Sorry Mark @TheEdge949 . I only just noticed these, when looking back at previous comments. They seem to have disappeared in the posting of them.
YOU KNOW THAT OPTIONS WERE NOT MADE AVAILABLE ON THE BALLOT, IT WAS A SIMPLE IN OR OUT. PERHAPS REMAIN COCKED UP THERE
Really, I wasnt aware that remain was responsible for organising the ballot paper?
NO OF COURSE YOU DONT. BOTH SIDES CONTINUALLY LOOK FOR A REASON TO TAKE THEIR BALL HOME AND CURRENTLY THE HARD BORDER IS THE EXCUSE BUT WE BOTH KNOW THAT THE TWO SIDES WILL NEVER ACCEPT GOVERNANCE FROM THE OTHER.
The hard border in Ireland is not possible because of the GFA. I therefore think that it cannot be described as an excuse. What we are left with is the only option that is available. I can see why Unionists would object to the border. The DUP want to have their cake, and eat it. They want the border removed, not to come under any EU rules, and retain access to the single market. Good luck with that.
THATS PERHAPS BECAUSE WE DONT NEED FEEL THE TO INSULT THEM, WE'VE WLKED AWAY AND THEY ARE A LITTLE PEEVED AT US
I am not having that. You said this,
The EU itself is absolutely mortified that we have left and whilst they would give their eye teeth for Britain to rejoin, act like a petulant child and hurl insults whilst spitefully looking to undermine everything. They've basically scratched all our records before handing them back.
I merely pointed out that all the insults seem to be coming from our side.
I DON'T KNOW THAT'S NOT MY JOB, YOU TELL ME. WHEN I DECIDE TO TAKE MY CAR IN FOR REPAIR I DON'T EXPECT TO HAVE TO TELL THE MECHANIC WHAT TO DO TO MAKE THE FAULT BETTER. I TELL HIM THE PROBLEM AND LEAVE IT TO HIM TO FIX, THAT'S HIS JOB
I just wondered in you had any specific ideas on any improvements that could be made.
You said this,
As for those charged with making Brexit work, if they actually stopped being pompous and arrogant and acknowledged that they now have an imperfect situation which requires real work, effort and compromise then things might start to improve.
Well it has been over 7 years since the referendum, and 3 years since we actually left. There were benefits that we enjoyed from our membership, which we have now obviously lost. A number of PMs, Cabinets, and Brexit Ministers, have attempted to negotiate, and renegotiate the best deal we could get. Although we have ended up with the Brexit we chose. I think the real point is that there is a limit to what could be achieved as non members.
WELL, THE YOUNG NEVER MAKE A BAD DECISION DO THEY. SO THATS ALRIGHT THEN.
That is a silly thing to say. As I said earlier they are probably just less biased than the oldies, and dont blame the EU for stuff they are not responsible for. I find it remarkable that the Tories use the "Stronger Together" argument in relation to Scottish Independence, but the opposite in the case of the EU.
There are a couple of recent articles that sum up Brexit for me. The first points out that to minimise trade friction between GB/NI we have to remain aligned with the EU rules. The second one pointing out that to make Brexit worthwhile, and maximise the so called Brexit benefits, we have to diverge. Needless to say, we cant do both.
If Britain diverges from EU rules, the number of checks necessary on British goods crossing the Brexit border to Northern Ireland could increase, which critics say will harm trade.
It raises the prospect that new laws which mean Britain diverges from Brussels could be blocked.
Kemi Badenoch has suggested the UK needs to diverge from EU rules to make Brexit worthwhile, amid concerns from Tory backbenchers that changes will be limited as part of efforts to restore devolved government in Northern Ireland.
The Business Secretary did not deny when challenged that the Government could make concessions on regulation to reduce trade barriers with Northern Ireland.
She said she was not a participant to Northern Ireland’s “political process” and so could not comment, but also stressed the need to find a “comparative advantage” over the EU in terms of regulation in order to “seize the benefits of Brexit”.
The SDLP is 1 of the 2 main Irish Nationalist Parties, whose political position is for a unified Ireland under Dublin rule. In the shorter term, they seek to reduce UK power, and increase Ireland's power, over NI. They make no secret of that. That is their official Party line.
This is the fundamental problem within NI. What pleases 1 side will almost inevitably displease the other.
The "compromise" between the UK and Ireland involves transfer of various powers and influence from Belfast/London to Dublin.
I'm not saying that is wrong. What I am saying is that every "solution" will enrage a portion of the residents of NI.
What do you think she means when she says "reconcile our geography"?
I took it as a statement of fact. The situation is surely the result of the only compromise available, when you consider the geography, economy, and the Brexit that Britain chose. I took the geography bit, merely meant that they share an island with EU members.
