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folding aces

windamonwindamon Member Posts: 219
edited August 2011 in The Poker Clinic
£100 nlhe at my local last night.my stack 300 villan 290.blinds £1/£2 with £5 staddle folded tome in hj possition.i make it £15 with Ac Ad. folded to villan in bb who raises to £45,i call.its heads up to the flop. flop comes Qh 6s Qd I CHECK HE CHECKS.turn is 8h,villan checks i bet £95 and he goes all in.im in the tank a short while because he has been playing with a wide range and showed 1 or 2 bluffs. i folded. right move?
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  • PiAnOpLaYaPiAnOpLaYa Member Posts: 554
    edited August 2011
    In Response to folding aces:
    £100 nlhe at my local last night.my stack 300 villan 290.blinds £1/£2 with £5 staddle folded tome in hj possition.i make it £15 with Ac Ad. folded to villan in bb who raises to £45,i call.its heads up to the flop. flop comes Qh 6s Qd I CHECK HE CHECKS.turn is 8h,villan checks i bet £95 and he goes all in.im in the tank a short while because he has been playing with a wide range and showed 1 or 2 bluffs. i folded. right move?
    Posted by windamon
    b/f flop prob a better option - your showing too much weakness checking the flop
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  • YOUNG_GUNYOUNG_GUN Member Posts: 8,948
    edited August 2011
    Serves your right for flatting, get in pre!

    bet flop, as played really depends if he's been playing any 2 then call if you think he has half a clue how to play poker fold
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  • djblacke04djblacke04 Member Posts: 1,778
    edited August 2011


    Actually , it was wrong move,


    Am putting him on JJ or KK.....

    preflop betting suggest high pocket pair,

    id have called ...he would never have raised with Q ....only hand i could worry about is 88 but the story of the hand is wrong for 88...you wouldnt reraise with 88...preflop..


    and to be honest this hand should be in the clinic........
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: folding aces:
    Actually , it was wrong move, Am putting him on JJ or KK..... preflop betting suggest high pocket pair, id have called ...he would never have raised with Q ....only hand i could worry about is 88 but the story of the hand is wrong for 88...you wouldnt reraise with 88...preflop.. and to be honest this hand should be in the clinic........
    Posted by djblacke04
    Should of 4 bet pre flop - less likely he got a Q so you got to go with it - if he turns over AQ then hey ho there you go



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  • windamonwindamon Member Posts: 219
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: folding aces:
    In Response to folding aces : b/f flop prob a better option - your showing too much weakness checking the flop
    Posted by PiAnOpLaYa
    thought i was trapping mate.
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  • windamonwindamon Member Posts: 219
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: folding aces:
    Serves your right for flatting, get in pre! bet flop, as played really depends if he's been playing any 2 then call if you think he has half a clue how to play poker fold
    Posted by YOUNG_GUN
    pre flop i feel the pley is pretty standard.there is a argument for re raising the villain after all he has reraised me from the blinds,unless he was making a move for the hellof it.he must have a good hand.however i was looking to trap for all his money so idecided toto give my hand a little deception. im pretty sure the villain would not have read my flat call as strenght.im thinking he put me on ak or medium pair.looking back i put myself in a marginal situation and allowed him to put pressure on me when i was in possition. i let him take the initiative and control when there was no need to. lesson learned!
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  • CodexCodex Member Posts: 211
    edited August 2011
    the problem is, you've played it a way that looks weak and then when u get shoved instead of calling, you fold

    if you're going to fold in this spot, don't induce it in the first place
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  • LOL_RAISELOL_RAISE Member Posts: 2,188
    edited August 2011
    i like preflop, especially if you havent been aggressive or bluffing alot, never folding postflop considering we only have 50bbs behind into a ~20bb pot
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: folding aces:
    i like preflop, especially if you havent been aggressive or bluffing alot, never folding postflop considering we only have 50bbs behind into a ~20bb pot
    Posted by LOL_RAISE
    The action pre disguises his hand but maybe I am not getting this -
    8 pot at start - 1/2 with 5 straddle
    he raises to 15 - got to be more hasn't it - effectivley a min raise
    3 bets to 45

    maybe it's good if he has been passive but would it not be best to 4 bet with the aim of getting it all in pre
    or is this spot very player dependant and obviously your own table image plays a big part if you 4 bet or flat

    just asking ?
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  • LnarinOOLnarinOO Member Posts: 545
    edited August 2011
    flattin pre is good but if ur thinkin about bet/folding then bet much less so u can fold without commiting ur stack..maybe £40-£45.. but ii woulldnt be foldin especially on a QQx board..!!

