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General Question...RE: AK v PP

mrdaviesmrdavies Member Posts: 475
edited January 2015 in Strategy
Would you be happy to get a pocket pair all in pre vs AK all the time if you knew your oppenents hand was AK? (hypothetical question)

I just want to know opinions on AK.. and how they play it.

finding this question hard to word lol.. but few times last few days I have raised pre with say 99 10 JJ and have been re raised to the point were if I call and see a river of JJQ (providing it s not the JJ) etcc Im folding straight away, So if i put my opponent on AK - are you willing to flip and shove rather than calling say an extra 6 quid hoping to flop a set and if missing not really knowing where your at as a lot of people will fire AK 2-3 times!?

As it stated it is a flip majority of the time and although my 99 1010 has held up against AK / AQ on a few occassions it has obviously lost too.. im just wondering if maybe playing the pocket pairs aggressively will work in long run?

Ive lost myself in this post as ive found it hard to get accross what i mean but hopefully you get the jist !

(also there's the times when your wronf and your agasint AA KK QQ, but im trying to be specific to AK)
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  • UridiumUridium Member Posts: 25
    edited October 2014
    In Response to General Question...RE: AK v PP:
    Would you be happy to get a pocket pair all in pre vs AK all the time if you knew your oppenents hand was AK? (hypothetical question) 

    Even pocket deuces have a slight mathematical all-in edge over an opponent AK (both suited and unsuited), so yes it would be theoretically correct to allways go all in pre with any pocket pair if you knew your opponent had AK. But obviously the variance in playing that way would be massive.

    So if i put my opponent on AK - are you willing to flip and shove rather than calling say an extra 6 quid hoping to flop a set

    How can you ever put your opponent on AK with 100% certainty unless he exposes his cards to you (or you are clairvoyant)? If you knew that he really does have AK and you have say 100BB stacks then yes you should go all-in with any pocket pair as it would be mathemacially profitable in the long term. If you were playing a tournament then you may not want to take that high variance approach as you would often get knocked out, so going for post flop set mine would be a better option with a decent stack. Also if you and your opponent were playing a very large cash stack say 200-250bb you may not want to go all in becasue in the long run it would be unlikely that you would be in enough similar large stack situations to get your large losses back  with such a small edge.

    So in summary how "happy" you are to go all in with a PP if you know your opponent has AK really depends on stack size and whether you are in a tournament or cash.


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  • F_IvanovicF_Ivanovic Member Posts: 2,410
    edited October 2014
    Also if you "know" opponent has AK then rather than GII pre-flop as a slight favourite you can wait to see a non A'/K flop :)
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  • DTWBANDITDTWBANDIT Member Posts: 6,451
    edited October 2014


       50/50 imo
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  • Chris_McChris_Mc Member Posts: 1,340
    edited October 2014
    If it was AA then yes. 100% of the time. 
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  • shakinacesshakinaces Member Posts: 1,590
    edited October 2014
    If we're getting it in with low pairs (so it is all but 50/50), wouldn't that mean it'd be a long term losing play due to the rake?

    So set mine the low pairs / take Ivan's play to keep betting on a non A/K flop and take the flip when you get to (say) 88 upwards?
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  • neely0y0neely0y0 Member Posts: 25
    edited November 2014
    In Response to Re: General Question...RE: AK v PP:
    If we're getting it in with low pairs (so it is all but 50/50), wouldn't that mean it'd be a long term losing play due to the rake? So set mine the low pairs / take Ivan's play to keep betting on a non A/K flop and take the flip when you get to (say) 88 upwards?
    Posted by shakinaces
    this makes sense if we are talking about calling an open shove, but normally the money already in the pot when the all in decision is made makes a slightly advantaged flip clearly profitable regardless of rake imo.
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  • TeddyBloatTeddyBloat Member Posts: 1,419
    edited November 2014
    As an aside, a poket pair is a significant favorite against AKo.

    Its not a flip.

    If you got it in pre with 55 and had a choice of facing AKo or T6s youd choose facing AKo everytime (the latter being much closer to a flip).
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  • fi33erfi33er Member Posts: 164
    edited November 2014

    Morning ;)
    If you want to be a good poker player you want to put your money in as a favourite. AK against a pocket pair is a coin flip, slightly favouring the pp. its not a great ADVANTAGE, so its not really worth risking lots of chips on it. you can get your money in on a much better situation for sure if you have patience.
    if you are leading with pocket 9's and you get rraised its time to look at your notes on that player. what have they done that with before? if you don't have notes on them then start writing them!! it's very important!!!
    If you don't have history with them and they are new to your table so you have no idea then one option is to call and see the flop.  If an a or k flops and you have more info. and may fold to a bet.  if low cards flop your hand is prob. best.
    another option is to rr them back preflop. if they 3 bet you  have to make a decision, but you have defined your hand. they are telling you they have a big pair, or a k. the size of your stack, their stack and their position all effect your decision. if they are losing they might be more likely to gamble.

    Write notes, pay attention to each hand even if youre not in it and be patient. Did I say write notes?  good luck ;)
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited November 2014
    All prs v AK is a win :)
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  • UnshookoneUnshookone Member Posts: 9
    edited December 2014
    Yep, so many times I get it aip with basically any pair and when I see opponent with AK/KQ/A0 etc I'm pleased.
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  • SlipwaterSlipwater Member Posts: 3,592
    edited December 2014
    The answer has to be yes.

    You're on the profitable side of the statistic.
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  • pacificjoepacificjoe Member Posts: 23
    edited December 2014

    The problem with jamming AK preflop is that your still marginally behind to pocket pairs and when the cards flip you still may run into AA or KK and in which case your in a bit of trouble. If your opponent is loose and has a big range then u can take him on with this holding. If he is tight then u may wish to pick a better spot. Also if you feel you are a better player than your opponent then you can be patient and pick him off later.

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  • denty765denty765 Member Posts: 38
    edited January 2015
    if you have pocket kings fold if you think he has ace high for on this site it is 80 percent behind 
    if u have ak and you think he has kings shove

    that is 80 percent in a year counting
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  • denty765denty765 Member Posts: 38
    edited January 2015
    if you have pocket qweens fold to any shove as they are behind every possible hand including small pp

    I have lost the last 30 shoves with pocket queens against every hand conceivable

    last month was same for kk

    tried it with pack of cards got to two on a trot no more
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  • denty765denty765 Member Posts: 38
    edited January 2015
    also if you are small stack get it in with anything you will win no matter if 4 people call and you have 23

    watch a dym for proof
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