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Tournements and bad beats any advice?

fi33erfi33er Member Posts: 164
edited December 2014 in Brags, Beats and Variance
Hi There,
I normally play cash games on this site, but have started trying tournaments this last few weeks.
I got 7th last night in the £5,000BH UKOPS a good result ;)
I was knocked out with ace queen vs queen 9, I recon I was a big favourite.
I tried again tonight in the £6,000BH UKOPS tonight and was doing well with plenty of chips with 32 players left.
I got all in with A Q vs QK and I lost. I recon I was a big favourite again.
 Both hands were all in Pre flop.

Was I just Unlucky?

Last few days I have had some terrible cold decks. I started to play badly after a few in quick succession for big pots, it
seamed so unbelievable!  Does this happen to everyone and has anyone got any good advice for someone trying to improve their cash and tournament play when this happens to stop you going mad and then letting it affect your play?

Many thanks and I hope you have a prosperous 2015,
fi33er
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Comments

  • RLT16RLT16 Member Posts: 1,433
    edited December 2014
    in both the hands you mentioned it seems to me like you were just unlucky and if you carry on doing what your doing it will balance out

    best of luck at the tables :)
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  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 169,576
    edited December 2014
    In Response to Tournements and bad beats any advice?:
    Hi There, I normally play cash games on this site, but have started trying tournaments this last few weeks. I got 7th last night in the £5,000BH UKOPS a good result ;) I was knocked out with ace queen vs queen 9, I recon I was a big favourite. I tried again tonight in the £6,000BH UKOPS tonight and was doing well with plenty of chips with 32 players left. I got all in with A Q vs QK and I lost. I recon I was a big favourite again.  Both hands were all in Pre flop. Was I just Unlucky? Last few days I have had some terrible cold decks. I started to play badly after a few in quick succession for big pots, it seamed so unbelievable!  Does this happen to everyone and has anyone got any good advice for someone trying to improve their cash and tournament play when this happens to stop you going mad and then letting it affect your play? Many thanks and I hope you have a prosperous 2015, fi33er
    Posted by fi33er
    Hi fi33er,

    Yes, you were just unlucky.

    Yes, it happens to everyone. It's part & parcel of our wonderful game. Those that can't cope with these standard beats, which are an irrelevance compared to real world beats, need to solve their problem, or quit poker.

    Advice?

    Personally, I'd suggest 4 things.
     
    1) Play more tables, this reduces our variance. Do not exceed your bankroll limits, move down if necessary - but when 2, 3 or 4 tabling, the beats are better spaced out, hurt less, & because we are busy, we soon forget about them.

    2) In a session of poker over several tables - say 4 tables for 4 hours - we will see thousands of hands. When we lose a "bad one", just move on to the next hand. It is one hand in a succession of several thousand. WE CANNOT EVER play a session without encountering a few bad beats, &, equally, putting a few bad beats on others. Remind ourselves of that before every session.  

    3) Most of our unlucky hands are 60/40, 70/30, or 80/20 shots. Lets take the 80/20 example. Our K-K gets beat by J-J when the Jacks hit a set. We feel hard done by. ITS NOT FAIR. 

    But then look at it this way.

    Imagine we could play that hand 10,000 times for £1 a time.  Sure, we'd lose 2,000 times........but we'd win 8,000 times. Nice business if you can get it. NEVER look at luck over a sample size of a single hand.   

    4) Read "The Mental Game of Poker". Not only will that help you understand, & put into perspective, these beats, these little bits of adversity. It will help you enjoy your poker so much more. Really, if "beats" upset us, we are not enjoying our poker, & we need to sort it out. If we don't enjoy watching Corionation Street, we don't watch it. If we don't like the local pub, we go somewhere else. And if we are not enjoying our poker, wee need to solve the problem, or stop playing.  

    Remember, for us recreationals - well over 95% of the players worldwide are "recreationals", though many would deny it - the ONLY point in playing the game is to enjoy it. It might cost us £5 or £10- a week, fair enough, but if we are enjoying ourselves 3 or 4 nights per week, that's good value. 

