason for betting your hand, 3bet on turn is godawful.
    Posted by beaneh
    basically his saying loosen up a little
  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited March 2013

    Think I'm playing too many hands, not folding to 3bets enough, floating flops too much, bluffing turns and rivers too much and not folding on any post flop street anywhere near often enough.

    Shud be easy enough to fix :/

    ty all.
  • The_Don90The_Don90 Member Posts: 9,814
    edited March 2013
    In Response to Re: Bluff lines. Help me make people fold?:
    Think I'm playing too many hands, not folding to 3bets enough, floating flops too much, bluffing turns and rivers too much and not folding on any post flop street often enough. Shud be easy enough to fix :/ ty all.
    Posted by DOHHHHHHH
    Just fold till you have aces, 

    Then fold till you have sets

  • beanehbeaneh Member Posts: 4,079
    edited March 2013
    In Response to Re: Bluff lines. Help me make people fold?:
    In Response to Re: Bluff lines. Help me make people fold? : Just fold till you have aces,  Then fold till you have sets
    Posted by The_Don90

    congrats you'd fit in with the nl50/100 regs so well..

    though you forgot to mention to telegraph your hands postflop and play as robotically and consistantly terribly as possible.
  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited March 2013
    In Response to Re: Bluff lines. Help me make people fold?:
    In Response to Re: Bluff lines. Help me make people fold? : Just fold till you have aces,  Then fold till you have sets
    Posted by The_Don90
    Maybe somewhere between this approach and my current one Donald. 

    Will keep searching :)


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