Nothing said by pretty much everyone, on all sides of the debate in NI, is a statement of fact. As an example, she deliberately chose the word "Britain" rather than the UK. Because NI is not part of Great Britain. We are a United Kingdom. Which means that the majority of the United Kingdom got to vote and form a Majority as to whether we got to leave.
Some Regions voted to Remain. Scotland, Northern Ireland, London. But, in a United Kingdom, no 1 vote counts more than any other. Because it would not be a United Kingdom. The use of the word "Britain" is designed to cause offence. Because Loyalists largely voted to Leave. And Nationalists to Remain.
I have family members on both sides of that particular debate. You may well think everything is simple. It's a battle that has been going on for well over 150 years. And Brexit is just 1 of many, many opportunities for that to continue.
UK halts trade negotiations with Canada over hormones in beef ban
Negotiations between the UK and Canada on a post-Brexit trade deal have broken down after nearly two years, following a row over beef and cheese.
Canada has been pushing for the UK to relax a ban on hormone-treated beef, which its producers say in effect shuts them out of the British market.
The UK have concerns about 245% import taxes Canada put at the start of the year on British cheese.
The pause in talks mean British car firms could also face higher tariffs.
It will also mean the UK's trading terms with Canada will now be worse than when it was part of the EU's deal with the country.
Minette Batters, president of the National Farmers' Union of England and Wales, said she was glad the UK government had not "given way" on hormone-treated beef.
But the British Chambers of Commerce (BCC) and the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT) described the news as unwelcome.
Kemi Badenoch pulls rug from under Justin Trudeau to stand up for UK in trade deal row
Years of negotiations have ended in a post-Brexit trade deal between the UK and Canada collapsing after Kemi Badenoch refused to budge on rules for meat and cheese trade.
Both sides have exchanged barbed words after talks - which had lasted for more than two years - were halted yesterday. Britain is Canada's third largest, single-country trading partner at over 46 billion Canadian dollars (£27billion)-a-year.
Business and Trade Committee Chair Liam Byrne accused the government of trying to create trade policies on "bluff and bluster".
He said: "The Government has learned a lesson - trade negotiations are tough, even with close friends like Canada. There are difficult trade-offs and both sides have their minimum demands and red lines."
"Hubris has now collided with cold, hard reality. Having tried to run trade policy on bluff and bluster, the Government is waking up to the fact that we can't just churn out free trade agreements on a conveyor belt - unless we keep caving in and just give other countries everything they want every time."
The SDLP is 1 of the 2 main Irish Nationalist Parties, whose political position is for a unified Ireland under Dublin rule. In the shorter term, they seek to reduce UK power, and increase Ireland's power, over NI. They make no secret of that. That is their official Party line.
This is the fundamental problem within NI. What pleases 1 side will almost inevitably displease the other.
The "compromise" between the UK and Ireland involves transfer of various powers and influence from Belfast/London to Dublin.
I'm not saying that is wrong. What I am saying is that every "solution" will enrage a portion of the residents of NI.
What do you think she means when she says "reconcile our geography"?
I took it as a statement of fact. The situation is surely the result of the only compromise available, when you consider the geography, economy, and the Brexit that Britain chose. I took the geography bit, merely meant that they share an island with EU members.
Nothing said by pretty much everyone, on all sides of the debate in NI, is a statement of fact. As an example, she deliberately chose the word "Britain" rather than the UK. Because NI is not part of Great Britain. We are a United Kingdom. Which means that the majority of the United Kingdom got to vote and form a Majority as to whether we got to leave.
Some Regions voted to Remain. Scotland, Northern Ireland, London. But, in a United Kingdom, no 1 vote counts more than any other. Because it would not be a United Kingdom. The use of the word "Britain" is designed to cause offence. Because Loyalists largely voted to Leave. And Nationalists to Remain.
I have family members on both sides of that particular debate. You may well think everything is simple. It's a battle that has been going on for well over 150 years. And Brexit is just 1 of many, many opportunities for that to continue.
Why cheese, fish and flowers could all soon cost more because of new Brexit rules
New Brexit border controls will leave British consumers and businesses facing more than £500m in increased costs and possible delays - as well as shortages of food and fresh flowers imported from the European Union.
The government's modelling says the new controls will cost industry £330m, while the grocery industry has warned that £200m could be added to fresh fruit and vegetable prices should checks be introduced in the future. There is also the prospect of delays caused by inspections of faulty paperwork, which could derail supply chains that rely entirely on fast turnaround of goods.
British importers have told Sky News that the new rules, which have already been delayed five times in three years, will add up to 17% to shipping costs, leading to higher prices for consumers.
