Girl Guides?

HAYSIE

Girl Guides launch probe into commissioner, 58, who identifies as trans after campaigners uncovered 'disturbing' social media messages and pictures including her dressed as a dominatrix and wielding an assault rifle




Bus driver Monica Sulley, 58, reportedly became a guiding Commissioner (right) in July this year, overseeing Rainbows, Brownies, Guides and Rangers in Southwell, Nottinghamshire. Her appointment has upset some feminist campaigners who argue that biological males identifying as women should not be given leadership roles in the movement. Campaigners delved into her background and unearthed a picture on her Instagram page showing her in a black bondage-style short dress with high heels and wielding a whip (left). Another snap showed Ms Sulley dressed in a tight fitting black top and taking aim with what appears to be a fake assault rifle with a holstered handgun hanging from her waist (inset). Girlguiding which is Britain's leading charity for girls and young women launched its investigation after the pictures of Ms Sulley were revealed by the feminist website 4W.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10235539/Girlguides-launch-probe-trans-Commissioner-58-saucy-dominatrix-style-picture.html

rabdeniro

That's wrong on so many levels.

HAYSIE

rabdeniro said:

That's wrong on so many levels.

Hardly a role model.

Essexphil

Don't understand the hate.

Biological male, but identifies as female. What other options are there? Do you think it would be better if she/they were a Scout leader? Or do you think it better that such people are hidden from view, like some sort of criminal?

A role model. For hope. Not hate. Where people learn how to be tolerant.

HAYSIE

Essexphil said:

Don't understand the hate.

Biological male, but identifies as female. What other options are there? Do you think it would be better if she/they were a Scout leader? Or do you think it better that such people are hidden from view, like some sort of criminal?

A role model. For hope. Not hate. Where people learn how to be tolerant.

I dont understand where you get the hate from.
You would hope that a Girl Guide Commissioner would set an example for young guides to follow.
Not sure posting photos posing as a dominatrix, or with an assault rifle fulfils that role.
I dont hate her, but I think she is completely out of order.
I wouldnt want my young Grand Children to go anywhere near her.
I think the trans aspect is irrelevant.

VespaPX

As a dominatrix she would be good at teaching knot tying.

HAYSIE

VespaPX said:

As a dominatrix she would be good at teaching knot tying.

Cant argue with that.

Essexphil

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

Don't understand the hate.

Biological male, but identifies as female. What other options are there? Do you think it would be better if she/they were a Scout leader? Or do you think it better that such people are hidden from view, like some sort of criminal?

A role model. For hope. Not hate. Where people learn how to be tolerant.

I dont understand where you get the hate from.
You would hope that a Girl Guide Commissioner would set an example for young guides to follow.
Not sure posting photos posing as a dominatrix, or with an assault rifle fulfils that role.
I dont hate her, but I think she is completely out of order.
I wouldnt want my young Grand Children to go anywhere near her.
I think the trans aspect is irrelevant.

Don't understand the hate? For once, a Daily Mail article is worth reading to the end.

The reason for the attack on this trans woman is as follows.

At a Pride march in 2018, various radical feminists and radical lesbians, organised by a group called 4W, made an attack on the transgender community. They believe that there is no place for the "T" in the LGBT, and that people who are born biologically male must hold no place in any form of female society.

Ms Sulley was 1 of 2,000 signatories to a letter condemning the anti-trans demonstration at a Pride march. Whereupon 4W openly stated its intention to disclose information to the Press to show why Transgender people should not be allowed anywhere near women. and provided this information about Ms Sulley.

Because-apparently-they believe that the trans movement is attacking the rights of women. They seriously believe that transgender people are men seeking to control women by pretending they are not men. Or biological women who are betraying womankind.

HAYSIE

Essexphil said:

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

Don't understand the hate.

Biological male, but identifies as female. What other options are there? Do you think it would be better if she/they were a Scout leader? Or do you think it better that such people are hidden from view, like some sort of criminal?

A role model. For hope. Not hate. Where people learn how to be tolerant.

