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When a reg flat's your 4 bet - peril!

rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
edited April 2013 in The Poker Clinic
What do you guy's think of this, I am 150bb deep
My card's don't matter, just wondered on peoples views when oppo's flat your 4 bet
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
JiDongWon Small blind   £0.15 £0.15 £30.68
snowy8016 Big blind   £0.30 £0.45 £10.03
  Your hole cards        
rancid Raise   £0.90 £1.35 £44.95
daz1owls22 Fold        
x Raise   £3.00 £4.35 £53.89
JiDongWon Fold        
snowy8016 Fold        
rancid Raise   £7.50 £11.85 £37.45
x Call   £5.40 £17.25 £48.49
Flop
   
  • 3
  • 2
  • J
     
rancid
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Comments

  • jugglegeekjugglegeek Member Posts: 623
    edited April 2013
    My guess is that he has aces. His standard line would be to 5bet but since he knows that you are likely to be 4betting from UTG extremely tight he figures you are unlikely to give him any more money from you pre-flop. From your previous comments on the forum you might just get away from kings if you are five bet in this spot. He thinks that if you have QQ/KK you will almost certainly bet at the flop.

    That said, if you do have kings then bet at the flop and go broke. It's a cooler.
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  • Lambert180Lambert180 Member Posts: 12,197
    edited April 2013
    Rancid isn't folding KK pre 150xBB deep unless it's V a nit reg imo, and rightly so.
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  • NColleyNColley Member Posts: 1,178
    edited April 2013
    In Response to Re: When a reg flat's your 4 bet - peril!:
    your so deepso if opponent had aces he would 5 bet min raise to get it in i dnt think its aces could be qq tho or ak 
    Posted by IDONKCALLU
    well you just told everyone how to exploit you with AA then.
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  • percival09percival09 Member Posts: 3,804
    edited April 2013
    peeling 4bet is fine if he balances well
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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited April 2013
    In Response to Re: When a reg flat's your 4 bet - peril!:
    peeling 4bet is fine if he balances well
    Posted by percival09
     I'd say balance in this spot isn't that relevant unless they play a massive amount of hands v each other

    Flatting 4b not necessarily terrible ip 150 deep

    I'd say he could have JJ+, AK maybe a bit wider
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  • huuuuumehuuuuume Member Posts: 569
    edited April 2013

    what do you think villain is 3betting with? 

    they have position, decent value to call, and you are both deep.  i think the range you credit them depends massively on what you think they will 3bet with in the first place. 

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  • KKripplerKKrippler Member Posts: 321
    edited April 2013
    Depends on description of oppo.

    Is he a reg or rec?

    Do you have any history?

    Whats his style of play?

    In my experience, most (not all) will 5bet AA/KK, so this could be AK or 1010/JJ/QQ. 

    If its 1010/JJ/QQ, I think they will get it in on a low flop. 

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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited April 2013
    Thanks for response's

    Do we really think that being 150bb deep is justication to call

    Surely if oppo is flatting my 4 bet then they must put a high persentage of bluffs and depolarised hands in my range to make it profitable
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  • huuuuumehuuuuume Member Posts: 569
    edited April 2013
    In Response to Re: When a reg flat's your 4 bet - peril!:
    Thanks for response's Do we really think that being 150bb deep is justication to call Surely if oppo is flatting my 4 bet then they must put a high persentage of bluffs and depolarised hands in my range to make it profitable
    Posted by rancid
    it depends what villain thinks your 4bet range is. 
    depends if villain is capable of assigning a range when you make the 4bet
    depends if you're up against one of those players who will never fold a pair pre flop etc

    sometimes players don't put a great deal of thought into what they're doing...at 30nl there are going to be plenty of players who dont think much further than what they're hand is
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  • DonttelmumDonttelmum Member Posts: 1,921
    edited April 2013
    What did you have, and what did he have?  Finish the story :-)
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited April 2013
    In Response to Re: When a reg flat's your 4 bet - peril!:
    What did you have, and what did he have?  Finish the story :-)
    Posted by Donttelmum
    Not much of a story but I had AK and oppo had 10's

    o yeah can I have some of my money back please, you been running too good v me latley )
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  • DonttelmumDonttelmum Member Posts: 1,921
    edited April 2013
    Just note down your bank details and I'll send you a transfer :-)
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  • donkeyplopdonkeyplop Member Posts: 3,795
    edited April 2013
    I flatted your 4 bet yesterday as I know you are capable of bluffing it off ;)
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited April 2013
    In Response to Re: When a reg flat's your 4 bet - peril!:
    I flatted your 4 bet yesterday as I know you are capable of bluffing it off ;)
    Posted by donkeyplop

    Think your theory is mis guided when you slow rolls set's )

    Flatting 4 bet's must be in a new book on how to exploit yoself, which I haven't read yet !
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  • donkeyplopdonkeyplop Member Posts: 3,795
    edited April 2013
    I wasn't slow rolling as I hate that, but agree with the rest as i'm a bit rusty as have come back from 4ish months off.
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited April 2013
    In Response to Re: When a reg flat's your 4 bet - peril!:
    I wasn't slow rolling as I hate that, but agree with the rest as i'm a bit rusty as have come back from 4ish months off.
    Posted by donkeyplop
    If I confused enough then I done my job )

    IDK maybe unbalancing is the new way forward, everyone's talking about optimum versus exploitative - think unorthdox is the new 5 bet light D
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