Call or Fold?

waller02

£11 BH. I'm 1/7, but only just. There are 5 fairly even stacks and 2 shorties on around 9k. Was the first time villain had shoved in the small blind. Given the fact that there are 2 shorts stacks, is this a fold? Also worth noting that they only have a min bounty on offer.

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
whogoes	Small blind		500.00	500.00	20130.00
waller02	Big blind		1000.00	1500.00	27815.00
	Your hole cards	A J
Bleurgh	Fold
bullet2907	Fold
whogoes	All-in		20130.00	21630.00	0.00
waller02

MattBates

How many paid?

waller02

MattBates said:

How many paid?

9 paid so in the money

Essexphil

I'm calling.

MattBates

I call, if it was 6 paid I think its more of a fold as think their range is a lot tighter.

MISTY4ME

I'm folding, not wanting to punt off 3/4's of my stack on AJo (as I have done in the past). I'd rather wait for a better opportunity....... but this is probably why I never win Tourneys

waller02

My thoughts were that there would be enough underpairs, worse Ax, maybe even strong Kx, QJ etc that would be shoving here as it takes away a tough spot for them if they raise and then I shove. Hands like JJ+ AK and poss AQ would more likely be standard raise/call.

Am I thinking along the right lines here or am I way off?

I did call and they had AQo and held.

waller02

Also, AJo must be pretty close to the bottom of the calling range here? ATs feels close? A9o fold? What pairs are we calling with here, TT+ or even wider?

lfccarl

im folding and waiting for a better spot

Angmar2626

waller02 said:

Also, AJo must be pretty close to the bottom of the calling range here? ATs feels close? A9o fold? What pairs are we calling with here, TT+ or even wider?

Plug it into HRC or ICMizer free version pal - will pick up more than if someone just posts the answer I think

SuperAyr25

Calling every time your miles in front of his range your playing to tight i think if you fold there i understand ICM but your playing to win .

rspca12

Meh spot maths says it call. Defo merit if u have edge on players left u can exp fold. But i would auto pilot call this in game.

MattBates

This kind of hand is why notes really help. Readless it is a call. Against some it may be a snap fold.
With spots like this, we need to make a decision based on ranges, sometimes players can be at the top of their range and we lose though.

MISTY4ME

I'm posting a couple of hands I could do with some help with please, and hopefully it will help other players too.
The first one is late on in the Mini Major last Sunday night. We were down to last 11 or 12 so I was in the cash. There were 3 or 4 Big stacks, 2 Med-High stacks, 4 of us around 80K (med-Low) and a couple of shorty's including Killa who was pretty aggro all night.

With 16 BB's, and the Chip Leader in the hand (though only calling initially), I decided not to call the initial Shove.........

A few questions on this one........
1. Is the Fold being too nitty?
2. Should I be braver by calling these low stack shoves to increase my chance of Final Tabling/winning the Tourney?
3. If I'm going to play the hand, should I be calling the shove or shoving myself?
4. What sort of hands would I Call with/Shove with?

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
ughx3000cx	Small blind		2500.00	2500.00	87372.00
MISTY4ME	Big blind		5000.00	7500.00	77360.30
	Your hole cards	K Q
GSmith13	Fold
damhawk07	Call		5000.00	12500.00	296753.60
DoyleBrun	Fold
killa16616	All-in		39407.35	51907.35	0.00
ughx3000cx	Fold
MISTY4ME	Fold
damhawk07	Call		34407.35	86314.70	262346.25
damhawk07	Show	10 Q
killa16616	Show	9 K
Flop
		A 5 3
Turn
		4
River
		J
killa16616	Win	Ace high	86314.70		86314.70

MISTY4ME

The 2nd hand is from last night's Predator Bounty Hunter. From memory we were in the cash (Top 18), and I was around 6th/7th, so hoping to Final Table at least.
I made the initial call thinking I'm getting 5/1 to see the Flop on my BB.....
1. Was this my 1st mistake?
2. Having seen the Flop and holding an Open-ended Straight Draw, should I then call the Shove for 21K (leaving me with just under 20 BB's), to try for the Bounty?

These are the situations I struggle with to work out the Maths quick enough, so any help would be great, and very much appreciated

In the end I finished 10th which I would have taken at the start of the night, and was happy with, but I know I need to probably take a few more risks in the right situations if I want to win Tourneys

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
MISTY4ME	Big blind		1600.00	1600.00	58197.75
	Your hole cards	7 9
Vince_107	Raise		3200.00	4800.00	132735.25
splashies	Fold
PowerPok3r	Call		3200.00	8000.00	26284.00
Doughboys	Fold
MISTY4ME	Call		1600.00	9600.00	56597.75
Flop
		5 8 10
MISTY4ME	Bet		4800.00	14400.00	51797.75
Vince_107	Call		4800.00	19200.00	127935.25
PowerPok3r	All-in		26284.00	45484.00	0.00
MISTY4ME	Fold
Vince_107	Fold
PowerPok3r	Muck
PowerPok3r	Win		24000.00		24000.00
PowerPok3r	Return		21484.00	0.00	45484.00

MISTY4ME

BUMP

I probably should have started a new thread with these hands......

.......... any chance of some help @StayOrGo @MattBates @FeelGroggy @chicknMelt and ALL the CRUSHERS incl. NEWBY GrosvenorPro @Essexphil, @Itsover4u, @rspca12 and LOTS of Players far better than me, .....your help would be appreciated .....please

Tikay10

@MISTY4ME

I've moved this across to Poker Chat mate, so it gets more eyeballs.

You posted it in the correct place, but many folks don't look at Poker Clinic.

Hope you'll get some feedback now.

bbMike

I think you can make a case for reshove or fold in the first hand, if they’ve been aggro all game they’re unlikely to be trying to nurse a small stack and so you can dominate part of their range. You don’t have enough behind to call then fold, and being called by the big stack limper isn’t a disaster as it gives a chance at a side pot that would give most of your chips back or winning more. If the player shoving is loose I think reshove.

Hand 2 the over-call pre is close, it’s tough to get to showdown with 97o cheaply vs 2 players playing OOP, much prefer the call vs one player where there’s less in the pot (so cheaper to continue) and only one opponent to potentially bluff off the hand. Having flopped the open-ender I think I prefer a check to keep the pot small, if you’re block betting to see a turn card you could go smaller to around 1/3 pot, which you might also want to do with 2p and a set of 5s. You don’t want to get all your chips in here vs the bigger stack but might be willing to go with it vs the shorter stack for a bounty or put pressure on them - but you want to keep your fold equity, getting ripped on and having to consider calling off for half your stack is a bit of a disaster, ICM, ladders, size of bounties are important here.

Happy to be wrong to get the conversation going!

markycash

@waller02

Snap calling. Even if you have 19k and the SB has us covered I am snapping here. However, as it is, you will still have a few chips behind and may ladder up a little even if it goes pear shaped so a snap call IMO. You will generally be in great shape versus a lot of their shoving range.

Would be more of a bind if you had like a7o and 20k stack here. In that case I would be looking quite closely at the payout structure then deciding.

stokefc

markycash said:

@waller02

Snap calling. Even if you have 19k and the SB has us covered I am snapping here. However, as it is, you will still have a few chips behind and may ladder up a little even if it goes pear shaped so a snap call IMO. You will generally be in great shape versus a lot of their shoving range.

Would be more of a bind if you had like a7o and 20k stack here. In that case I would be looking quite closely at the payout structure then deciding.

welcome back bud

Tikay10

@markycash

Yay, welcome back mate, hope life is good.

PS;