In Response to Re: S-Scope Relevance on Sky Poker for tournament grinders? : That's probably the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Posted by FlyingDagg
+1
No different from scoping someone once your DYM/HU game loads.
I don't subscribe but I use the free searches sometimes. I don't really put in the volume to justify subscription.
I find it especially useful in STTs/MTTs when an unknown LAG appears on your table to your left.
Very important to know whether LAG is a winning or losing player - generally the last thing you want is a winning LAG with position on you. Losing LAGs are usually very exploitable.
If the LAG is getting away without show downs it can take quite a few orbits to work out whether they are any good or not.
How are Bounty tournaments handled? With the exception of PKR and recently the various PokerStars clients, the Bounties each player won are not displayed in the tournament results. Hence we have no way of tracking the Bounty component of these tournaments. Therefore we just track the non bounty aspect of these tournaments. E.g. if a tournament is a $10+$1 buy in with $5 of the $10 buy in going to the Bounty pool, we will simply count the tournament as a $5+$0.5 tournament and only include the payouts that are based on finish positions. I think they should update this then! Cheers Don for putting me straight. I have deliberately not used ss as I play most of my poker on here and I just thought well its not a true reflection of the real results. Live and learn lol. Posted by a00rock
Thinking about this it could well put some players off playing on Sky if they believe they cant accurately scope their results!
In Response to Re: S-Scope Relevance on Sky Poker for tournament grinders? : +1 No different from scoping someone once your DYM/HU game loads. Posted by Lambert180
That's just as bad IMO. I don't have any problem with anyone doing so because it's completely allowed. I just think it shouldn't be
A fair few people use sky because they don't agree with HUDS and like how sky is HUD free, so how is SS any different from a HUD? OK, a HUD gives you far more stats and sharkscope is at least open for everyone to use albeit free users only getting a few searches. But they still give players an unfair advantage over REC's who may never heard of Sharkscope.
In Response to Re: S-Scope Relevance on Sky Poker for tournament grinders? : That's just as bad IMO. I don't have any problem with anyone doing so because it's completely allowed. I just think it shouldn't be A fair few people use sky because they don't agree with HUDS and like how sky is HUD free,so how is SS any different from a HUD? OK, a HUD gives you far more stats and sharkscope is at least open for everyone to use albeit free users only getting a few searches. But they still give players an unfair advantage over REC's who may never heard of Sharkscope. Posted by F_Ivanovic
think you negated your own argument
sharky's info is really limited, tells you nothing about how they play, and is just a crude barometer of profitabilty
it is also totally accessible to anyone, and requires no skill to interpret
there may be other reasons to ban it, but not sure this one is good enough
In Response to Re: S-Scope Relevance on Sky Poker for tournament grinders? : That's just as bad IMO. I don't have any problem with anyone doing so because it's completely allowed. I just think it shouldn't be A fair few people use sky because they don't agree with HUDS and like how sky is HUD free, so how is SS any different from a HUD? OK, a HUD gives you far more stats and sharkscope is at least open for everyone to use albeit free users only getting a few searches. But they still give players an unfair advantage over REC's who may never heard of Sharkscope. Posted by F_Ivanovic
Wide of the mark. You may as well say it's not fair that experienced players have an unfair advantage over novices. Any player new to Sky and the forums, or any other site for that matter, will eventually get to hear about SS and learn how to utilise it. SS does not tell me anything about a players style, range or betting patterns etc. Notes are far more useful in that respect. If you are refusing to use SS as a principle then that's your choice but not one that makes sense to me.
BTW I don't pay for SS and use it more to keep an eye on my stats although I will scope the occasional player if they are new to me.
DOHHHH even said that he thinks it increases his ROI by at least 2%. That's quite a lot for STT's. If a recreational player knew about SS would they want to play DOHHHH once they saw his graph? Probably not. But a lot of recreational players don't even know about SS.
That's completely different. Sharkscope is an outside influence which gives an advantage to those in the know. I imagine a lot less recreational players know about sharkscope than you think. Obviously those that visit forums will eventually hear about it but those that don't will never know.
What if HUD's were free to use and available for those to find them, would you then be OK with that? Even though a lot of players will still not even know anything about HUD's?
Where do we draw the line with how much an outside influence can increase your W/R to make it an unfair advantage?
I don't use shakrscope for game selection, or to 'bumhunt' as people may or may not describe it.
I use it to gain some edge on my opponents whilst readless. In turbo HU games, it often takes 4/5 games before you can pick reads up on the opponents through playing them, so any information I can have during those first few games is priceless and makes a big difference.
@ Tikay: I have no idea how we go about blocking/locking my sharkscope, so how is someone who doesn't even know about it going to be able to block their results? IMO it shoud be an "OPT IN" not a "OPT OUT" thing. That way everyone that is happy for their results to be public can do so and those that don't even know about sharkscope will no longer be at a disadvantage. Also, surely the fact that Sharkscope goves this option proves that the information can be useful? If not why bother having the option to block it?
