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Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?

scotty77scotty77 Member Posts: 4,970
edited January 2010 in Poker Chat
https://www.skypoker.com/secure/poker/sky_lobby/news/tom-dwan-staging-comeback

Online poker superstar Tom "durrrr" Dwan had been making the headlines in all the wrong ways during November, but a strong end to 2009 saw Durrrr recoup $ 2.7m during December.November saw Dwan play some of the biggest and most relentless high stakes sessions with online unknown 'Isildur1', the Swede who had arrived at the Full Tilt cash games with a bang. It was a brutal month for Dwan, who ended up dropping $ 2.6million alone in one week and almost $ 8m against Isildur and other opponents. Much to his credit though, Dwan moved down the limits and began the task of reinvigorating his online bankroll.Moving away from the usual $ 500/$ 1000 games, Durrrr dropped down to $ 50/$ 100 Pot Limit Omaha, with occasional heads-up matches at higher limits. The last week of December saw the online pro return to his old stomping ground though, after sitting at games with the likes of Brian Townsend, Hac "trex313" and Ilari "Ziigmund" Sahamies.After winning $ 124k at $ 100/$ 200 Pot Limit Omaha, he then moved up to play $ 300/$ 600 with Sahamies. They were soon joined by Townsend, Chau Giang and British pro Richard Ashby. Taking a $ 54k profit from those stakes, he then moved up to what would prove to be a very profitable session against Sahamies at the biggest limits. The two locked up in a match which eventually saw Dwan take over $ 500k from the Finn's bankroll, leaving Dwan up $ 730k for the night and $ 2.7m for the month.The early fears that November might have sent Dwan to poker obscurity seem to have been well and truly allayed, and with Patrik Antonius and Brian Hastings seemingly having put 'Isildur1' on the rail for now, perhaps 2010 will be see the continued resurgence of Tom Dwan.
Coming back from downswing cold deck vs a newcomer to the nosebleeds, plus watching said new comer hand it all to Phil Ivey and Antonius.  Dropping down to a level he hasn't played in years.  ON top of that destroying live cash games in the past year or so.  OMG can't wait for HSP.   To have Tom Dwans insight into poker for a day would be amazing, can you plz make this happen god???
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  • KnackersYaKnackersYa Member Posts: 468
    edited January 2010
    I voted no.

    Don't get me wrong, I love watching the guy play, especially with Hellmouth (man, Phil just SO wants Dwan's respect). The truly great players stand the test of time, and IMHO Dwan hasn't done that yet.
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  • stokefcstokefc Member Posts: 7,831
    edited January 2010
    mind boggling sums of money,and heres me working on site -10 degrees just to keep a roof over me head
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  • scotty77scotty77 Member Posts: 4,970
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    I voted no. Don't get me wrong, I love watching the guy play, especially with Hellmouth (man, Phil just SO wants Dwan's respect). The truly great players stand the test of time, and IMHO Dwan hasn't done that yet.
    Posted by KnackersYa
    In pure number of hands terms Dwan has almost certainly played more than Doyle.

    As variance doesn't care about time, and only the amount of hands played, then surely this is just as valid?
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  • KnackersYaKnackersYa Member Posts: 468
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever? : In pure number of hands terms Dwan has almost certainly played more than Doyle. As variance doesn't care about time, and only the amount of hands played, then surely this is just as valid?
    Posted by scotty77
    That's fair enough but, when you consider someone like Stu Ungar (not that I think Dwan has any of Stu's problems), time has to come into the equation somewhere.
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  • Seagull158Seagull158 Member Posts: 1,100
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever? : That's fair enough but, when you consider someone like Stu Ungar (not that I think Dwan has any of Stu's problems), time has to come into the equation somewhere.
    Posted by KnackersYa
    Stu Ungar
    Unarguably the best Gin Rummy player ever
    So good at Blackjack he was banned from most of the Vegas casinos
    Entered 30 Poker MTTs with buy in of $5000+ and WON TEN, (not cashed in ten but won ten)
    3 times WSOP main event winner
    3 times Superbowl of Poker winner

    Surely, nobody else even comes close to the best?

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  • stokefcstokefc Member Posts: 7,831
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever? : Stu Ungar Unarguably the best Gin Rummy player ever So good at Blackjack he was banned from most of the Vegas casinos Entered 30 Poker MTTs with buy in of $5000+ and WON TEN, (not cashed in ten but won ten) 3 times WSOP main event winner 3 times Superbowl of Poker winner Surely, nobody else even comes close to the best?
    Posted by Seagull158
    he was a genius but not very well liked in fact some poker pros were glad he died
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  • scotty77scotty77 Member Posts: 4,970
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever? : Stu Ungar Unarguably the best Gin Rummy player ever So good at Blackjack he was banned from most of the Vegas casinos Entered 30 Poker MTTs with buy in of $5000+ and WON TEN, (not cashed in ten but won ten) 3 times WSOP main event winner 3 times Superbowl of Poker winner Surely, nobody else even comes close to the best?
    Posted by Seagull158
    extremely impressive stats, but much smaller fields.  plus also the skill level at that time was less so.

    would be amazing to see how he would compete with players like Durrr, CTS, Brian Townsend, Cunningham, Raptor et al.
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  • timebomb10timebomb10 Member Posts: 202
    edited January 2010
    phil hellmuth said i wonder if he will be around in 5 years i just want to hope he is
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  • KnackersYaKnackersYa Member Posts: 468
    edited January 2010
    From what I've seen in his interviews etc. he'll be around a good while yet. Hope he is because he's a breath of fresh air.
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  • TommyDTommyD Member Posts: 4,389
    edited January 2010
    Two words:  Chip Reese
    Two more words:  Stu Ungar
    Another two words:  Johnny Moss

    and so on and so forth.