European companies and industry groups say the controls are unnecessary as they replicate checks already made in the EU, and that Brexit is adding bureaucracy and cost to dealing with the UK.
The new import controls are a consequence of Britain having left both the single market and the customs union when the trade and co-operation deal with the EU came into force in January 2021.
While UK exporters to Europe were immediately subject to customs rules, the British government waived import controls to avoid damaging the economy and food supply.
On five occasions since 2021 ministers planned and then cancelled their introduction, in part because of fears that interrupting food supplies from the EU would exacerbate the cost of living crisis.
Almost 80% of UK vegetable imports and 40% of fruit comes from Europe.
THAT THERE is exactly my point, you just ask questions, point out facts and repost newspaper headlines, you ask everybody what should we do, how should we fix this, how should that work etc.
I am still not sure of exactly what your point was. I was asking questions in order for you to clarify what you are saying. You said the Irish problem is never going away. I wasnt sure whether you meant the Irish problems caused by Brexit, as your post was about Brexit, or any other Irish problems that werent.
Just probing little cracks and making huge fissures because it suits your purpose.
Which purpose?
All Remain supporters do is highlight how awful Britain is since Brexit.
Really?
Nobody says "Well I'm totally peed off that we left but let's make the best of it"
I dont think there is any other option.
For many of us it was awful pre Brexit so as I have said many times, it doesn't bother me. Nothings changed, nothing will change. I live in an area of poverty and deprivation, it was like that before Brexit, it's like that after Brexit and I imagine it will remain so until Armageddon, although you might be hard pressed to tell the difference.
You are just making my point that many people voted to leave due to the fact their lives were not going well. As nothing has changed, has it not yet dawned on you that the reasons that it was not going well had little to do with the EU.
Ok Tony, I'm giving you an unlimited budget and every resource at your disposal. Short of rejoining, how would you go about repairing things?
I dont think it is that simple. Leaving meant that we lost all the benefits of being members. So they have gone. I suppose the most sensible thing we could do is to try and get the whole of the UK back into the SM/CU, rather than just NI. That would solve the Irish Sea border problem, and plug a bit of the hole in the economy. I am not sure if this would be still possible. As a quote in one of the recent articles I have posted said that, Brexit continues to be a process, not a one-off event.
Yes of course the younger generation will be in favour.
As I described them earlier, full of ideology, lacking in real world experience and understanding and wanting to cancel anything that offends their delicate sensibilities, whilst dictating how others should think, feel and act.
Thank God that I will be off the mortal coil before the Gen Z's get to run things.
Or maybe they are just less biased.
'Legendary' UK seaside town facing chaos as new EU rules threaten to block entrance
The SDLP is 1 of the 2 main Irish Nationalist Parties, whose political position is for a unified Ireland under Dublin rule. In the shorter term, they seek to reduce UK power, and increase Ireland's power, over NI. They make no secret of that. That is their official Party line.
This is the fundamental problem within NI. What pleases 1 side will almost inevitably displease the other.
The "compromise" between the UK and Ireland involves transfer of various powers and influence from Belfast/London to Dublin.
I'm not saying that is wrong. What I am saying is that every "solution" will enrage a portion of the residents of NI.
What do you think she means when she says "reconcile our geography"?
I took it as a statement of fact. The situation is surely the result of the only compromise available, when you consider the geography, economy, and the Brexit that Britain chose. I took the geography bit, merely meant that they share an island with EU members.
Nothing said by pretty much everyone, on all sides of the debate in NI, is a statement of fact. As an example, she deliberately chose the word "Britain" rather than the UK. Because NI is not part of Great Britain. We are a United Kingdom. Which means that the majority of the United Kingdom got to vote and form a Majority as to whether we got to leave.
Some Regions voted to Remain. Scotland, Northern Ireland, London. But, in a United Kingdom, no 1 vote counts more than any other. Because it would not be a United Kingdom. The use of the word "Britain" is designed to cause offence. Because Loyalists largely voted to Leave. And Nationalists to Remain.
I have family members on both sides of that particular debate. You may well think everything is simple. It's a battle that has been going on for well over 150 years. And Brexit is just 1 of many, many opportunities for that to continue.
DUP deal: firm progress or fig leaf?
From a hardline unionist’s point of view what’s on offer is far from perfect, as the Irish Sea border will prevail.
From a moderate unionist’s viewpoint, it’s not ideal either but then they’re also likely to acknowledge that we live in an imperfect world and that post-Brexit Northern Ireland is incompatible with a binary solution that would create any barriers, trade or otherwise, with the Republic.
The main plank of what the DUP has secured is seemingly a reboot of the deal first touted by former prime minister Theresa May some five years ago.
