MTT DS have i overplayed it?

YOUNG_GUN

Right last 3 in DS and i had been chip leader most of the time picking good spots and then the shortstack of the 3 i come up against here. I have a feeling i have overplayed this here but thought as 3 handed good chance still, Please say whether you would have shoved in this spot??  i had been mixing up my raises and all ins now and again up to here. Villain had cracked up the pressure and been raising some pots before this to get back in it so i thought i would put the pressure on him

YOUNG_GUN	Small blind		3000.00	3000.00	62722.50
spornybol	Big blind		6000.00	9000.00	135582.50
	Your hole cards	4 A
Villain	Raise		18000.00	27000.00	44695.00
YOUNG_GUN	All-in		62722.50	89722.50	0.00
other	Fold
Villain	All-in		44695.00	134417.50	0.00
YOUNG_GUN	Unmatched bet		3027.50	131390.00	3027.50
YOUNG_GUN	Show	4 A
Villain	Show	K A
Flop
		J A 6
Turn
		Q
River
		6
Villain	Win	Two Pairs, Aces and 6s	131390.00		131390.00

Dudeskin8

After he makes it 3x preflop, I just snap fold. IMO you are never ahead of his range and if you are you're gambling when you don't need to.

Stueyh

Young Gun, I can totally understand your play if Villain has been raising a high number of pots and you suspect his range to be very wide. I've been in this spot several times lately and been caught as you have. The chances are that several times he's done this with Q 9s, K 10 etc, although you've just been caught by a genuine hand on this ocassion.

I suffer from doing this out of lack of patience in the latter stages, I don't know whether this came into your decision at all?

If you look at the figures though, he's unlikely to fold after comitting approx 40% of his stack and you've almost put your tournament on the line with A 4s, which is unlikely to be ahead and if it is your racing with alot of hands within his range.

In a perfect world and when playing well and patiently, I would be waiting for a better starting hand than this to push in this situation.

GaryQQQ

Yep, over played, especially with another player yet to act. I think I would need ATs+ or a medium to high pair to even consider shoving here (though any ace is always tempting if the villain is a maniac). Unlucky, you may have been going to the races while slightly ahead, but you found out you weren't the hard way. To be honest A4s isn't much better than 2 random cards.

waynec

I was once given a piece of advise by a Pro I was lucky enough to meet at my local casino; think very carefully before calling a raise with an A, K Q with a rag kicker more so in the blinds. However short handed as this table was not sure if this is correct but I would have folded pre myself.

YOUNG_GUN

Yeah i did think so, honestly didn't think he had a genuine hand here although on the face of it didn't realise he put 40% of his stack here so that would have made me fold had i noticed. I personally put the all in to get him to fold and if he didn't i thought i'd be ahead of his range, although didnt show any of the cards he was shoving with before i would have put him on Q or K. will think next time think a bit more, dont think its the worst possible move in this spot, but then again he is only going to call with a better hand here. Thought straight after wrong spot etc

Thanks for your opinons people i appreciate it

harvey23

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

 410,952,960  games     0.359 secs     1,144,715,766  games/sec

Board:
Dead: 

    equity     win     tie           pots won     pots tied   
Hand 0:     43.992%      42.24%     01.75%          173601033       7187405.00   { Ad4d }
Hand 1:     56.008%      54.26%     01.75%          222977117       7187405.00   { 22+, A8s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, A8o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo }




above I have given villian 20% of the top starting hands, you just behind that, I dont think you have much fold equity either when you shove. I dont think its the worst play since its 3 way donkment, and they could be shoving with hands like KJ KQ etc which you beat.  But just because your kicker is so low, i think its a fold, becuase you way behind pairs from 55-99, where if you had A9 or something least you would be flipping instead of being a 75/35 dog with a4 vs 55

YOUNG_GUN

In Response to Re: MTT DS have i overplayed it?:

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt  410,952,960  games     0.359 secs     1,144,715,766  games/sec Board: Dead:      equity     win     tie           pots won     pots tied    Hand 0:     43.992%      42.24%     01.75%          173601033       7187405.00   { Ad4d } Hand 1:     56.008%      54.26%     01.75%          222977117       7187405.00   { 22+, A8s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, A8o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo } above I have given villian 20% of the top starting hands, you just behind that, I dont think you have much fold equity either when you shove. I dont think its the worst play since its 3 way donkment, and they could be shoving with hands like KJ KQ etc which you beat.  But just because your kicker is so low, i think its a fold, becuase you way behind pairs from 55-99, where if you had A9 or something least you would be flipping instead of being a 75/35 dog with a4 vs 55
Posted by harvey23

Thanks Harvie, thats interesting and completely agree in hindsight should not be making this move with anything less then A9. Usually do well when i get near the finish line, just a case of wrong move at the wrong time here, i wouldn't have posted had everyone folded lol

YOUNG_GUN

Actually interesting to know harvey what would be the difference if you changed my hand to A9 & also suited a9 can you post this please or pm me the site you go on to do this

Thanks in advance )

harvey23

its called pokerstove, free software if you use google, i think it works out at around 47% vs the top 20 percent of there range. this is by assuming they are never bluffing here, if you put some bluffs in there range you will become a fav with a9.