I always found this original decision to be a strange one.
3 Police Officers, rightly or wrongly, said they believed they could smell cannabis prior to the stop. There was never any suggestion about the 3 concocting a story afterwards.
1 was believed. And 2 were supposedly lying.
Without wishing to sound obvious, in this instance either 3 people were lying. Or 3 people were telling the truth. Cannot sensibly claim on these facts that only 2 were lying.
They did not have to be right about the existence of cannabis. Just to have an honest and reasonable suspicion that there was.
Anyone believe that, in their own job, if they make a reasonable judgment call that later turns out to be wrong, that warrants Summary Dismissal?
Many play the Black card rather than the Red.....hic!
Many see Red when it's Black....sob!
That is an enormously complex issue. Where an awful lot of people, on both sides, only see 1 side of a 2-sided story.
Racial profiling is wrong. Wrong to target people purely based on the colour of their skin.
But it is not quite that simple.
That most certainly does not mean that certain nationalities driving certain vehicles should automatically be stopped. But, similarly, it would be naive to expect a Policeman not to look closer at, say, a £40,000 vehicle being driven in a Deprived area. And that someone in their 20s in such a vehicle might be more likely to be a criminal than a businessman in his 60s.
I'm not saying that is all-important. It is not. But any non-racist, competent policeman is going to have a whole set of different things that may increase or decrease the risk of criminality.
Last year Miss Williams (the lady in this case) was banned from driving for failing to identify the driver of a car wanted for three alleged driving offences. Maybe this is the sort of thing that leads police to target cars she happens to be in. Nothing to do with her colour.
I've just seen the original Sky coverage, consisting of police dash cam, police personal cameras and the two athletes' own phone footage. From that it's quite clear to see why they pulled the car over, as they did the following:
1. Cut the corner in front of the police van, almost completely on the wrong side of the road. 2. Did 32+ in a 20 zone, speeding away from the police van which was now following. 3. Didn't respond to the blues behind them and then avoided the police van and drove off in the opposite direction when initially stopped by the van showing blues. 4. Got aggressive and animated when finally pulled over.
How does anyone think that is racial profiling? Did the police make them do any of that?
I would imagine that if they had not cut the corner they wouldn't have been followed, if they hadn't sped off they wouldn't have been stopped and if they hadn't deliberately avoided the first stop then they wouldn't have been met with the force that was used to control them when they were finally stopped.
And all of that resulted in two police officers losing their jobs. A decision that has quite rightly been overturned.
I've just seen the original Sky coverage, consisting of police dash cam, police personal cameras and the two athletes' own phone footage. From that it's quite clear to see why they pulled the car over, as they did the following:
1. Cut the corner in front of the police van, almost completely on the wrong side of the road. 2. Did 32+ in a 20 zone, speeding away from the police van which was now following. 3. Didn't respond to the blues behind them and then avoided the police van and drove off in the opposite direction when initially stopped by the van showing blues. 4. Got aggressive and animated when finally pulled over.
How does anyone think that is racial profiling? Did the police make them do any of that?
I would imagine that if they had not cut the corner they wouldn't have been followed, if they hadn't sped off they wouldn't have been stopped and if they hadn't deliberately avoided the first stop then they wouldn't have been met with the force that was used to control them when they were finally stopped.
And all of that resulted in two police officers losing their jobs. A decision that has quite rightly been overturned.
Im quite glad you found this and shared it here.
Its been sitting awkward with me that they are challenging the reversal of the dismissal of the Met officers. This apparent appeal seems more a vindictive action than wanting to 'right a wrong'.
The officers going through the process losing of their jobs is ordeal and punishment enough, getting their jobs back will do little to repair the **** way they have been treated.
If Miss Williams and her partner said they were disappointed with the dismissal reversal and decided to put it behind them I would have thought more highly of them, but to want the officers to suffer perpetually shows their character or maybe its just one of them.
Even her statement over the previous refusal to nominate the driver of the driving offense smacks of not taking responsibility for somethings shes done, its starts off apologising and ends on blaming someone else.
"I understand this is totally my fault, I shouldn't have relied on somebody else to fill out the form," she said.
Total insincerity, hopefully any appeal judge will see through this.
Comments
3 Police Officers, rightly or wrongly, said they believed they could smell cannabis prior to the stop. There was never any suggestion about the 3 concocting a story afterwards.
1 was believed. And 2 were supposedly lying.
Without wishing to sound obvious, in this instance either 3 people were lying. Or 3 people were telling the truth. Cannot sensibly claim on these facts that only 2 were lying.
They did not have to be right about the existence of cannabis. Just to have an honest and reasonable suspicion that there was.
Anyone believe that, in their own job, if they make a reasonable judgment call that later turns out to be wrong, that warrants Summary Dismissal?
Many see Red when it's Black....sob!
Racial profiling is wrong. Wrong to target people purely based on the colour of their skin.
But it is not quite that simple.
That most certainly does not mean that certain nationalities driving certain vehicles should automatically be stopped. But, similarly, it would be naive to expect a Policeman not to look closer at, say, a £40,000 vehicle being driven in a Deprived area. And that someone in their 20s in such a vehicle might be more likely to be a criminal than a businessman in his 60s.
I'm not saying that is all-important. It is not. But any non-racist, competent policeman is going to have a whole set of different things that may increase or decrease the risk of criminality.
1. Cut the corner in front of the police van, almost completely on the wrong side of the road.
2. Did 32+ in a 20 zone, speeding away from the police van which was now following.
3. Didn't respond to the blues behind them and then avoided the police van and drove off in the opposite direction when initially stopped by the van showing blues.
4. Got aggressive and animated when finally pulled over.
How does anyone think that is racial profiling? Did the police make them do any of that?
I would imagine that if they had not cut the corner they wouldn't have been followed, if they hadn't sped off they wouldn't have been stopped and if they hadn't deliberately avoided the first stop then they wouldn't have been met with the force that was used to control them when they were finally stopped.
And all of that resulted in two police officers losing their jobs. A decision that has quite rightly been overturned.
Its been sitting awkward with me that they are challenging the reversal of the dismissal of the Met officers. This apparent appeal seems more a vindictive action than wanting to 'right a wrong'.
The officers going through the process losing of their jobs is ordeal and punishment enough, getting their jobs back will do little to repair the **** way they have been treated.
If Miss Williams and her partner said they were disappointed with the dismissal reversal and decided to put it behind them I would have thought more highly of them, but to want the officers to suffer perpetually shows their character or maybe its just one of them.
Even her statement over the previous refusal to nominate the driver of the driving offense smacks of not taking responsibility for somethings shes done, its starts off apologising and ends on blaming someone else.
"I understand this is totally my fault, I shouldn't have relied on somebody else to fill out the form," she said.
Total insincerity, hopefully any appeal judge will see through this.