I dont understand where you get the hate from.
You would hope that a Girl Guide Commissioner would set an example for young guides to follow.
Not sure posting photos posing as a dominatrix, or with an assault rifle fulfils that role.
I dont hate her, but I think she is completely out of order.
I wouldnt want my young Grand Children to go anywhere near her.
I think the trans aspect is irrelevant.

Don't understand the hate? For once, a Daily Mail article is worth reading to the end.

The reason for the attack on this trans woman is as follows.

At a Pride march in 2018, various radical feminists and radical lesbians, organised by a group called 4W, made an attack on the transgender community. They believe that there is no place for the "T" in the LGBT, and that people who are born biologically male must hold no place in any form of female society.

Ms Sulley was 1 of 2,000 signatories to a letter condemning the anti-trans demonstration at a Pride march. Whereupon 4W openly stated its intention to disclose information to the Press to show why Transgender people should not be allowed anywhere near women. and provided this information about Ms Sulley.

Because-apparently-they believe that the trans movement is attacking the rights of women. They seriously believe that transgender people are men seeking to control women by pretending they are not men. Or biological women who are betraying womankind.

I am afraid I just saw it as a much simpler story.

Essexphil

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

Don't understand the hate.

Biological male, but identifies as female. What other options are there? Do you think it would be better if she/they were a Scout leader? Or do you think it better that such people are hidden from view, like some sort of criminal?

A role model. For hope. Not hate. Where people learn how to be tolerant.

I dont understand where you get the hate from.
You would hope that a Girl Guide Commissioner would set an example for young guides to follow.
Not sure posting photos posing as a dominatrix, or with an assault rifle fulfils that role.
I dont hate her, but I think she is completely out of order.
I wouldnt want my young Grand Children to go anywhere near her.
I think the trans aspect is irrelevant.

Don't understand the hate? For once, a Daily Mail article is worth reading to the end.

The reason for the attack on this trans woman is as follows.

At a Pride march in 2018, various radical feminists and radical lesbians, organised by a group called 4W, made an attack on the transgender community. They believe that there is no place for the "T" in the LGBT, and that people who are born biologically male must hold no place in any form of female society.

Ms Sulley was 1 of 2,000 signatories to a letter condemning the anti-trans demonstration at a Pride march. Whereupon 4W openly stated its intention to disclose information to the Press to show why Transgender people should not be allowed anywhere near women. and provided this information about Ms Sulley.

Because-apparently-they believe that the trans movement is attacking the rights of women. They seriously believe that transgender people are men seeking to control women by pretending they are not men. Or biological women who are betraying womankind.

I am afraid I just saw it as a much simpler story.

That was the whole purpose. Smear campaigns tend to make up a simple narrative, usually false, to try and stop civilised debate.

Imagine if an attractive 58-year-old woman dressed up in a corset and a whip, to jokily proclaim that her husband had better not forget her birthday this year. Problem now? Surely it only becomes a problem when a stalker pretends that the person is a dominatrix.

Or another picture of a woman having fun with a plastic imitation firearm? Newsworthy?

The Scouting movement had a sensible debate about this years ago. Boy Scouts decided to become the Scouts, and co-ed. Girl Guides to be single sex, but expressly to include Trans people who identified as women, including as leaders.

I appreciate that some of the more fundamental churches do not agree, but then it always amazes me how unchristian some attitudes are. And how they ignore the fact that that would lead to the Girl Guides having all sorts of legal (and Charitable) problems

Read some of the articles by 4W. I don't pretend to understand the nuances of transgenderism. But I do know that the pressures facing the Transgender community are considerable. Particularly from the Feminist movement.

HAYSIE

Essexphil said:

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

Don't understand the hate.

Biological male, but identifies as female. What other options are there? Do you think it would be better if she/they were a Scout leader? Or do you think it better that such people are hidden from view, like some sort of criminal?

A role model. For hope. Not hate. Where people learn how to be tolerant.

I dont understand where you get the hate from.
You would hope that a Girl Guide Commissioner would set an example for young guides to follow.
Not sure posting photos posing as a dominatrix, or with an assault rifle fulfils that role.
I dont hate her, but I think she is completely out of order.
I wouldnt want my young Grand Children to go anywhere near her.
I think the trans aspect is irrelevant.