The British government, in what is another row back from a hard Brexit, plans to limit any future divergence betweeen its own regulatory standards and those of the EU. This is also the likely direction of travel for the Labour administration when it comes to power.
It’s a move that is generally supported by pragmatic manufacturers across the UK but is unlikely to find favour within the hard-right European Research Group. The DUP feared greater regulatory divergence would damage trade between the north and Britain because the two regimes were likely to differ increasingly.
However, assurances from the British government and amended legislation would meet the criteria for at least one of the DUP’s seven tests.
Sorry Mark @TheEdge949 . I only just noticed these, when looking back at previous comments. They seem to have disappeared in the posting of them.
YOU KNOW THAT OPTIONS WERE NOT MADE AVAILABLE ON THE BALLOT, IT WAS A SIMPLE IN OR OUT. PERHAPS REMAIN COCKED UP THERE
Really, I wasnt aware that remain was responsible for organising the ballot paper?
NO OF COURSE YOU DONT. BOTH SIDES CONTINUALLY LOOK FOR A REASON TO TAKE THEIR BALL HOME AND CURRENTLY THE HARD BORDER IS THE EXCUSE BUT WE BOTH KNOW THAT THE TWO SIDES WILL NEVER ACCEPT GOVERNANCE FROM THE OTHER.
The hard border in Ireland is not possible because of the GFA. I therefore think that it cannot be described as an excuse. What we are left with is the only option that is available. I can see why Unionists would object to the border. The DUP want to have their cake, and eat it. They want the border removed, not to come under any EU rules, and retain access to the single market. Good luck with that.
THATS PERHAPS BECAUSE WE DONT NEED FEEL THE TO INSULT THEM, WE'VE WLKED AWAY AND THEY ARE A LITTLE PEEVED AT US
I am not having that. You said this,
The EU itself is absolutely mortified that we have left and whilst they would give their eye teeth for Britain to rejoin, act like a petulant child and hurl insults whilst spitefully looking to undermine everything. They've basically scratched all our records before handing them back.
I merely pointed out that all the insults seem to be coming from our side.
I DON'T KNOW THAT'S NOT MY JOB, YOU TELL ME. WHEN I DECIDE TO TAKE MY CAR IN FOR REPAIR I DON'T EXPECT TO HAVE TO TELL THE MECHANIC WHAT TO DO TO MAKE THE FAULT BETTER. I TELL HIM THE PROBLEM AND LEAVE IT TO HIM TO FIX, THAT'S HIS JOB
I just wondered in you had any specific ideas on any improvements that could be made.
You said this,
As for those charged with making Brexit work, if they actually stopped being pompous and arrogant and acknowledged that they now have an imperfect situation which requires real work, effort and compromise then things might start to improve.
Well it has been over 7 years since the referendum, and 3 years since we actually left. There were benefits that we enjoyed from our membership, which we have now obviously lost. A number of PMs, Cabinets, and Brexit Ministers, have attempted to negotiate, and renegotiate the best deal we could get. Although we have ended up with the Brexit we chose. I think the real point is that there is a limit to what could be achieved as non members.
WELL, THE YOUNG NEVER MAKE A BAD DECISION DO THEY. SO THATS ALRIGHT THEN.
That is a silly thing to say. As I said earlier they are probably just less biased than the oldies, and dont blame the EU for stuff they are not responsible for. I find it remarkable that the Tories use the "Stronger Together" argument in relation to Scottish Independence, but the opposite in the case of the EU.
Sophy Ridge We’re told Brexit is done… but is it?
Nearly eight years on… it’s hard to see how Brexit has been completed. If it were a computer game, I’m not even sure we’d be at the boss level yet
The problems that Brexit has created would be a whole lot easier to resolve if the various parties stopped being morons and actually moved forward instead of widening every small crack into a chasm to highlight and suit their own agendas.
But of course Remoaners will do everything to make it fail so that they can wave their silly blue and yellow flags and denounce anything British as 2nd class and unsuitable whilst championing the often lamentable European ideal as the benchmark.
The Irish problem is never going away, anybody who believes that there is any long term workable solution is misguided. Both sides are unfortunately irrevocably divided. Both Unionist and Loyalist parties now have different ends of the same stick to beat the Government with.
The EU itself is absolutely mortified that we have left and whilst they would give their eye teeth for Britain to rejoin, act like a petulant child and hurl insults whilst spitefully looking to undermine everything. They've basically scratched all our records before handing them back
As for those charged with making Brexit work, if they actually stopped being pompous and arrogant and acknowledged that they now have an imperfect situation which requires real work, effort and compromise then things might start to improve.
