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nl50, facing suspicious 4bet

OMahonyOOMahonyO Member Posts: 1,883
edited July 2010 in The Poker Clinic
scotty77 Small blind  £0.25 £0.25 £114.71
blkjack Big blind  £0.50 £0.75 £51.74
  Your hole cards
  • K
  • K
     
-v- Raise  £1.50 £2.25 £73.19
OMahonyO Raise  £4.50 £6.75 £71.46
hairyhaggi Fold     
scotty77 Fold     
blkjack Raise  £7.00 £13.75 £44.74
-v- Fold     
OMahonyO Call  £3.00 £16.75 £68.46
Flop
   
  • 6
  • 7
  • 4
     
blkjack Bet  £14.00 £30.75 £30.74
OMahonyO Call  £14.00 £44.75 £54.46
Turn
   
  • 5
     
blkjack Check     
OMahonyO Check     
River
   
  • 7
     
blkjack Check    
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Comments

  • godsluck88godsluck88 Member Posts: 31
    edited July 2010
    In Response to nl50, facing suspicious 4bet:
    scotty77 Small blind   £0.25 £0.25 £114.71 blkjack Big blind   £0.50 £0.75 £51.74   Your hole cards K K       -v- Raise   £1.50 £2.25 £73.19 OMahonyO Raise   £4.50 £6.75 £71.46 hairyhaggi Fold         scotty77 Fold         blkjack Raise   £7.00 £13.75 £44.74 -v- Fold         OMahonyO Call   £3.00 £16.75 £68.46 Flop     6 7 4       blkjack Bet   £14.00 £30.75 £30.74 OMahonyO Call   £14.00 £44.75 £54.46 Turn     5       blkjack Check         OMahonyO Check         River     7       blkjack Check      
    Posted by OMahonyO
    looks like you have him beat, im betting the river.
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  • waynecwaynec Member Posts: 1,023
    edited July 2010
    why bet the river? Your only going to get called from a hand that is beating you, worse still what do you do if he reraises you he could have A7/88/76 or a FH in my books if your ahead it yours and you get to see his cards cheap info.
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  • CLIOKIDCLIOKID Member Posts: 783
    edited July 2010
    In Response to Re: nl50, facing suspicious 4bet:
    why bet the river? Your only going to get called from a hand that is beating you, worse still what do you do if he reraises you he could have A7/88/76 or a FH in my books if your ahead it yours and you get to see his cards cheap info.
    Posted by waynecure
    There is about a 0.00001% chance of the villain checking any of these hands on the river.

    I'm betting the river here I think.

    Is it 3 handed at this point? If it is then I can maybe see why villain could check AA on turn and river as there is a chance you are 3-betting original raiser a bit lighter than standard due to it being 3 handed meaning 8's and middling pp's are in your range for FH's and straights.

    Just re-read the OP and I have no idea why I thought this hand was 3-handed.

    Ignore most of the above.

    I still bet river though.


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  • BlackFish3BlackFish3 Member Posts: 2,418
    edited July 2010
    Or he could have 99-QQ and you might get value from him? Why would he 4 bet A7, 88, 76? Any reads mahony?
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  • waynecwaynec Member Posts: 1,023
    edited July 2010
    In Response to Re: nl50, facing suspicious 4bet:
    Or he could have 99-QQ and you might get value from him? Why would he 4 bet A7, 88, 76? Any reads mahony?
    Posted by BlackFish3
    I missed the 4 bet so you could be right but my point is still what do you do if he reraises? Just my thinking and no doubt it's wrong but feel is it better to win a nice pot than lose a big un!
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  • OMahonyOOMahonyO Member Posts: 1,883
    edited July 2010
    In Response to Re: nl50, facing suspicious 4bet:
    Or he could have 99-QQ and you might get value from him? Why would he 4 bet A7, 88, 76? Any reads mahony?
    Posted by BlackFish3
    no reads,

    what about the size of his 4bet compared to my 3bet? he wants a call surely?
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  • godsluck88godsluck88 Member Posts: 31
    edited July 2010
    In Response to Re: nl50, facing suspicious 4bet:
    In Response to Re: nl50, facing suspicious 4bet : I missed the 4 bet so you could be right but my point is still what do you do if he reraises? Just my thinking and no doubt it's wrong but feel is it better to win a nice pot than lose a big un!
    Posted by waynecure
    you carnt really put him on a 7/8 after his 4bet.

    as above id bet the river your going to get called by TT-QQ.
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  • beanehbeaneh Member Posts: 4,079
    edited July 2010
    check back make a note.
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  • harvey23harvey23 Member Posts: 433
    edited July 2010
    when you flat call the flop and turn, are you slowplaying or what?shove pre and shove river.
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  • N1CKN1CK Member Posts: 1,453
    edited July 2010
    if you check the turn you might as well check the river, you put him on AA PF which is understandable since he min 4 bets utg+1 who 3bets utg, if he was a half decent player the turn card is never slowing him down here so on that id stick a little value bet on the river
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  • OMahonyOOMahonyO Member Posts: 1,883
    edited July 2010

    Thanks for replies.

    This is one of those KK vs AA scenarios that I had discussed a while ago in another thread.  The fact that he is 4betting those raises and with the 4bet being so small, I thought it was screaming AA.  But you can never fold KK pre right? especially to such a small raise.  But on the other hand, if I KNOW he has  AA, then of course its a fold pre.
    This is where I get in a tangle with myself, everyone says it is -ev to fold kk pre and I dont doubt it, but if I feel AA is such a massive % of his range should I be hoping to cc down the streets, and if he does have that AA then I may be able to save some of my stack?
    So what if he shoves flop?  I have to call dont I?  I was very fortunate that the board panned out as it did, however, I dont know what villain was putting me on but if the hands were reversed, Im sure I would have got a bit more value.  Anyway, Im beginning to confuse myself.


    Result was, I checked back river, and he showed AA

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  • godsluck88godsluck88 Member Posts: 31
    edited July 2010
    In Response to Re: nl50, facing suspicious 4bet:
    Thanks for replies. This is one of those KK vs AA scenarios that I had discussed a while ago in another thread.  The fact that he is 4betting those raises and with the 4bet being so small, I thought it was screaming AA.  But you can never fold KK pre right? especially to such a small raise.  But on the other hand, if I KNOW he has  AA, then of course its a fold pre. This is where I get in a tangle with myself, everyone says it is -ev to fold kk pre and I dont doubt it, but if I feel AA is such a massive % of his range should I be hoping to cc down the streets, and if he does have that AA then I may be able to save some of my stack? So what if he shoves flop?  I have to call dont I?  I was very fortunate that the board panned out as it did, however, I dont know what villain was putting me on but if the hands were reversed, Im sure I would have got a bit more value.  Anyway, Im beginning to confuse myself. Result was, I checked back river, and he showed AA
    Posted by OMahonyO
    would have been intresting if you shove the river to see if he calls.
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  • N1CKN1CK Member Posts: 1,453
    edited July 2010
    In Response to Re: nl50, facing suspicious 4bet:
    In Response to Re: nl50, facing suspicious 4bet : would have been intresting if you shove the river to see if he calls.
    Posted by godsluck88
    the stupid thing is he would call a river shove with his aces but he wouldnt value bet the turn or river lol
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