HU MTT, first hand i have under 12BB gotta shove right

YOUNG_GUN

F/t he has been chip leader most of it although i overtook him at some point then he clawed it back. he was proper nitty but regardless whether he was tight or not standard shove yeah?

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
YOUNG_GUN	Small blind		4000.00	4000.00	93552.00
ben6407	Big blind		8000.00	12000.00	104448.00
	Your hole cards	Q 10
YOUNG_GUN	All-in		93552.00	105552.00	0.00
ben6407	All-in		104448.00	210000.00	0.00
ben6407	Unmatched bet		14896.00	195104.00	14896.00
YOUNG_GUN	Show	Q 10
ben6407	Show	K K
Flop
		4 6 A
Turn
		Q
River
		7
ben6407	Win	Pair of Kings	195104.00		210000.00

N1CK

if hes that nitty you can min raise every button, you can min here he calls with pretty much the same range he calls a shove with?

YOUNG_GUN

Really? my thoughts are he will call top 15% if i shove, if i min raise he calls or shoves bit wider imo even though he was a bit of a nit

My main theory here is 12 bigs(well not quite) shove according to the nash chart

pryce6

I would shove this, don't worry about the result they won't have the kings ery time my friend.

YOUNG_GUN

cheers dude appreciate it not a bad beat here just general opinion but as we're both so shallow not alot we can do prob wouldnt call if they shoved but wouldn't min raise fold unlike nick

GaryQQQ

Yep, shove is good, unlucky to run into KK.

DOHHHHHHH

How had he been playing from the button?

Shove isn't bad.

N1CK

im not saying its not a shove i was just asking you a question, as for the Nash chart i think its fine vs tight opponents but as better players call much lighter these days it does over value your hands vs them

scotty77

if hes that nitty I don't actually mind a min raise/fold

a lot of people don't adjust well to HU and their 3bet jamming hands tend to be the same as they were when the table was 6 handed.

that said a jam here is never really a big leak.  i just think that if hes so nitty then you are only gonna get 3bet jammed on when he has you totally crushed.

GaryQQQ

Here's the maths of a shove based on your read that he's calling with the top 15% of hands;

85% of the time he folds and you win a pot of 12,000

15% of the time he calls, your QTo has 33.58% equity against his range, so 5.07% (33.38% x 15%) of the time you will win a pot of 195,104 and 9.93% (66.62% x 15%) of time you will lose your 93,552 shove and bust out.

(85% x +12000) + (5.07% x +195,104) + (9.93% x -93552) = +10,802

So your shove has a positive expectation of 10,802 chips, or 1.35BB.

YOUNG_GUN

In response to Dohhhh he wasn't really using the button or position well at all from 6 handed to 3.

from discussing with dohhh i also feel min raise/ fold may have been ok here but i just felt he would fold most hands so shoving any 2 12bb deep was my idea on the button. obviously unlucky to run into kings but i do always look to improve and as 1 hand HU just wanted to see what everyone else thought.

NICK FWIW i dont follow nash religously but know the jist of it and what hands to call and shove

Thanks all for your comments as always

YOUNG_GUN

Thanks gary love the technical stuff

N1CK

In Response to Re: HU MTT, first hand i have under 12BB gotta shove right:

Here's the maths of a shove based on your read that he's calling with the top 15% of hands; 85% of the time he folds and you win a pot of 12,000 15% of the time he calls, your QTo has 33.58% equity against his range, so 5.07% (33.38% x 15%) of the time you will win a pot of 195,104 and 9.93% (66.62% x 15%) of time you will lose your 93,552 shove and bust out. (85% x 12000) + (5.07% x 195,104) + (9.93% x -93552) = +10,802 So your shove has a positive expectation of 10,802 chips, or 1.35BB.
Posted by GaryQQQ

does he never shove over a minraise? and when he does call (which is always with  a better hand which he prolly calls a shove with) and you have a 3/1 chance that he wont get it to show down as he will be fit or fold

as i said before shoving is not bad but there is a argument for minraising vs this player and not just this button but near on all of them

clubber224

 Shoving is in-exploitable according to nash but not necessarily the optimal play especially against a nit i would much rather min raise or limp stab with a hand like Q10 as it plays well post flop

GaryQQQ

Maybe with 12BB an argument can just about be made for a min raise, with 10BB or less and it certainly does have to be shove or fold only. I still prefer the shove here with a medium strength hand. If you limp or min raise two things can go wrong; either he shoves, or he flat calls and there's a bad flop for your cards. If you shove he has to make a tough decision (unless he wakes up with a premium), if you limp or min-raise you're setting yourself up to have the tough decision and you may well end up squandering nearly 20% of your stack. I see this as a situation where to need to go into killer instinct mode, min-raising or limping is too weak IMO, I'd only do that with a premium.

YOUNG_GUN

where was my rematch hu gary tut tut

AMYBR

For me its a insta shove that I'm not thinking twice about.  If he was as nitty as you say your taking the pot there the majority of the time.  Definately to strong to fold or just complete the blind, so the 12BB jam is always going to be the prefferred play.