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Should I be calling off my stack here?
shakinaces
Member Posts: 1,590
Hmm given I've not played these guys before and haven't been at the table long (this was probably the 2nd orbit, which had been played 5-handed and 2 others had just left a couple of hands prior)... should I be taking a more passive line and calling pre-flop?
I'm still a bit uncertain as to whether I'm getting too aggressive in parts and being the master of my own downfall at times, particularly as to whether I'm kidding myself by trying to brush these off as coolers.
On the paired board should I be happier to check rather than c-bet?
I sort of feel like I'm obliged to call the turn as I'm getting around 3/1, but will I see enough weaker hands from a standard oppo, particularly at these levels? KK seems unlikely unless they were slow-playing pre, 33 very unlikely and good luck to them if they have quads, so 55 or a higher flush... the only other 'value' hand that could raise me would be AK with ace of spades?
Meh
I'm still a bit uncertain as to whether I'm getting too aggressive in parts and being the master of my own downfall at times, particularly as to whether I'm kidding myself by trying to brush these off as coolers.
On the paired board should I be happier to check rather than c-bet?
I sort of feel like I'm obliged to call the turn as I'm getting around 3/1, but will I see enough weaker hands from a standard oppo, particularly at these levels? KK seems unlikely unless they were slow-playing pre, 33 very unlikely and good luck to them if they have quads, so 55 or a higher flush... the only other 'value' hand that could raise me would be AK with ace of spades?
Meh
| Player | Action | Cards | Amount | Pot | Balance |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| JesterAK | Small blind | £0.05 | £0.05 | £11.06 | |
| shakinaces | Big blind | £0.10 | £0.15 | £19.90 | |
| Your hole cards |
| ||||
| maui73 | Raise | £0.30 | £0.45 | £14.43 | |
| JesterAK | Call | £0.25 | £0.70 | £10.81 | |
| shakinaces | Raise | £1.10 | £1.80 | £18.80 | |
| maui73 | Call | £0.90 | £2.70 | £13.53 | |
| JesterAK | Call | £0.90 | £3.60 | £9.91 | |
| Flop | |||||
| |||||
| JesterAK | Check | ||||
| shakinaces | Bet | £1.80 | £5.40 | £17.00 | |
| maui73 | Call | £1.80 | £7.20 | £11.73 | |
| JesterAK | Fold | ||||
| Turn | |||||
| |||||
| shakinaces | Bet | £4.00 | £11.20 | £13.00 | |
| maui73 | All-in | £11.73 | £22.93 | £0.00 | |
| shakinaces | Call/Fold? | ||||
Comments
When you including suited connectors in your range of hand that are 3bet you must have a very good reading of the villian.
first and foremost you will be need to be confidient enough he'll respect your cbet on dry flops like A high K high Q high. The problem you will face now is having to be sure that his calling range will be wide enough to ensure your cbet will get rid of hands easy enough.
Regs who you have been sharing tables with for months are the people you can start including these hands in your 3betting range because not only will it make them widen their calling range but also do 3bets post flop with hands such as TPTK allowing you to get more from AA.
Against unknowns you should keep the 3bets limited to premium hands, then when you begin to notice unknowns frequently folding on the flop perhaps begin to use Axs AQo KQs IP because atleast an Axs has the possibility of been ahead of hands that do call those dry A high flops and once they see frequent folds you can start looking at some suited connectors.
I don't mind the 3bet pre BB v SB/BTN but think calling is fine too.
After that, it's fine to go quite small on the flop as you have imo, and RE: Craigsg1, I would recommend using the same sizing on this flop with AA/KK too (and every hand we cbet), it's not a flop that's particularly easy to hit. More often than not they have Kx which is never folding to 1 bet, Ax, or PPs under 44-QQ which we can get folds from on later streets or right now.
Gin turn card, he wants to get it in, happy days, if you're beat, you're beat, just ul.
As played, flop and turn are fine. Gii on the turn is standard.
Sometimes he will have a bigger flush, buts it's a fairly small possibilty and there are just too many hands which we crush to consider folding now.
I wouldn't recommend checking the turn but if we did and he shoves, that's probably even more of a call imo, we're under-repped, we shouldnt have as strong as a flush if we've checked the turn and I wouldn't expect him to just jam a flush or FH. He would prob be trying to take the pot down with just a big spade or could have something like TP and is just thinking we have a bare spade quite often and wants to force us to commit the lot now to draw or fold.
Never folding turn ever.
IIRC had something like Q2 or Q4 of spades and I was a dead duck before the river.
Re: bet-sizing, yes I'd normally raise 12bb vs 2 x 3bb players in pot - although this is perhaps something I need to balance based on position (ie perhaps closer to 14bb is worthwhile OOP and closer to 10bb IP?)
Likewise on a paired flop like that I'd tend towards a 1/2 pot bet for value and bluff... even more so in a 3b pot where I don't need to bet so big to get it in by the river.
Re: calling or 3betting 87s oop - this probably is too much fancy play syndrome sneaking into my play, probably the biggest cause of losses when I play!!
I suppose my theory here is that calling with this means I'm chucking in chips knowing that I'm folding most flops and won't necessarily get a huge stack if I flop big - ie if the flop is 3 spades or 456 rainbow then a lot of oppos will shut down / maybe chuck in a cbet and give up... or of course I stack off to a bigger flush still lol
By raising I get the chance to take it down pre and have a greater shot of repping big on the multitude of times I miss or only flop a little bit (ie middle / bottom pair).
Maybe that theory should be saved for when I can play />=50NL and fit-or-fold is a better go to strategy at the lower levels...