@ DOHHHH: Like I said I don't have a problem with people using sharkscope whilst it's there. I just think it's an unfair advantage and there's no need for it!
Having said all this I'm not too sure how big of an advantage it can be. It's pretty easy to see once you're playing someone if they're competent or not. And I tend to err on the side of assuming a name I haven't seen before isn't a shark!
In Response to Re: S-Scope Relevance on Sky Poker for tournament grinders?: [QUOTE]@ Tikay: I have no idea how we go about blocking/locking my sharkscope, so how is someone who doesn't even know about it going to be able to block their results? IMO it shoud be an "OPT IN" not a "OPT OUT" thing. That way everyone that is happy for their results to be public can do so and those that don't even know about sharkscope will no longer be at a disadvantage. Also, surely the fact that Sharkscope goves this option proves that the information can be useful? If not why bother having the option to block it? @ DOHHHH: Like I said I don't have a problem with people using sharkscope whilst it's there. I just think it's an unfair advantage and there's no need for it! Having said all this I'm not too sure how big of an advantage it can be. It's pretty easy to see once you're playing someone if they're competent or not. And I tend to err on the side of assuming a name I haven't seen before isn't a shark! Posted by F_Ivanovic
Afternoon Officer Ivan.
Really, thats a matter you'd need to take up with Sharkscope, it is not within the remit or control of Sky Poker.
As to whether they are "useful", yes, they are, to those who know how to interpret them.
To others who have quoted SS stats, please note SS ONLY collates stats for SNG's & MTT's, NOT Cash Games, so placing too much reliance on those SS Stats is fraught with danger.
As a general rule, their stats are a good "rough & ready" guide to those who wish to use them in that knowledge. It is a Subscription model (pay-site) but costs literally pennnies per day.
Someone did read my post Fwiw, just to be clear.... I don't use shakrscope for game selection, or to 'bumhunt' as people may or may not describe it. I use it to gain some edge on my opponents whilst readless. In turbo HU games, it often takes 4/5 games before you can pick reads up on the opponents through playing them, so any information I can have during those first few games is priceless and makes a big difference. As u were..... Posted by DOHHHHHHH
That would be the most optimal & frequent use of Sharkscope. It's like a little "Runners & Riders" guide. Interpreted correctly, it is of some use, interpreted incorrectly, it is dangerous.
In the grand scheme of things, it will make very little difference to people's performance, but it is certainly a small advantage.
Comments
I find it especially useful in STTs/MTTs when an unknown LAG appears on your table to your left.
Very important to know whether LAG is a winning or losing player - generally the last thing you want is a winning LAG with position on you. Losing LAGs are usually very exploitable.
If the LAG is getting away without show downs it can take quite a few orbits to work out whether they are any good or not.
BTW I don't pay for SS and use it more to keep an eye on my stats although I will scope the occasional player if they are new to me.
Someone did read my post
Fwiw, just to be clear....
I don't use shakrscope for game selection, or to 'bumhunt' as people may or may not describe it.
I use it to gain some edge on my opponents whilst readless. In turbo HU games, it often takes 4/5 games before you can pick reads up on the opponents through playing them, so any information I can have during those first few games is priceless and makes a big difference.
As u were.....
Note that anyone can "block" or "lock" their Sharkscope, so that their results cannot be viewed or seen.
[QUOTE]@ Tikay: I have no idea how we go about blocking/locking my sharkscope, so how is someone who doesn't even know about it going to be able to block their results? IMO it shoud be an "OPT IN" not a "OPT OUT" thing. That way everyone that is happy for their results to be public can do so and those that don't even know about sharkscope will no longer be at a disadvantage. Also, surely the fact that Sharkscope goves this option proves that the information can be useful? If not why bother having the option to block it? @ DOHHHH: Like I said I don't have a problem with people using sharkscope whilst it's there. I just think it's an unfair advantage and there's no need for it! Having said all this I'm not too sure how big of an advantage it can be. It's pretty easy to see once you're playing someone if they're competent or not. And I tend to err on the side of assuming a name I haven't seen before isn't a shark!
Posted by F_Ivanovic
Afternoon Officer Ivan.
Really, thats a matter you'd need to take up with Sharkscope, it is not within the remit or control of Sky Poker.
As to whether they are "useful", yes, they are, to those who know how to interpret them.
To others who have quoted SS stats, please note SS ONLY collates stats for SNG's & MTT's, NOT Cash Games, so placing too much reliance on those SS Stats is fraught with danger.
As a general rule, their stats are a good "rough & ready" guide to those who wish to use them in that knowledge. It is a Subscription model (pay-site) but costs literally pennnies per day.
In the grand scheme of things, it will make very little difference to people's performance, but it is certainly a small advantage.