200nl river vs good reg

77Chris91

$200nl - Every player at the table is a reg. Game is only running because of a rake promo I think.

Villain is a good TAG Reg who doesn't get out of line much.

Pre - Decide to 3-bet as villain either folds or 4-bets OOP the majority of the time. (So ofc he flats this time lol)

Flop - Standard

Turn - Decided to flat to keep in all of his air/semi bluffs. Not really sure what my raising range looks like here.

River is a bit meh. AJ got there. Flushes got there. Call? Jam? fold? I think if I jam villain is gonna think I'm FOS the majority of the time.

CO 250.00
BTN 220.00 Js 7s

Pre - CO raises to 6.00 Hero raises to 17.00 CO calls. (Pot 37.00)

Flop - Jh 9c 6d    CO checks Hero checks

Turn - Jh 9c 6d 7d     CO bets 30.00 Hero calls 30.00. (Pot 97.00)
 
River -  Jh 9c 6d 7d Ad      CO bets 78.00 Hero folds.


Thoughts?

F_Ivanovic

Your turn thinking doesn't transpose to your river thinking. ie. You flat turn to keep his bluffs in but when he fires again on the river you decide to fold? So either you don't think his bluffs are firing again (in which case flatting turn to keep his bluffs in was bad) or his bluffs + weaker value hands are still betting river here in which case you should call. 

Personally I'm raising turn with this hand - other turn raises in my range might be some slow played flopped set, other 2 pr combos (some 97) + straights and then stuff like a few flush draws w/o a pair. (eg. KdQd then some ace high NFDs) Flatting range is flush draws w/a pair, Jx, 98, other 2 pairs (97, 67) and some sets still. 

grantorino

Is that villains standard betsizing? 

Raise turn for value imo

River tricky, I would call in game, really not sure though maybe leaning towards a fold, seems not a great card for him to fire

CraigSG1

I dont understand why after 3 betting pre we dont continue on the flop? Surely we do this with AA/KK and flops we miss such as AK. All hands we are repping pre.

After taking the c/c line on turn we are committed to calling the river I think as we have massively under repped our hand.

Dont think we can ever jam and get called by worse and folding seems like we are letting a lot of worse hands/bluffs off. Yes he could have AJ, back door flush but easily be repping flush/ace and have also AK/AQ and other worse two pairs.

grantorino

In Response to Re: 200nl river vs good reg:

I dont understand why after 3 betting pre we dont continue on the flop? Surely we do this with AA/KK and flops we miss such as AK. All hands we are repping pre. After taking the c/c line on turn we are committed to calling the river I think as we have massively under repped our hand. Dont think we can ever jam and get called by worse and folding seems like we are letting a lot of worse hands/bluffs off. Yes he could have AJ, back door flush but easily be repping flush/ace and have also AK/AQ and other worse two pairs.
Posted by CraigSG1

Why should we play TPNK the same as either an overpair or air?

77Chris91

GT - This particular reg bets larger in general than other regs. Looking back raising the turn may have been best as I rep a lot of air imo. 

Craig - Flop to me is a standard check back. Very hard to get value from worse hands. If I'm jamming the river it's as a bluff not for value. Also I'm pretty sure AK, AQ and worse 2 pairs are never betting this river. 

CraigSG1

In Response to Re: 200nl river vs good reg:

In Response to Re: 200nl river vs good reg : Why should we play TPNK the same as either an overpair or air?
Posted by grantorino

Shouldn't we be playing everything pretty much the same? If we check back and then call turn we are surely saying we have a weak hand with showdown value. Yes we improve on turn but im sure we check/call if turn is a brick also.

F_Ivanovic

In Response to Re: 200nl river vs good reg:

In Response to Re: 200nl river vs good reg : Shouldn't we be playing everything pretty much the same? If we check back and then call turn we are surely saying we have a weak hand with showdown value. Yes we improve on turn but im sure we check/call if turn is a brick also.
Posted by CraigSG1

We can't just bet flop 100% of the time because it's easy to exploit that. So sometimes we have to check - and what happens when we check? Our range becomes weaker. So to counter this we need to be checking some stronger hands OTF. TPWK is a good candidate because we don't get value from a lot of worse and we're happy to call a turn bet on a blank.