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Is this a leak in my game?

CLIOKIDCLIOKID Member Posts: 783
edited May 2010 in The Poker Clinic
I seem to get myself into this situation quite regularly and now starting to think it is a big leak in my game (one of many I know ;)) . Short stackers always seem to bring out the worst in my play. How would you guys play this hand out?

Is there enough room for B/F? This might be a fairly standard stack off I don't know but seem to find similar spots quite regularly and I'm sure it's costing me a fair bit of moniez.
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
varney Small blind  £0.50 £0.50 £101.50
50_50call Big blind  £1.00 £1.50 £115.80
beaneh Sit out     
  Your hole cards
  • 10
  • 10
     
pkf Raise  £2.00 £3.50 £42.85
crobe Call  £2.00 £5.50 £18.65
CLIOKID Raise  £8.50 £14.00 £85.35
varney Fold     
50_50call Fold     
pkf Call  £6.50 £20.50 £36.35
crobe Fold     
Flop
   
  • 5
  • J
  • 6
     
pkf Check     
CLIOKID Bet  £15.38 £35.88 £69.97
pkf All-in  £36.35 £72.23 £0.00
CLIOKID Call  £20.97 £93.20 £49.00
pkf Show
  • J
  • Q
   
CLIOKID Show
  • 10
  • 10
   
Turn
   
  • 8
     
River
   
  • 8
     
pkf Win Two Pairs, Jacks and 8s £91.40  £91.40
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Comments

  • beanehbeaneh Member Posts: 4,079
    edited May 2010
    Once I re-raise i'm not folding the flop for that much into that much with just one over out there.
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  • Eagle26Eagle26 Member Posts: 431
    edited May 2010
    its one of these hands where u know your behind but you have to call anyway! so no its not a leak in your game i think 99% of players call this.
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  • beanehbeaneh Member Posts: 4,079
    edited May 2010
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game?:
    its one of these hands where u know your behind but you have to call anyway! so no its not a leak in your game i think 99% of players call this.
    Posted by Eagle26
    I doubt you are always behind when he ships it in on that flop tbh. he can have underpair kind of hands etc. maybe just overs aswell.
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  • Eagle26Eagle26 Member Posts: 431
    edited May 2010
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game?:
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game? : I doubt you are always behind when he ships it in on that flop tbh. he can have underpair kind of hands etc. maybe just overs aswell.
    Posted by beaneh
    do u just love disagreein with everything i say?? ok ill rephrase what i said - its one of these hands where there is a high chance your behind, but there is a possibility of him shovin with a hand your beatin! does it really make much difference either way?? its a call regardless
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  • beanehbeaneh Member Posts: 4,079
    edited May 2010
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game?:
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game? : do u just love disagreein with everything i say?? ok ill rephrase what i said - its one of these hands where there is a high chance your behind, but there is a possibility of him shovin with a hand your beatin! does it really make much difference either way?? its a call regardless
    Posted by Eagle26

    no not intentionally disagreeing. tis just that he's prob not folding much he plays that way preflop and we beat a whole load of pp's/over hands that may well still stack off on this dry of a board.
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  • Eagle26Eagle26 Member Posts: 431
    edited May 2010
    fair enough. personally i think that if he has a weaker hand he aint check raisin, he's shovin. surely he knows that he's gettin called regardless after the strong cbet. so makes no sense to check raise with a weaker hand. i know hes a short stack and short stacks only need a little piece of the board to shove. but from my experience u will normally find they shove the flop rather than check raisin if they only have a little piece of it.  
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  • CowgomooCowgomoo Member Posts: 749
    edited May 2010
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game?:
    fair enough. personally i think that if he has a weaker hand he aint check raisin, he's shovin. surely he knows that he's gettin called regardless after the strong cbet. so makes no sense to check raise with a weaker hand. i know hes a short stack and short stacks only need a little piece of the board to shove. but from my experience u will normally find they shove the flop rather than check raisin if they only have a little piece of it.  
    Posted by Eagle26
    It makes more sense to check/raise with weaker hands. Because if he has a weak hand and donk shoves, hes either going to get called by a stronger hand or he folds out any weaker hands like AK/AQ etc. Whereas if he checks he gets more money out of AK/AQ by check raising.
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  • DeuceAK_47DeuceAK_47 Member Posts: 381
    edited May 2010
    Do you always bet 3/4 pot in a 3bet pot?, my standard is 1/2..seems to get the same amount of folds.

