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Train owner pays £150m dividend while passengers swallow ticket price hikes

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  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 168,777


    If it were not for the ridiculous mess Government has made of "managing" or Rail services, there would be no need for Rolling Stock Leasing Businesses.

    However, at present it's IS a necessary evil die to short-termism & Government interference.

    If you gave me a list of 20 organisations to run ANY business, the Government would be 20th on every one.

    Leave business to businesses, it's what they do. And competition ensures they do it well. And if they make a few bob along the way, good luck to them. Profit generates spending.
  • EssexphilEssexphil Member Posts: 8,662
    Tikay10 said:



    If it were not for the ridiculous mess Government has made of "managing" or Rail services, there would be no need for Rolling Stock Leasing Businesses.

    However, at present it's IS a necessary evil die to short-termism & Government interference.

    If you gave me a list of 20 organisations to run ANY business, the Government would be 20th on every one.

    Leave business to businesses, it's what they do.
    And competition ensures they do it well. And if they make a few bob along the way, good luck to them. Profit generates spending.

    Disagree. It really isn't that simple. Any more than to claim everything should be Nationalised.

    Let's start with the Railways. Essentially, we have 3 different sets of businesses here:-

    1. The Rail Track
    2. Running the Trains and charging the passengers
    3. The leasing of the trains themselves

    None of this involves the sorts of businesses where there is any meaningful competition. There is 1 lot of Rail Track. The end. There is precisely zero competition between any of the Rail Franchises. And zero competition when it comes to the Leasing arrangements.

    There is 1 thing worse than a Monopoly. And that is an Oligopoly with zero competition. Same snouts. Only more of them. Coupled with losing economies of scale.

    Governments don't run businesses. They appoint Managers to do that. And are no better-and no worse-than Shareholders/Owners at that. Where I agree is the need to limit the amount of interference from Govts.

    There have been privatisations that have worked brilliantly. And the Railways are most definitely not 1 of them.
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 168,777


    Ha, well I think we can agree with your final sentence.

    For those not au-fait with Rolling Stock Leasing businesses, railway rolling stock (carriages, mainly) are very expensive & last a long time, certainly 40 or 50 years, so the cost can be written down over that period. However, TOC's (Train Operating Companies) are typically awarded short-term franchises, 5, 6, 7 or 10 years say. So they are kind of obliged to lease their rolling stock.

    As a further aside, most of these Leasing Businesses are actually banks, or subsidiaries of banks, as the business does require huge amounts of cash up front.
  • goldongoldon Member Posts: 8,985
    Hornby need to scale up. hic!

  • rabdenirorabdeniro Member Posts: 4,400
    Am trying to get some cheap train tickets to London, Sunday, Monday and Friday are ridiculous and thats with ma railcard.
    Scotrail (government owned) is so expensive its a joke, ah can travel from carlisle to Newcastle with northern rail (government owned) for £3.20, its roughly 50 miles, from ma home town to Glasgow is £9.90 and thats 25 miles.
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