Value bets

RLT16

PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalanceLorna987Small blind 10.0010.001970.00zBig blind 20.0030.002010.00 Your hole cards55   dunc58Fold    xCall 20.0050.002000.00RLT16Call 20.0070.001980.00nesbit16Fold    Lorna987Fold    zCheck    Flop  5Q5   zCheck    xCheck    RLT16Check    Turn  8   zBet 70.00140.001940.00xRaise 140.00280.001860.00RLT16Raise 270.00550.001710.00zFold    xCall 130.00680.001730.00River  2   xBet 200.00880.001530.00RLT16Raise 620.001500.001090.00xCall 420.001920.001110.00RLT16Show55   xMuckQ8   RLT16WinFour 5s1920.00 3010.00

RLT16

ok basically i think one of the issues i still have with my game is getting value from my good hands, this is just an example of a hand tonight that i feel i should probably of got more from, i had no history with either of the two players and this was only the second hand of the dym.

my thoughts are i dont need to bet the flop its to dry and im probably about 99.5% favourite anyway, when the turn comes and i see a bet then a raise, i figure i can raise again and will get a call from atleast one of them, do u think the bet size on the turn is ok, or should i be going higher? X has bet 140 so im thinking i could probably of gone 400 ish but i obviously dont want to scare him away.

and again im not sure about the river, once he leads out for 200 is my 620 raise big enough? is it about right? value betting is something i still feel i need to work on.


this is just one example of many, things like hitting trips onto a dry or wet board, agaisnt differet types of players i still sturggle to extract value, is it right that i should be checking into agressive players and letting them bet at me for the check raise? and betting into the calling stations? and which way would you tend to lean if you have no reads on your opponent?

i know theres a lot of questions, just another step on my learning ladder thanks in advance guys

ShaunyT

First thing is raise pre. Limping in general is bad, although there are exceptions. If you raise pre the pot is bigger to kick off with. Then I know that flop is super dry, however when it is checked to you a cbet will get calls from q x hands and maybe small pocket pairs. It's always tricky to get value from quads, so I think you have actually done quite well (as played). The turn raise could be bigger and depending on the villain a river jam might get called. Although I do quite like your river raise size. 

jordz16

Imho i think you have butchered this one a little bit, normally i hate calling the limp but in a dym i think thats fine, the decision whether to check or bet the flop depends on how loose the players are, if they are loose id be betting and just hoping they have something, if they are fairly tight the check is fine....

but on the turn when there has been a bet and a reraise why are you raising so small? you are basically telling them you have atleast a 5 and they should fold.. you want to be telling them a different story... what would you do if you had top pair? or a flush draw? im sure you would either be calling if you wasnt sure where you are, or you would be raising big if you felt you were fairly likely to be ahead, so you should be playing your quads in the same way.

and on the river they have bet fairly small which is either a blocker bet because they have a weak pair and dont want you to bet, or it is to induce a bluff which they want to call off, either way you need to make your raise look like a bluff and i dont think that raise size looks bluffy at all, id be raising til at least 800/900 because if they are calling 620 they will be calling 900 i think.

gl at the tables

hhyftrftdr

Don't mind the overlimp this early with a small pair.

I'm not a fan of the raise on the turn. It's tricky to not look strong, but after a bet and a raise, we basically play our hand face up by clicking it back again into 2 people. We are never bluffing in this spot with this sizing. Are you cold raising a bare Q? Highly unlikely. Raising a flush draw on a paired board into 2 people? Nope. So your range is heavily weighted towards pocket 8s or having the 5 (or in this case both 5s!)

Like I said, even calling the turn looks quite strong but it should keep 'Z' in the hand as well, so we go to the river with quads and 2 potential customers.

On the river, it's gonna be dependent on the player. Going small to guarantee the call is probably the best option in a DYM, but if I thought the villain might struggle to lay down his hand then I'd just jam.

hhyftrftdr

Ha Jordan beat me to it whilst I was posting!

RLT16

Thanks for taking the time to reply, after reading your comments and thinking about it i understand what your saying. I knew it was a masive weakness in my game but something that i havent really put a lot of thought into until now, so all your advice is appriciated and hopefully will help me improver. 

Ps that turn bet was so so bad 

F_Ivanovic

You looked to have got max value here somehow despite playing it somewhat unorthadox.

Sometimes you don't get paid with big hands, that's just poker. The key to getting paid mostly is just to bet them especially vs weaker players. Vs stronger players you still want to bet them but to get paid you need for villain to believe you're capable of bluffing.