Don't understand the hate? For once, a Daily Mail article is worth reading to the end.

The reason for the attack on this trans woman is as follows.

At a Pride march in 2018, various radical feminists and radical lesbians, organised by a group called 4W, made an attack on the transgender community. They believe that there is no place for the "T" in the LGBT, and that people who are born biologically male must hold no place in any form of female society.

Ms Sulley was 1 of 2,000 signatories to a letter condemning the anti-trans demonstration at a Pride march. Whereupon 4W openly stated its intention to disclose information to the Press to show why Transgender people should not be allowed anywhere near women. and provided this information about Ms Sulley.

Because-apparently-they believe that the trans movement is attacking the rights of women. They seriously believe that transgender people are men seeking to control women by pretending they are not men. Or biological women who are betraying womankind.

I am afraid I just saw it as a much simpler story.

That was the whole purpose. Smear campaigns tend to make up a simple narrative, usually false, to try and stop civilised debate.

Imagine if an attractive 58-year-old woman dressed up in a corset and a whip, to jokily proclaim that her husband had better not forget her birthday this year. Problem now? Surely it only becomes a problem when a stalker pretends that the person is a dominatrix.

Or another picture of a woman having fun with a plastic imitation firearm? Newsworthy?

The Scouting movement had a sensible debate about this years ago. Boy Scouts decided to become the Scouts, and co-ed. Girl Guides to be single sex, but expressly to include Trans people who identified as women, including as leaders.

I appreciate that some of the more fundamental churches do not agree, but then it always amazes me how unchristian some attitudes are. And how they ignore the fact that that would lead to the Girl Guides having all sorts of legal (and Charitable) problems

Read some of the articles by 4W. I don't pretend to understand the nuances of transgenderism. But I do know that the pressures facing the Transgender community are considerable. Particularly from the Feminist movement.

I am not clever enough to dispute any of that.
Before I read the story, I saw some photos that I would usually not take much notice of.
However when it became clear that the person featured in the photos was in a position where they could influence young people, I had a different view.
The trans bit was irrelevant to me.
I just didnt think that the person involved was suitable for an influential position.

tai-gar

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

Don't understand the hate.

Biological male, but identifies as female. What other options are there? Do you think it would be better if she/they were a Scout leader? Or do you think it better that such people are hidden from view, like some sort of criminal?

A role model. For hope. Not hate. Where people learn how to be tolerant.

I dont understand where you get the hate from.
You would hope that a Girl Guide Commissioner would set an example for young guides to follow.
Not sure posting photos posing as a dominatrix, or with an assault rifle fulfils that role.
I dont hate her, but I think she is completely out of order.
I wouldnt want my young Grand Children to go anywhere near her.
I think the trans aspect is irrelevant.

Don't understand the hate? For once, a Daily Mail article is worth reading to the end.

The reason for the attack on this trans woman is as follows.

At a Pride march in 2018, various radical feminists and radical lesbians, organised by a group called 4W, made an attack on the transgender community. They believe that there is no place for the "T" in the LGBT, and that people who are born biologically male must hold no place in any form of female society.

Ms Sulley was 1 of 2,000 signatories to a letter condemning the anti-trans demonstration at a Pride march. Whereupon 4W openly stated its intention to disclose information to the Press to show why Transgender people should not be allowed anywhere near women. and provided this information about Ms Sulley.

Because-apparently-they believe that the trans movement is attacking the rights of women. They seriously believe that transgender people are men seeking to control women by pretending they are not men. Or biological women who are betraying womankind.

I am afraid I just saw it as a much simpler story.

That was the whole purpose. Smear campaigns tend to make up a simple narrative, usually false, to try and stop civilised debate.

Imagine if an attractive 58-year-old woman dressed up in a corset and a whip, to jokily proclaim that her husband had better not forget her birthday this year. Problem now? Surely it only becomes a problem when a stalker pretends that the person is a dominatrix.

Or another picture of a woman having fun with a plastic imitation firearm? Newsworthy?