    Try a few of those things, then come back in a month & tell us how you are getting on.

    Best of luck to you, too, in 2015.
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  • TalonTalon Member Posts: 1,621
    edited December 2014

      The only word that come to mind for you are perspective.

     It comes down to selective memory and how we deal with it.

     The 2 hands you talked about were 70/30 shots which although you are a nice favourite you will still lose a hefty chunk of the time. But the timing of the exits are the ones that make us remember them. 

     To help cope with these you need to think about all the other times when the odds have come out on your side and realise you have had your share of luck.

     remember all the times where you have played a pocket pair and flopped a set. Only a 1 in 7 chance of that happening.
     Remember the times that you have played with suited cards flopped a flush draw and then hit it. Only a 1 in 7 chance of flopping the draw and then only 1 in 3 of hitting.

     As players we tend to brush the times of good luck under the carpet because we think we deserve it and we focus on the times of bad luck. To have reached the final table bubble in a big tournament i am sure that you played well and also that you had your fair share of luck as well. Just not possible otherwise.

     The only cure the the memory of the bad beats is to remember the good luck as well. You need to be balanced in your thoughts to both the good and the bad
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  • fi33erfi33er Member Posts: 164
    edited December 2014

    Thank you for the advice and comments, I will definately check out that book the mental game of poker. I recon I must have been more than a 70/30 favourite (they only had 3 outs!) but I'm sure that you're right and it will balance out in the long run.  It is just the timing that sucks. 
    It is good to get some friendly feedback on here so thanks again, I'm going to get to the final table tonight and win one!

    Catch you soon,

    fi33er

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  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 169,576
    edited December 2014
    In Response to Re: Tournements and bad beats any advice?:
    Thank you for the advice and comments, I will definately check out that book the mental game of poker. I recon I must have been more than a 70/30 favourite (they only had 3 outs!) but I'm sure that you're right and it will balance out in the long run.  It is just the timing that sucks.  It is good to get some friendly feedback on here so thanks again, I'm going to get to the final table tonight and win one! Catch you soon, fi33er
    Posted by fi33er
    Yo Fi33er,

    Another thing that works is to view some of the more eccentric Posts in "Brags, Beats & Variances". It makes us realise how others see us when we look at some of that stuff.
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  • F_IvanovicF_Ivanovic Member Posts: 2,410
    edited December 2014
    Tikay, cmon now we know you love a bit of coronation street - don't try and fool us!!!

    @ Fi33er; I second most of the advice you've got in this thread! During a deep run in the tournament we will have our stack (or a decent portion of it) at risk a fair amount of times. To run deep, you HAVE to win these hands. So you might have previously won 3 of them - a couple of 50/50's and one where you were a decent favourite and your bust hand was also when you were a decent favourite. If you work out the probability of winning all of them flips (two 50/50s and two 70/30's) then it's pretty low. Thus, ideally in a tournament you want to build a stack that can handle losing some of them flips. GL :)
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  • MattBatesMattBates Member Posts: 4,118
    edited December 2014
    In Response to Re: Tournements and bad beats any advice?:
    Thank you for the advice and comments, I will definately check out that book the mental game of poker. I recon I must have been more than a 70/30 favourite (they only had 3 outs!) but I'm sure that you're right and it will balance out in the long run.  It is just the timing that sucks.  It is good to get some friendly feedback on here so thanks again, I'm going to get to the final table tonight and win one! Catch you soon, fi33er
    Posted by fi33er
    People overestimate how much of a favourite they are in hands. For example AQ v Q9 (assuming diff suits) is 73.52% v 25.02% (tie 1.46%). To go deep in tournaments you will have knock backs on the way and if every hand holds then you don't realise it but you have run ahead of expectations as unless you get it in as a 100% fav you run ahead of expectations when you win even if its AA v KK. All you can do is keep getting it in good and play enough so that variance evens things out.  
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