    I have folded quite afew times in situations similar to this if the player is very passive as im usually always massively behind, i agree that they might donk bet all in with a slight piece of the board as this happens all the time, Cowgomoo's thinking is correct but generally the half stacks i come across are not good thinking players.
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  • scotty77scotty77 Member Posts: 4,970
    edited May 2010
    cant see too much wrong here.  say he has 88 then he prob plays it the same.

    loads of hands you are beating on that flop. if hes playing JQ like that then he is also playing KQ like that too so you cbet and take it down a lot of the time too

    just unlucky that he hit on a fairly dry flop.
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  • CLIOKIDCLIOKID Member Posts: 783
    edited May 2010
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game?:
    Do you always bet 3/4 pot in a 3bet pot?, my standard is 1/2..seems to get the same amount of folds. I have folded quite afew times in situations similar to this if the player is very passive as im usually always massively behind, i agree that they might donk bet all in with a slight piece of the board as this happens all the time, Cowgomoo's thinking is correct but generally the half stacks i come across are not good thinking players.
    Posted by DeuceAK-47
    Not always 3/4 no.

    Depends on situation TBH.

    It's hard to know what optimal bet size is in this situation.

    Half pot bet looks a bit weak, but could also induce villain to make a move.

    3/4 bet commits my stack a bit more and villain might need stronger holding to come back over the top.

    The original hand posted might not be the best example of the problems I seem to have. I tend to get it in with middle pair against short stackers probably too often as I think they are just betting/shipping with anything on flops and I don't think this is working in my favour.
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  • beanehbeaneh Member Posts: 4,079
    edited May 2010
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game?:
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game? : Not always 3/4 no. Depends on situation TBH. It's hard to know what optimal bet size is in this situation. Half pot bet looks a bit weak, but could also induce villain to make a move. 3/4 bet commits my stack a bit more and villain might need stronger holding to come back over the top. The original hand posted might not be the best example of the problems I seem to have. I tend to get it in with middle pair against short stackers probably too often as I think they are just betting/shipping with anything on flops and I don't think this is working in my favour.
    Posted by CLIOKID

    Dude join my club.

    I open raise and find myself shipped on by a shortstack with anywhere from 10-50 bbs and i'm just sitting there with my suited connector thinking, gooooood dammitttttt I DONT WANT TO FOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLD EURUURUURURUURUGHGHGHHHHHH ARRRRRR IN HOOOOOOOLD ONE TIME..................
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  • BooniconBoonicon Member Posts: 130
    edited May 2010
    I have thought long and hard and I cant see any different line here really. I could be tempted to C bet slightly smaller and fold to re raise but other comments suggest that this might not be a good fold?  I suppose this would depend on info on opponent, ie whether he is going to come over the top with less than top pair. 

    Interesting question, it seems like there should be a way out of an £90 pot with 2nd pair, but maybe not.
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  • phil12ukphil12uk Member Posts: 2,856
    edited May 2010
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game?:
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game? : Dude join my club. I open raise and find myself shipped on by a shortstack with anywhere from 10-50 bbs and i'm just sitting there with my suited connector thinking, gooooood dammitttttt I DONT WANT TO FOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLD EURUURUURURUURUGHGHGHHHHHH ARRRRRR IN HOOOOOOOLD ONE TIME..................
    Posted by beaneh

    LOL so true.............always so so hard to fight that 'lets gamble' urge'!!
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  • beanehbeaneh Member Posts: 4,079
    edited May 2010
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game?:
    In Response to Re: Is this a leak in my game? : LOL so true.............always so so hard to fight that 'lets gamble' urge'!!
    Posted by phil12uk

    Just click the button, even when you know you shouldn't it's such fun!
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  • DeuceAK_47DeuceAK_47 Member Posts: 381
    edited May 2010
    I blame you two for making short stack players on sky profitable ;-)
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