The Scouting movement had a sensible debate about this years ago. Boy Scouts decided to become the Scouts, and co-ed. Girl Guides to be single sex, but expressly to include Trans people who identified as women, including as leaders.

I appreciate that some of the more fundamental churches do not agree, but then it always amazes me how unchristian some attitudes are. And how they ignore the fact that that would lead to the Girl Guides having all sorts of legal (and Charitable) problems

Read some of the articles by 4W. I don't pretend to understand the nuances of transgenderism. But I do know that the pressures facing the Transgender community are considerable. Particularly from the Feminist movement.

I am not clever enough to dispute any of that.
Before I read the story, I saw some photos that I would usually not take much notice of.
However when it became clear that the person featured in the photos was in a position where they could influence young people, I had a different view.
The trans bit was irrelevant to me.
I just didnt think that the person involved was suitable for an influential position.

You mean like a Priest, piano teacher, sports coach etc. Please tell me it is that easy to spot someone who preys on children?

HAYSIE

tai-gar said:

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

HAYSIE said:

Essexphil said:

Don't understand the hate.

Biological male, but identifies as female. What other options are there? Do you think it would be better if she/they were a Scout leader? Or do you think it better that such people are hidden from view, like some sort of criminal?

A role model. For hope. Not hate. Where people learn how to be tolerant.

I dont understand where you get the hate from.
You would hope that a Girl Guide Commissioner would set an example for young guides to follow.
Not sure posting photos posing as a dominatrix, or with an assault rifle fulfils that role.
I dont hate her, but I think she is completely out of order.
I wouldnt want my young Grand Children to go anywhere near her.
I think the trans aspect is irrelevant.

Don't understand the hate? For once, a Daily Mail article is worth reading to the end.

The reason for the attack on this trans woman is as follows.

At a Pride march in 2018, various radical feminists and radical lesbians, organised by a group called 4W, made an attack on the transgender community. They believe that there is no place for the "T" in the LGBT, and that people who are born biologically male must hold no place in any form of female society.

Ms Sulley was 1 of 2,000 signatories to a letter condemning the anti-trans demonstration at a Pride march. Whereupon 4W openly stated its intention to disclose information to the Press to show why Transgender people should not be allowed anywhere near women. and provided this information about Ms Sulley.

Because-apparently-they believe that the trans movement is attacking the rights of women. They seriously believe that transgender people are men seeking to control women by pretending they are not men. Or biological women who are betraying womankind.

I am afraid I just saw it as a much simpler story.

That was the whole purpose. Smear campaigns tend to make up a simple narrative, usually false, to try and stop civilised debate.

Imagine if an attractive 58-year-old woman dressed up in a corset and a whip, to jokily proclaim that her husband had better not forget her birthday this year. Problem now? Surely it only becomes a problem when a stalker pretends that the person is a dominatrix.

Or another picture of a woman having fun with a plastic imitation firearm? Newsworthy?

The Scouting movement had a sensible debate about this years ago. Boy Scouts decided to become the Scouts, and co-ed. Girl Guides to be single sex, but expressly to include Trans people who identified as women, including as leaders.

I appreciate that some of the more fundamental churches do not agree, but then it always amazes me how unchristian some attitudes are. And how they ignore the fact that that would lead to the Girl Guides having all sorts of legal (and Charitable) problems

Read some of the articles by 4W. I don't pretend to understand the nuances of transgenderism. But I do know that the pressures facing the Transgender community are considerable. Particularly from the Feminist movement.

I am not clever enough to dispute any of that.
Before I read the story, I saw some photos that I would usually not take much notice of.
However when it became clear that the person featured in the photos was in a position where they could influence young people, I had a different view.
The trans bit was irrelevant to me.
I just didnt think that the person involved was suitable for an influential position.

You mean like a Priest, piano teacher, sports coach etc. Please tell me it is that easy to spot someone who preys on children?

Not for a minute.
I dont think that anyone is saying that this particular person preys on young children.
My view is that the photos make her unsuitable as a leader in any organisation, and in particular one where she/he is allowed to influence young children.