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Bottom set vs active player that wont back down. Value city or check call river (sat very deep)
AMYBR
Member Posts: 3,432
A few of the local players got together for a super deepstack WTA S+G double chance over the weekend
15k in chips, great slow structure. £150 buy in, with one opportunity to rebuy for 1/2 stack for £75. Ended up getting 14 runners, so nice payday for someone. (Not me though
)
1st level (25/50), guy who plays pretty wide makes it 300 to go UTG, gets 3 callers. I find ducks in the SB, mandatory call. BB also comes in.
Flop comes out J25r 5 to flop, pot stands @ 1800.
I want to make this pot as big as possible, if I can gather chips early I may do alright in this game. I lead out strong 1st to act for 1200. BB calls pretty quick as does origonal raiser, all other seats fold.
5400 in pot, oppents still are in the 12k range. J25 9.
Normally my image is pretty tight, but I'd just three barrelled with 3 high on a paint board and squeezed a win against a weak spot, showing the 3 high. I lead out strong again, 3600. BB does this thing that he does when know he's pretty strong. Just a very clear live tell. He calls, trying to make it look like he doesnt like his hand, Initial raiser pre folds.
12600, goint to the river J25 9 A, no flush getting there.
Opponent has maybe 10kish left. I know that he likes his hand, also I think he knows I'm not bluffing, leading out into so many players, over streets (however I just did do this with 3 high).
Whats your bet? At the time I felt i was up against an AJ/JK type hand, but feared pocket 5's. It would be very like this player to call me down, betting off my chips planning to set me in on the river. He loves to slow play big hands (to his peril).
Any bet commits you, he will check back the majority of hands, but will call a modest value bet.
15k in chips, great slow structure. £150 buy in, with one opportunity to rebuy for 1/2 stack for £75. Ended up getting 14 runners, so nice payday for someone. (Not me though
)1st level (25/50), guy who plays pretty wide makes it 300 to go UTG, gets 3 callers. I find ducks in the SB, mandatory call. BB also comes in.
Flop comes out J25r 5 to flop, pot stands @ 1800.
I want to make this pot as big as possible, if I can gather chips early I may do alright in this game. I lead out strong 1st to act for 1200. BB calls pretty quick as does origonal raiser, all other seats fold.
5400 in pot, oppents still are in the 12k range. J25 9.
Normally my image is pretty tight, but I'd just three barrelled with 3 high on a paint board and squeezed a win against a weak spot, showing the 3 high. I lead out strong again, 3600. BB does this thing that he does when know he's pretty strong. Just a very clear live tell. He calls, trying to make it look like he doesnt like his hand, Initial raiser pre folds.
12600, goint to the river J25 9 A, no flush getting there.
Opponent has maybe 10kish left. I know that he likes his hand, also I think he knows I'm not bluffing, leading out into so many players, over streets (however I just did do this with 3 high).
Whats your bet? At the time I felt i was up against an AJ/JK type hand, but feared pocket 5's. It would be very like this player to call me down, betting off my chips planning to set me in on the river. He loves to slow play big hands (to his peril).
Any bet commits you, he will check back the majority of hands, but will call a modest value bet.
Comments
But then I kind of put my gregghogg hat on, studying for a long long time. I'm not going to be happy if he snaps me off with 5's in the first level. But then I swang back to "well if he does, just another cooler".
shove />>>>c/f>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>c/c imo
whats BB like? what hands does he think are strong v your perceived range
He's a pretty solid tournament player..but overall plays badly. He limps into a lot of pots, later on in tourney. Happy to commit up to 2/3rs of stack raise/calling, prepared to fold post. He doesnt adopt a stack descision approach.
He really should put me on 2pr or better I'd of thought at turn. But we've had a few run ins lately at casino where I've floated him with air or bet into him hard over streets with premium draws, getting there then felting him. So he knows I'd do this/am capable of this. (£600 pot weekend before where I-d kept pressure on, my AK vs his AJ - J high flop-, myself filling up to nut BW at river). So he knows that i dont essentialy have to be hugely strong here.
Conversely Its not my normal line (to keep pressure through streets with draw), so everyone else at the table pretty much new I had 2pr or better, but because I dont overly rate him I had been mixing it up vs him quite alot.
You know I think too much
I bet flop for value. Getting called in two spots. I bet turn for greater value, there is a high likelyhood there's a good J out there. Only when i get smoothly called at turn do I begin to question where I am. This guy is stubborn, but he also likes to slow play what he perceives as a strong hand. But his range here is any J to a middlig pocket pair. But there is a strong chance the river A greatly improves his hand.
Ultimately I decide that he has a strong J. I'm not going to play scared to the 5's. But he would play 5's this way. He would have 3 bet J's or better to thin the field pre. This much I know.
Literallly all this is going through my mind before I act on the river. But stupidly the longer I think, the more I almost convince myself he has 5's, but dont in the end. But again stupidly, he knows my game well enough to know that tanking before the bet is an extract value sign on my part. He tells me afterwards this is why the hand ended as it did, which i'll put up in a second.
I end up betting an even 5k, as if he only has 1pr I dont think he'll call his whole stack. He may, but he definately calls 5k with it. If he jams I'm calling, but he may just flat a stronger hand, leaving me 100BB's.
So I extract value/induce the jam if ahead, but going broke if I'm behind.
He in turn tanks, so I know I'm ahead thankfully. He "just calls" leaving himself around 5k, showing AJ.
This is how indepth I think of pretty much every hand I'm involved with, thats how obsessive I can be. Perhaps just batting the EV+ spots would make my life hugely easier.
This is not a brag post. I really felt like I had a descision on the end where I'm pretty sure it should have been straightforward. I have a huge tendancy to overthink things and I just wanted to see if you guys would have seen much to fear or gone for maximum value.
You asked in title about c/c, this is the worst line imo. Villain is unlikely to bluff, his calling range is way wider than his betting range and he never checks back better
Yeah I think I totally overthought it. My brain tends to try and outsmart itself. I know my range and betting pattern well enough to expect people to pick up on something from time to time, expecting them to be far stronger than they actually are, to call me down.
I dont hate the river bet. He looked so pained when calling I think he had an inkling that I had the set, but like you say, when he improves to top two, its crying call rebuy time for him.