    Dwan's good, but this is like labelling Rooney or Ronaldo one of the greatest football players ever when they are halfway through their career.
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  • DeuceAK_47DeuceAK_47 Member Posts: 381
    edited January 2010

    On his A game i think Durrrr is probably one of the best ever but he apparently tilts way too much so IVEY has to be the best at the moment.(know1 on ftp wants to play ivey lately heads up apparently.)
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  • Seagull158Seagull158 Member Posts: 1,100
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever? : he was a genius but not very well liked in fact some poker pros were glad he died
    Posted by stokefc
    He was an arrogant brat who said "I want to destroy people at the poker table" but what's that got to do with it?
    He was a genius who won $100,000 by remembering and recalling the sequence of 3 decks of 52 cards. He stopped going to school at 12 and supported his mother and siblings by playing gin rummy in New York. He only started playing poker because nobody would play him at Gin Rummy and no casino would let him play Blackjack.

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  • jakallyjakally Member Posts: 421
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    Two words:  Chip Reese Two more words:  Stu Ungar Another two words:  Johnny Moss and so on and so forth. Dwan's good, but this is like labelling Rooney or Ronaldo one of the greatest football players ever when they are halfway through their career.
    Posted by TommyD

    I love the Stu Ungar story, but he played at a time when the games were undoubtedly easier, and the number of tourneys he won were relatively small, with small field sizes.
    However, given he was also the best Gin Rummy player of his time, it is almost certain he would have had the skill to have success in any era.
    As far as cash games go (and therefore comparing him with Dwan) he apparently spewed quite badly in these, and was often classed as a fish in the game, when he was playing with the best at the time.

    Johnny Moss played when the pool of players was very small - difficult to know how good he was.

    Chip Reese had success in both cash and tourneys over a period of 20 years +, including against modern day players - must be a strong case for him being as good as anyone.

    Great debate though - be interesting to see in 5 years time how many of Durrr, FullFlush, Isuldur etc... are still around.


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  • ACESOVER8sACESOVER8s Member Posts: 1,307
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever? : extremely impressive stats, but much smaller fields.  plus also the skill level at that time was less so. would be amazing to see how he would compete with players like Durrr, CTS, Brian Townsend, Cunningham, Raptor et al.
    Posted by scotty77
    I wouldn't say the skill level is higher now? in MTT terms they were virtually all pro that entered the WSOP back then rather than the bingo that is the main event nowadays. Much harder to win now??? Yes but only because of volume swamping skill... Not because players are more skillful now.

    Stu was probably the most talented player to touch a deck of cards. I'm not that sure Dwan was just cold decked for his loss against Isildur either, at NL holdem a lot of people are of the opinion Isi outplayed him
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  • KnackersYaKnackersYa Member Posts: 468
    edited January 2010
    Fair play to young Thomas, to overcome the massive variance that comes with high stakes HU play is pretty special.
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  • namesb0ndnamesb0nd Member Posts: 402
    edited January 2010
    he is my favourite player to watch,but not the best ever.Maybe one day we will call him that but at such a young age i dont think you can give him that title
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  • OMahonyOOMahonyO Member Posts: 1,883
    edited January 2010
    I saw durrrr drop as low as 25/50 nlhe in december.  5 tabling hu.

    As for durrrr being the best,  I dunno, quite possibly.  I dont like the daft way he rocks his head up and down when he is thinking, so I voted no.
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  • JingleMaJingleMa Member Posts: 1,319
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    I saw durrrr drop as low as 25/50 nlhe in december.  5 tabling hu. As for durrrr being the best,  I dunno, quite possibly.  I dont like the daft way he rocks his head up and down when he is thinking, so I voted no.
    Posted by OMahonyO
    Agreed! That's why I had to go for Jennifer Tilly.

    It's a close one I know, but just look up "Jennifer Tilly vs Patrick Antonius" on youtube and you can see why she's the best.
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  • NoseyBonkNoseyBonk Member Posts: 6,184
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    but just look up "Jennifer Tilly vs Patrick Antonius" on youtube and you can see why she's the best.
    Posted by JingleMa
    Another recommend watch - JT starred in a film called 'Bound' which - now correct me if I'm wrong - really shows off her poker skills.


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  • NoseyBonkNoseyBonk Member Posts: 6,184
    edited January 2010
    In Response to Re: Proof that Durrrr is the best ever?:
    .. <snip /> .. be interesting to see in 5 years time how many of Durrr, FullFlush, Isuldur etc... are still around.
    Posted by jakally
    Is Isuldur still around? ;-)

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