One thing that does strike me as ironic is that many of the younger population rail at the history of Britain and it's empirical past and yet seem only too happy to push toward building another empire albeit under a different flag.
Sky's Sophy Ridge Savagely Sums Up 4 Years Of Brexit In 90-Second Speech
Sky’sSophy Ridge just obliterated all the Brexit problems we are still facing on the fourth anniversary of the UK’s official departure from the EU.
While Rishi Sunak’s official spokesperson recently praised the UK’s newfound “Brexit freedoms” and ex-PM Boris Johnson celebrated four years without the EU, there’s no denying Brexit continues to cast a shadow over British politics.
Almost eight years after Brits voted to leave the bloc, and exactly four years since we finally left it, it is far from resolved.
In fact, as Ridge noted last night, there are still many promises yet to be fulfilled and ongoing crises which Downing Street has not figured out how to resolve.
For example, while it looks like power-sharing in Stormont’s Northern Ireland Assembly is about to be restored after a long-running Brexit row, the issue at the heart of the conflict remains.
Ridge noted: “Where do you put the post-Brexit border between the EU and the UK?
“On the island of Ireland? Down the Irish Sea? And this is a problem that hasn’t been, and maybe can never be resolved.”
She continued: “And it’s not the only thing on the outstanding Brexit to-do list, either.
“For many, the reason for voting to leave the EU was to take back control of our border and frankly to bring down net migration.”
But Ridge noted how the Office for National Statistics projected that the UK population will grow to 74m in the next decade or so – including an extra 6.1m people through net migration.
“So, if Brexit was about controlling our borders, well, that hasn’t been done either,” the presenter said.
Ridge then listed a handful of other ways Brexit still has not delivered on the promises the Vote Leave campaign made.
She said: “Whether it’s though long promised trade deals, a no tax economy, freedom from the grip of European courts, or even something as simple as working out where our trade borders are, nearly eight years on, it’s hard to see how Brexit has been completed.”
Only now can we properly see what an absolute mess Boris made of all this.
Brexit continues to be a process, not a one-off event.
Boris is a compulsive liar. Although I wouldnt totally blame him for all the difficulties we face today. Even though he continually lied about the consequences of leaving.
The difficulties in NI stem from leaving the EU, or the Brexit that we chose. Everybody knew there would have to be a border between us and the EU. Everybody also knew that it couldnt be on the island Ireland. Therefore the Irish Sea. Where else? The only problem with this was that an Irish Sea border left NI on the wrong side. They are on the EU side. This was pointless unless NI could stay in the SM/CU. This meant that NI is in two customs territories, and obligated to follow the rules of both, despite the fact they obviously differ. Guaranteed to cause difficulties. Although it seems that this is what we are stuck with. It was predictable that Unionists would object to a border between NI, and the rest of the UK. On leaving the UK would have a choice of aligning with EU trade rules, and creating less friction, or diverging and causing more. The plan was to diverge, and enable us to do trade deals all over the world. This doesnt seem to have worked so well so far. Obviously the more we diverge in future, will mean causing more friction, and more checks will be required. Hence the quote about Brexit being a process. In my view it will never be "done".
All the details of the latest plan havent come out yet, but it seems that Sunak has committed the UK to remain more aligned with the EU to reduce friction. Assuming he has, that will be another u-turn on the original plan.
I blame Boris for a lot of the mess, but not the geography.
I also believe that the EU have bent over backwards to accommodate us, a view not shared by some on this forum.
I am not going to go through all the reasons for us leaving, but taking control of our borders didnt work out so well, did it?. Taking control of our money just meant that the country has less. I am not going on and on, or mention any buses, Sophie Ridge sums up where we are today, much better than I ever could in the 90 second video below.
Comments
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/brexit-benefits-require-eu-divergence-says-badenoch/ar-BB1hfaAJ?ocid=msedgntp&pc=NMTS&cvid=1be12ad1f56e4521bae83815615ed699&ei=65
The first points out that to minimise trade friction between GB/NI we have to remain aligned with the EU rules.
The second one pointing out that to make Brexit worthwhile, and maximise the so called Brexit benefits, we have to diverge.
Needless to say, we cant do both.
If Britain diverges from EU rules, the number of checks necessary on British goods crossing the Brexit border to Northern Ireland could increase, which critics say will harm trade.
It raises the prospect that new laws which mean Britain diverges from Brussels could be blocked.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/rishi-sunak-offers-sacrifice-brexit-212541556.html
Kemi Badenoch has suggested the UK needs to diverge from EU rules to make Brexit worthwhile, amid concerns from Tory backbenchers that changes will be limited as part of efforts to restore devolved government in Northern Ireland.
