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Passive AK mc nl10 - result

rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
edited September 2013 in The Poker Clinic


vill is reg at level and has a little bit of game but pretty straight forward mostly

I played it passive but anyone feel like folding

you can all guess what vill hand, I'll reveal later


Hand History #686188183 (23:43 01/09/2013)

PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
Donttelmum Small blind   £0.05 £0.05 £22.95
x Big blind   £0.10 £0.15 £30.63
  Your hole cards
  • K
  • A
     
GREGHOGG Fold        
rancid Raise   £0.30 £0.45 £46.42
IDONKCALLU Call   £0.30 £0.75 £27.19
Donttelmum Fold        
x Raise   £0.70 £1.45 £29.93
rancid Call   £0.50 £1.95 £45.92
IDONKCALLU Call   £0.50 £2.45 £26.69
Flop
   
  • J
  • 7
  • Q
     
x Check        
rancid Check        
IDONKCALLU Check        
Turn
   
  • 10
     
x Bet   £1.30 £3.75 £28.63
rancid Raise   £3.80 £7.55 £42.12
IDONKCALLU Fold        
x Call   £2.50 £10.05 £26.13
River
   
  • 6
     
x Check        
rancid Bet   £5.80 £15.85 £36.32
x Raise   £12.00 £27.85 £14.13
rancid

Comments

  • BorinLonerBorinLoner Member Posts: 3,863
    edited September 2013
    What's the villain's 3-betting range pre-flop and what does he flat 4-bets or 5-bet with versus us?

    Raise bigger on the turn. So much value on that board..

    On the river, what does a straightforward opponent check-raise? I think he check-calls everything we beat that doesn't 3-bet the turn and probably doesn't call the raise on the turn with any air. So we're beat and should fold... I call to see it. :)
  • Lambert180Lambert180 Member Posts: 12,197
    edited September 2013
    pwnnnnd, must be some kinda of wizard to turn a set into a bluff there
  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited September 2013
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10:
    pwnnnnd, must be some kinda of wizard to turn a set into a bluff there
    Posted by Lambert180

    Now your being silly, but I never have str or the flush do I
  • LnarinOOLnarinOO Member Posts: 545
    edited September 2013
    my intial thought would be AA or KK most probaly the later- checking the flop 3ways rather then bloatin vs 2 opponents, on a flop which has crushed their pre flop calling range- i dont no how balanced villain is or his general thought process- but if he is straightforward like you say then 99 or 10-10 would also be in his range here-
    its too deep for him to c/r gii with 9-10hh - or somethin similar so would have thought he'd cbet all of these-
    as to folding- naaaaaa cant win ever if we fold and too much of the time we're good-
    as for villans hand id say somewhere in the region of A-10hh
  • gazza127gazza127 Member Posts: 2,156
    edited September 2013
    Villain is repping the flush.  Does he do it well?  No, not really.

    Villains play is really confusing.  He's 3 bet pre.  If we assume he has 2 hearts why is he not betting the flop when his equity is highest and he can take the pot down uncontested?  He then decides to lead the turn when his equity drops and calls a raise (I go slightly bigger on the raise).  Then he C/R river when flush comes in.  Mega wierd play from villain.

    If he's got the flush, he's played it very wierd.  I find a call here the vast majority of the time.  You say he's got a 'straight forward game mostly' - ergo if he 3 bets and flops flush draw, he bets.

    I think oppo either has air, has massivley overrepped 2 pair or a set, or has seen the river come in and has decided you don't have the flush as you raised the turn and has tried to bluff you off your hand.

    I call.

    EDIT - really hope im not villain
  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr Member Posts: 8,036
    edited September 2013
    Strangely played AKh? I still call the river, I just have to see it.
  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited September 2013
    some people mention raise more on turn - why ?
  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited September 2013
    I fold :( villians shows set of 10's - I didn't really think the hand through at the time, it's going to be the minority vill has the flush so I should call

    really don't know if vill is value raising or bluffing though, would be intresting to hear his thoughts


    plus he shows me and i am like wtf u showing me for --- rubz ---

    wp gg

  • Lambert180Lambert180 Member Posts: 12,197
    edited September 2013
    I was joking when I said he was a wizard turning a set into a bluff.