    u massivley uderreped ur hand and smash aload of his value shove hands.!!
    CALL CALL CALL
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  • LnarinOOLnarinOO Member Posts: 545
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: folding aces:
    In Response to Re: folding aces : The action pre disguises his hand but maybe I am not getting this - 8 pot at start - 1/2 with 5 straddle he raises to 15 - got to be more hasn't it - effectivley a min raise 3 bets to 45 maybe it's good if he has been passive but would it not be best to 4 bet with the aim of getting it all in pre or is this spot very player dependant and obviously your own table image plays a big part if you 4 bet or flat just asking ?
    Posted by rancid
    ITS A 3X RASE WHICH IS PRETTY STANDARD ESPECIALLY WITH aa IN POSSITION...
    PLAYIN PRETTY DEEP ID PREFER TO FLAT AA.. A 4BET WOULD TURN OUR HAND FACE UP AND FOLD OUT TOO MANY DOMINATED HANDS..
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  • LnarinOOLnarinOO Member Posts: 545
    edited August 2011
    appologies... not actuallly that deep with the straddle in play but still prefer the flat pre =)
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  • scotty77scotty77 Member Posts: 4,970
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: folding aces:
    flattin pre is good but if ur thinkin about bet/folding then bet much less so u can fold without commiting ur stack..maybe £40-£45.. but ii woulldnt be foldin especially on a QQx board..!! u massivley uderreped ur hand and smash aload of his value shove hands.!! CALL CALL CALL
    Posted by LnarinOO
    this is why its a call
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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited August 2011
    how are you oop post flop?
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  • LOL_RAISELOL_RAISE Member Posts: 2,188
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: folding aces:
    In Response to Re: folding aces : The action pre disguises his hand but maybe I am not getting this - 8 pot at start - 1/2 with 5 straddle he raises to 15 - got to be more hasn't it - effectivley a min raise 3 bets to 45 maybe it's good if he has been passive but would it not be best to 4 bet with the aim of getting it all in pre or is this spot very player dependant and obviously your own table image plays a big part if you 4 bet or flat just asking ?
    Posted by rancid
    i would probably 4x it preflop yea 3x is fine. i think 4b/calling is fine too but in live poker you find so many people who will 3bet/fold like AQ/TT/JJ etc that i think flatting with these shallow stacks is best. the BB is now £5 so we only have 60bbs total.

    if we were 1k+ deep then i would 4bet every single time
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: folding aces:
    In Response to Re: folding aces : i would probably 4x it preflop yea 3x is fine. i think 4b/calling is fine too but in live poker you find so many people who will 3bet/fold like AQ/TT/JJ etc that i think flatting with these shallow stacks is best. the BB is now £5 so we only have 60bbs total. if we were 1k+ deep then i would 4bet every single time
    Posted by LOL_RAISE
    I see what your saying and I can't disagree

    My thinking is the shorter you are the less likely people will fold to your 4 bet if they holding AK/KK/QQ/ even JJ/1010 if your really short 20-30 BB's.
    I am only playing NL4 but am I possibly missing a trick here by not flatting there 3 bet
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  • LOL_RAISELOL_RAISE Member Posts: 2,188
    edited August 2011
    i think online you should flat sometimes but the vast majority of the time 4bet
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  • AMYBRAMYBR Member Posts: 3,432
    edited August 2011
    There is no real point disguising/slow playing the strength of AA vs this type f opponent.  Super unlikely to be 3bet folding pre.  I likely make it around £100 off the back of his 3 bet and hope he shoves AQ/K or decent PP.  Then its a snap and a pray to the poker gods.

    Over last 6 month my +/- shows my biggest swings with A'sK's.  Isolating to one player with strong lines but am just getting rickrolled constantly.  If your going to play A's slow, you may as well play them REALLY SLOW being prepared to fold without too much thought to significant multiway action or be prepared to lose an acceptable minimum.

    Just something I'm experimenting with myself.  Its always pretty obv how A's are beat multi way
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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited August 2011
    pre is fine imo, although I dont mind 4betting either

    Turn I think you have to call, but even live Im not sure you smash that much of his value range. What hands do people feel he likely plays this way?
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  • AMYBRAMYBR Member Posts: 3,432
    edited August 2011
    Without being sat there I wouldnt really like to guess bud.  First instinct wouldnt be a Q though, but huge scope to be wrong.  Very player/dynamic dependant for me.
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