The Business Secretary did not deny when challenged that the Government could make concessions on regulation to reduce trade barriers with Northern Ireland.
She said she was not a participant to Northern Ireland’s “political process” and so could not comment, but also stressed the need to find a “comparative advantage” over the EU in terms of regulation in order to “seize the benefits of Brexit”.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/brexit-benefits-require-eu-divergence-says-badenoch/ar-BB1hfaAJ?ocid=msedgntp&pc=NMTS&cvid=1be12ad1f56e4521bae83815615ed699&ei=69
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/rishi-sunak-s-brexit-wins-on-eu-divergence-are-symbolic-rather-than-substantive-a-new-report-reveals/ar-BB1hfCDM?ocid=msedgntp&pc=NMTS&cvid=1f29c91869f0475c914a26db70f2808d&ei=37
Negotiations between the UK and Canada on a post-Brexit trade deal have broken down after nearly two years, following a row over beef and cheese.
Canada has been pushing for the UK to relax a ban on hormone-treated beef, which its producers say in effect shuts them out of the British market.
The UK have concerns about 245% import taxes Canada put at the start of the year on British cheese.
The pause in talks mean British car firms could also face higher tariffs.
It will also mean the UK's trading terms with Canada will now be worse than when it was part of the EU's deal with the country.
Minette Batters, president of the National Farmers' Union of England and Wales, said she was glad the UK government had not "given way" on hormone-treated beef.
But the British Chambers of Commerce (BCC) and the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT) described the news as unwelcome.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68098177
Kemi Badenoch pulls rug from under Justin Trudeau to stand up for UK in trade deal row
Years of negotiations have ended in a post-Brexit trade deal between the UK and Canada collapsing after Kemi Badenoch refused to budge on rules for meat and cheese trade.
Both sides have exchanged barbed words after talks - which had lasted for more than two years - were halted yesterday. Britain is Canada's third largest, single-country trading partner at over 46 billion Canadian dollars (£27billion)-a-year.
Business and Trade Committee Chair Liam Byrne accused the government of trying to create trade policies on "bluff and bluster".
He said: "The Government has learned a lesson - trade negotiations are tough, even with close friends like Canada. There are difficult trade-offs and both sides have their minimum demands and red lines."
"Hubris has now collided with cold, hard reality. Having tried to run trade policy on bluff and bluster, the Government is waking up to the fact that we can't just churn out free trade agreements on a conveyor belt - unless we keep caving in and just give other countries everything they want every time."
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/kemi-badenoch-pulls-rug-from-under-justin-trudeau-to-stand-up-for-uk-in-trade-deal-row/ar-BB1hj0O9?ocid=msedgntp&pc=NMTS&cvid=a54c8bac5ea14106a0ced652ab8e0140&ei=80
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/parma-hams-spanish-chorizos-disappear-112426754.html
THAT THERE is exactly my point, you just ask questions, point out facts and repost newspaper headlines, you ask everybody what should we do, how should we fix this, how should that work etc.
I am still not sure of exactly what your point was.
I was asking questions in order for you to clarify what you are saying.
You said the Irish problem is never going away.
I wasnt sure whether you meant the Irish problems caused by Brexit, as your post was about Brexit, or any other Irish problems that werent.
Just probing little cracks and making huge fissures because it suits your purpose.
Which purpose?
All Remain supporters do is highlight how awful Britain is since Brexit.
Really?
Nobody says "Well I'm totally peed off that we left but let's make the best of it"
I dont think there is any other option.
For many of us it was awful pre Brexit so as I have said many times, it doesn't bother me. Nothings changed, nothing will change. I live in an area of poverty and deprivation, it was like that before Brexit, it's like that after Brexit and I imagine it will remain so until Armageddon, although you might be hard pressed to tell the difference.
You are just making my point that many people voted to leave due to the fact their lives were not going well.
As nothing has changed, has it not yet dawned on you that the reasons that it was not going well had little to do with the EU.
Ok Tony, I'm giving you an unlimited budget and every resource at your disposal. Short of rejoining, how would you go about repairing things?
I dont think it is that simple.
Leaving meant that we lost all the benefits of being members.
So they have gone.
I suppose the most sensible thing we could do is to try and get the whole of the UK back into the SM/CU, rather than just NI.
That would solve the Irish Sea border problem, and plug a bit of the hole in the economy.
I am not sure if this would be still possible.
As a quote in one of the recent articles I have posted said that,
Brexit continues to be a process, not a one-off event.
Yes of course the younger generation will be in favour.
As I described them earlier, full of ideology, lacking in real world experience and understanding and wanting to cancel anything that offends their delicate sensibilities, whilst dictating how others should think, feel and act.
