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AI takes on poker players

jdsallstarjdsallstar Member Posts: 1,675
edited February 2017 in Poker Chat
Story on bbc that might interest some

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  • StayOrGoStayOrGo Member Posts: 12,187
    edited January 2017
    In Response to AI takes on poker players:
    Story on bbc that might interest some http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-38595480
    Posted by jdsallstar


    Yes, interesting.

    My money's on the humans. :=)

    Fixed Limit H/E = Computer Edge IMO

    No Limit H/E = Human Edge

    I think and sincerely hope, as it could kill the online game, that NLHE will remain hard for computers to beat.

    Thanks for posting the article jdsallstar.

    Cheers,

    G
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  • markycashmarkycash Member Posts: 2,837
    edited January 2017
    In Response to Re: AI takes on poker players:
    In Response to AI takes on poker players : No Limit H/E = Human Edge I think and sincerely hope, as it could kill the online game, that NLHE will remain hard for computers to beat.
    Posted by StayOrGo
    But then everyone could come play plo8 :-)
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  • StayOrGoStayOrGo Member Posts: 12,187
    edited January 2017
    In Response to Re: AI takes on poker players:
    In Response to Re: AI takes on poker players : But then everyone could come play plo8 :-)
    Posted by markycash


    Perhaps, however, PLO8 would be easier for a computer to beat than NLHE IMO. :=)
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  • Itsover4uItsover4u Member Posts: 1,538
    edited January 2017
    I'v been watching this live and the bots are winning at 13bb/100 after 6k hands which is very scary!.... BUT

    And it's a big but....

    Every hand is played with 200bb stack regardless of previous hands so it is only trying to solve at one stack size.... if this was played to go super deep the bot would more than likely get destroyed
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  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr Member Posts: 8,036
    edited January 2017
    In Response to Re: AI takes on poker players:
    I'v been watching this live and the bots are winning at 13bb/100 after 6k hands which is very scary!.... BUT And it's a big but.... Every hand is played with 200bb stack regardless of previous hands so it is only trying to solve at one stack size.... if this was played to go super deep the bot would more than likely get destroyed
    Posted by Itsover4u


    So the bot would be useless at spin up cash?
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  • EnutEnut Member Posts: 3,584
    edited January 2017
    In Response to Re: AI takes on poker players:
    In Response to Re: AI takes on poker players : So the bot would be useless at spin up cash?
    Posted by hhyftrftdr
    Ah, I'm a bot then, that would explain it.
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  • ALTiltYouALTiltYou Member Posts: 174
    edited January 2017
    For those of interest and an interest in a boring read about the bot. 


    My money on humans
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  • Phantom66Phantom66 Member Posts: 5,542
    edited January 2017
    Very short sighted of the pros imo

    The more houts the s/w gets against the pros the quicker it will learn.

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  • TeddyBloatTeddyBloat Member Posts: 1,419
    edited January 2017
    the bot isnt trying to solve poker, it is trying to beat 4 human opponents. this isnt a scientific venture into game theory; it is one upsmanship and a pseudo scientific ego war.

    the previous bot, cepheus, was the same. it was reprogrammed between sessions to plug leaks and exploit the human team's exploitative plays. it even deployed different versions of the bot against different players on the human team. i also found the AI developers reporting before and after the event to be very disengenous.
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  • JimiAls1JimiAls1 Member Posts: 41
    edited January 2017
    My brain hurts and I read the first page! How is there no auido in this day and age!
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  • StayOrGoStayOrGo Member Posts: 12,187
    edited January 2017
    Are they playing heads up, or full ring?

    P.S. My head started hurting too when trying to read the info.

    I just wanted to pick out some baseline facts, and yes, Phantom is right, the more experience AI has against top pros, the faster it will learn.

    Although if this is only level stacks and heads up, then, may I suggest, there is a way to go still, as full ring is much more demanding for a robot, than heads up.

    It does show you how beautifully complex our game can be, when played at a high level, so much so, that computers can beat Chess, Go, but not our wonderful game!

    At least, NOT YET :=)

    Cheers,

    G
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  • jdsallstarjdsallstar Member Posts: 1,675
    edited February 2017
    computer won :(

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  • Phantom66Phantom66 Member Posts: 5,542
    edited February 2017
    Hmm seems it was given a helping hand though.

    If it was self learning that quickly I would have been hugely impressed, but it seems it was getting extra programming between sessions which suggest alot of its strategies are pre-programmed and not learned and the coders were plugging some leaks that the other players were exploiting.
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  • suzy666suzy666 Member Posts: 221
    edited February 2017
    In Response to Re: AI takes on poker players:
    I'v been watching this live and the bots are winning at 13bb/100 after 6k hands which is very scary!.... BUT And it's a big but.... Every hand is played with 200bb stack regardless of previous hands so it is only trying to solve at one stack size.... if this was played to go super deep the bot would more than likely get destroyed
    Posted by Itsover4u
    out of interest why do you think humans gain an edge with stack depth?

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  • hhyftrftdrhhyftrftdr Member Posts: 8,036
    edited February 2017
    In Response to Re: AI takes on poker players:
    In Response to Re: AI takes on poker players : out of interest why do you think humans gain an edge with stack depth?
    Posted by suzy666

    Yep, Haysie can beat any bot as long as he starts with 875,000 chips.

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  • percival09percival09 Member Posts: 3,804
    edited February 2017
    One of the losers, D.Kim, is one of the better high-stakes HU players. The bot destroyed even him, which I think should suyggest to everyone that even the top players have an abundance of leaks that are just waiting to be exploited. Easy? No, but it at least shows how far even the best players are from being even close to perfect. One can try to memorise all of the strategies suggested to take by Snowie, or the plays suggested by Ben Sulsky, but the ability to instantly, or at least very quickly, adjust to a strategy & capitalise on any leak is the thing that wins the $$ at the end of the day. Most likely your strategy should be completely different vs 2 different players. Hyperexpoitation wins the money, not mass tabling :) 

    Well, it either shows that OR that the AI is just ridiculously amazing, you decide :~~~~~~
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