    I'd bet anything it wsa a value raise, but that's the problem cos he can't get called by worse imo.
  • craigcu12craigcu12 Member Posts: 3,960
    edited September 2013
    when I raised on the river I sort of did it as a value bet in one way but what it was also used for is as a way of seeing weather or not you would think if I bet the chances are I have a decent hand.

    as for the reason I show you well that was as an attempt to make callers more likely when I do hit the flushes.
  • Lambert180Lambert180 Member Posts: 12,197
    edited September 2013
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10 - result:
    when I raised on the river I sort of did it as a value bet in one way but what it was also used for is as a way of seeing weather or not you would think if I bet the chances are I have a decent hand. as for the reason I show you well that was as an attempt to make callers more likely when I do hit the flushes.
    Posted by craigcu12
    In any given situation there are 2 reasons to raise

    1) You get called by worse hands (value)

    2) You make better hands fold (bluff)

    You're never getting a call from worse hands and I would have said you won't make better fold but here we are looking at you having done that lol. I wouldn't make a habit of bluffing with sets tho.
  • offshootoffshoot Member Posts: 1,049
    edited September 2013
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10:
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10 : Now your being silly, but I never have str or the flush do I
    Posted by rancid
    Feel like you have a straight nearly always on the turn.
  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited September 2013
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10:
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10 : Feel like you have a straight nearly always on the turn.
    Posted by offshoot

    yh i was being sarcastic - min i have straight so........hence it looked that way so i folded



    I would like to actually prefer to give credit to vill for blowing me off my hand

  • offshootoffshoot Member Posts: 1,049
    edited September 2013
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10:
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10 : yh i was being sarcastic - min i have straight so........hence it looked that way so i folded I would like to actually prefer to give credit to vill for blowing me off my hand
    Posted by rancid
    I think you're being very generous.
  • DrSharpDrSharp Member Posts: 1,213
    edited September 2013
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10 - result:
    when I raised on the river I sort of did it as a value bet in one way but what it was also used for is as a way of seeing weather or not you would think if I bet the chances are I have a decent hand. as for the reason I show you well that was as an attempt to make callers more likely when I do hit the flushes.
    Posted by craigcu12
    Were you range merging?
  • craigcu12craigcu12 Member Posts: 3,960
    edited September 2013
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10 - result:
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10 - result : Were you range merging?
    Posted by DrSharp
    when he doesn't bet the flop I could see him doing a raise on the turn with many flush draw plus because I held the pair 1010 two pair using the 10 was unlikely so I did sense a straight and with the river i do find it easy with bluffs.
  • LnarinOOLnarinOO Member Posts: 545
    edited September 2013
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10 - result:
    In Response to Re: Passive AK mc nl10 - result : when he doesn't bet the flop I could see him doing a raise on the turn with many flush draw plus because I held the pair 1010 two pair using the 10 was unlikely so I did sense a straight and with the river i do find it easy with bluffs.
    Posted by craigcu12
    make such little sense tbh, ur not mergin or i doubt very much u knew he had a staight- u have to credibly rep the flush to 'find it easy with bluffs', but u dont... a striaght should not really be fldin here-ever.
  • BorinLonerBorinLoner Member Posts: 3,863
    edited September 2013
    I object to the description of villain as "straightforward", if he's check-raising the river with a set. lol

    Given reads I said I thought it was a fold. I would still say it's a fold if we think villain does play straightforward because he's repping precisely the flush. Saying rancid should never fold the river would seem to be ignoring his read, even if we now think his read was not great.

    Craig, I'd say that your play doesn't make a lot of sense for the reasons that others have touched on: You have a value hand and you don't need to bluff. If you give rancid a range of only hands that beat you, you shouldn't be raising the river because he shouldn't fold any of those hands, unless you know that he thinks you're a massive nit. In the absence of that information, you're just turning your TT into a bluff in a situation where it's unlikely that your opponent is going to fold better. He's certainly very unlikely to call with any worse, so it's not a value raise.

    ...but what do I know? You got him to fold so maybe you knew all of those things and just pwned him. :)
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