Thank God that I will be off the mortal coil before the Gen Z's get to run things.
Or maybe they are just less biased.
'Legendary' UK seaside town facing chaos as new EU rules threaten to block entrance
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/travel/news/legendary-uk-seaside-town-facing-chaos-as-new-eu-rules-threaten-to-block-entrance/ar-BB1hkGdK?ocid=msedgntp&pc=NMTS&cvid=5a83fac3e577446a80cde256d7aa2f53&ei=63
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/no-us-trade-deal-under-starmer-labour-s-shadow-business-secretary-douses-hopes-of-post-brexit-agreement-even-if-donald-trump-becomes-president-again/ar-BB1hnHPz?ocid=msedgntp&pc=NMTS&cvid=2320c5360e1c4821a3e82a00f7b06f2c&ei=10
From a hardline unionist’s point of view what’s on offer is far from perfect, as the Irish Sea border will prevail.
From a moderate unionist’s viewpoint, it’s not ideal either but then they’re also likely to acknowledge that we live in an imperfect world and that post-Brexit Northern Ireland is incompatible with a binary solution that would create any barriers, trade or otherwise, with the Republic.
The main plank of what the DUP has secured is seemingly a reboot of the deal first touted by former prime minister Theresa May some five years ago.
The British government, in what is another row back from a hard Brexit, plans to limit any future divergence betweeen its own regulatory standards and those of the EU. This is also the likely direction of travel for the Labour administration when it comes to power.
It’s a move that is generally supported by pragmatic manufacturers across the UK but is unlikely to find favour within the hard-right European Research Group. The DUP feared greater regulatory divergence would damage trade between the north and Britain because the two regimes were likely to differ increasingly.
However, assurances from the British government and amended legislation would meet the criteria for at least one of the DUP’s seven tests.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/dup-deal-firm-progress-or-fig-leaf/ar-BB1hrvl9?ocid=msedgntp&pc=NMTS&cvid=7826f1e056944ad9802dcf154cfb3570&ei=83
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/dup-surrender-deal-betrays-spirit-111502455.html
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/brexit-trade-checks-mean-old-143346212.html
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/brexit-people-damning-verdict-four-064534312.html
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/minister-brushes-off-brexit-check-082635513.html
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/sinn-fein-claims-irish-reunification-within-touching-distance-after-dup-ends-stormont-deadlock/ar-BB1hv9Kd?ocid=msedgntp&pc=NMTS&cvid=66d167aba328404eb70c369e92717e6b&ei=64
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/what-does-the-brexit-legacy-mean-for-the-conservatives/ar-BB1hwLCH?ocid=msedgntp&pc=NMTS&cvid=66d167aba328404eb70c369e92717e6b&ei=52
I only just noticed these, when looking back at previous comments.
They seem to have disappeared in the posting of them.
YOU KNOW THAT OPTIONS WERE NOT MADE AVAILABLE ON THE BALLOT, IT WAS A SIMPLE IN OR OUT. PERHAPS REMAIN COCKED UP THERE
Really, I wasnt aware that remain was responsible for organising the ballot paper?
NO OF COURSE YOU DONT. BOTH SIDES CONTINUALLY LOOK FOR A REASON TO TAKE THEIR BALL HOME AND CURRENTLY THE HARD BORDER IS THE EXCUSE BUT WE BOTH KNOW THAT THE TWO SIDES WILL NEVER ACCEPT GOVERNANCE FROM THE OTHER.
The hard border in Ireland is not possible because of the GFA.
I therefore think that it cannot be described as an excuse.
What we are left with is the only option that is available.
I can see why Unionists would object to the border.
The DUP want to have their cake, and eat it.
They want the border removed, not to come under any EU rules, and retain access to the single market.
Good luck with that.
THATS PERHAPS BECAUSE WE DONT NEED FEEL THE TO INSULT THEM, WE'VE WLKED AWAY AND THEY ARE A LITTLE PEEVED AT US
I am not having that.
You said this,
The EU itself is absolutely mortified that we have left and whilst they would give their eye teeth for Britain to rejoin, act like a petulant child and hurl insults whilst spitefully looking to undermine everything. They've basically scratched all our records before handing them back.
I merely pointed out that all the insults seem to be coming from our side.
I DON'T KNOW THAT'S NOT MY JOB, YOU TELL ME. WHEN I DECIDE TO TAKE MY CAR IN FOR REPAIR I DON'T EXPECT TO HAVE TO TELL THE MECHANIC WHAT TO DO TO MAKE THE FAULT BETTER. I TELL HIM THE PROBLEM AND LEAVE IT TO HIM TO FIX, THAT'S HIS JOB
I just wondered in you had any specific ideas on any improvements that could be made.
You said this,
As for those charged with making Brexit work, if they actually stopped being pompous and arrogant and acknowledged that they now have an imperfect situation which requires real work, effort and compromise then things might start to improve.
Well it has been over 7 years since the referendum, and 3 years since we actually left.
There were benefits that we enjoyed from our membership, which we have now obviously lost.
A number of PMs, Cabinets, and Brexit Ministers, have attempted to negotiate, and renegotiate the best deal we could get.
Although we have ended up with the Brexit we chose.
I think the real point is that there is a limit to what could be achieved as non members.
WELL, THE YOUNG NEVER MAKE A BAD DECISION DO THEY. SO THATS ALRIGHT THEN.
That is a silly thing to say.
As I said earlier they are probably just less biased than the oldies, and dont blame the EU for stuff they are not responsible for.
I find it remarkable that the Tories use the "Stronger Together" argument in relation to Scottish Independence, but the opposite in the case of the EU.
Sophy Ridge
We’re told Brexit is done… but is it?
Nearly eight years on… it’s hard to see how Brexit has been completed. If it were a computer game, I’m not even sure we’d be at the boss level yet
Sky’sSophy Ridge just obliterated all the Brexit problems we are still facing on the fourth anniversary of the UK’s official departure from the EU.
While Rishi Sunak’s official spokesperson recently praised the UK’s newfound “Brexit freedoms” and ex-PM Boris Johnson celebrated four years without the EU, there’s no denying Brexit continues to cast a shadow over British politics.
Almost eight years after Brits voted to leave the bloc, and exactly four years since we finally left it, it is far from resolved.
In fact, as Ridge noted last night, there are still many promises yet to be fulfilled and ongoing crises which Downing Street has not figured out how to resolve.
For example, while it looks like power-sharing in Stormont’s Northern Ireland Assembly is about to be restored after a long-running Brexit row, the issue at the heart of the conflict remains.
Ridge noted: “Where do you put the post-Brexit border between the EU and the UK?
“On the island of Ireland? Down the Irish Sea? And this is a problem that hasn’t been, and maybe can never be resolved.”
She continued: “And it’s not the only thing on the outstanding Brexit to-do list, either.
“For many, the reason for voting to leave the EU was to take back control of our border and frankly to bring down net migration.”
But Ridge noted how the Office for National Statistics projected that the UK population will grow to 74m in the next decade or so – including an extra 6.1m people through net migration.
“So, if Brexit was about controlling our borders, well, that hasn’t been done either,” the presenter said.
Ridge then listed a handful of other ways Brexit still has not delivered on the promises the Vote Leave campaign made.
She said: “Whether it’s though long promised trade deals, a no tax economy, freedom from the grip of European courts, or even something as simple as working out where our trade borders are, nearly eight years on, it’s hard to see how Brexit has been completed.”
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/skys-sophy-ridge-savagely-sums-122254083.html
Only now can we properly see what an absolute mess Boris made of all this.
Boris is a compulsive liar.
Although I wouldnt totally blame him for all the difficulties we face today.
Even though he continually lied about the consequences of leaving.
The difficulties in NI stem from leaving the EU, or the Brexit that we chose.
Everybody knew there would have to be a border between us and the EU.
Everybody also knew that it couldnt be on the island Ireland.
Therefore the Irish Sea.
Where else?
The only problem with this was that an Irish Sea border left NI on the wrong side.
They are on the EU side.
This was pointless unless NI could stay in the SM/CU.
This meant that NI is in two customs territories, and obligated to follow the rules of both, despite the fact they obviously differ.
Guaranteed to cause difficulties.
Although it seems that this is what we are stuck with.
It was predictable that Unionists would object to a border between NI, and the rest of the UK.
On leaving the UK would have a choice of aligning with EU trade rules, and creating less friction, or diverging and causing more.
The plan was to diverge, and enable us to do trade deals all over the world.
This doesnt seem to have worked so well so far.
Obviously the more we diverge in future, will mean causing more friction, and more checks will be required.
Hence the quote about Brexit being a process.
In my view it will never be "done".
All the details of the latest plan havent come out yet, but it seems that Sunak has committed the UK to remain more aligned with the EU to reduce friction.
Assuming he has, that will be another u-turn on the original plan.
I blame Boris for a lot of the mess, but not the geography.
I also believe that the EU have bent over backwards to accommodate us, a view not shared by some on this forum.
I am not going to go through all the reasons for us leaving, but taking control of our borders didnt work out so well, did it?.
Taking control of our money just meant that the country has less.
I am not going on and on, or mention any buses, Sophie Ridge sums up where we are today, much better than I ever could in the 90 second video below.