In Response to Re: Cash game on Channel 5 : The most common reason I've seen is, both people get all their chips in and it's a flip say, AK against JJ. Neither one is really that big a favourite but one of them is going to lose a full BI (maybe more) over it, which could be hundreds of thousands in them high stakes games, so basically they run it twice, and if things go the way odds suggest, AK will win one, JJ will win one, and they basically get their money back, so it's less risk on both part. Why you'd want to run a couple of times when you're a massive favourite I don't know. Posted by Lambert180
because the amount of times you run it has no bearing on your chances of winning. If someones a 5% chance of winning its 5% whether they run it once, twice, 4 times etc. The only advantage to running it multiple times is to iron out variance. In a scenario like this though surely the loose cannon should never run it multiple times because they dont get to keep anything under the 100 grand?
Also Phil Hellmuth has terrible etiquette so he has opened himself up to taunting like this from other players. If you sit there telling people how bad they are and berating people then you should not be surrprised when people celebrate when you lose. Phil knows this and accepts it i think. He realises its all for tv.
In Response to Re: Cash game on Channel 5 : because the amount of times you run it has no bearing on your chances of winning. If someones a 5% chance of winning its 5% whether they run it once, twice, 4 times etc. The only advantage to running it multiple times is to iron out variance. In a scenario like this though surely the loose cannon should never run it multiple times because they dont get to keep anything under the 100 grand?
As the cards are not reshuffled his chances do drop each time the first time he lost a k ie 1 out of his 2 gone the second time he made runner runner spades so even less chance of a flush on the end one.
The loose cannon in this case would be foolish not to run it multiple times he is all in and all of his money is on the line as a huge underdog. If he gets it right 1/4 then he has half his chip stack back. The pot being divided into 4 for the different runs. He still had hands to play so could of got to play on rather than be out.
As stated above i believe it was arrogance of hellmuth as he offered to run it twice then without prompting upped it to three then 4 times.
If you saw Hellmuths history on running boards you'd perhaps see this differently. It is not uncommon for Hellmuth to run boards an unfeasable amount of times. This wasnt unusual for him.
He has also been dettered from taking out insurance in hands by directors so upping the hand run is a simple way to reduce his variance.
Doesnt seem to matter what the guy does, people just love to attack him. I dont see that he did a thing wrong, acting with class (for a change) vs the ridic suckouts. How Tony G (and Negranue/Lakk to a lesser degree) come off as good guys here and Hellmuth comes off as the arrogant douc/he is beyond me.
If you saw Hellmuths history on running boards you'd perhaps see this differently. It is not uncommon for Hellmuth to run boards an unfeasable amount of times. This wasnt unusual for him. He has also been dettered from taking out insurance in hands by directors so upping the hand run is a simple way to reduce his variance. Doesnt seem to matter what the guy does, people just love to attack him. I dont see that he did a thing wrong, acting with class (for a change) vs the ridic suckouts. How Tony G (and Negranue/Lakk to a lesser degree) come off as good guys here and Hellmuth comes off as the arrogant douc/he is beyond me. Snap call? He 3bet aiof? Was good tv i guess though Posted by AMYBR
Concur with that. Just because he's been bratty in the past doesn't make it right for the rest to gang up on him laughing and high-fiving. That just looked pathetic and I felt sorry for PH. He handled it better than I would have in his shoes. Also didn't think he slow-rolled the loose cannon either.
How would G have reacted if Phil had started laughing and high-fiving Negreanu when he (DN) housed his AK straight on the river?
Pretty funny hand nonetheless, but the reaction stunk of schoolyard behaviour IMO.
the thing that gets me is why o why would u run it 4 times lol is phil hellmuth crazy hes like 95 per cent to win it normally why give the other guy a chance and run it 4 times just stupid hes own mistake and he should get stick for it for slow rolling and doing the oscars speech before he goes all in
I think what wound me up about this was mainly Negranue. From what I have seen and from stories from people I know that have played him he really is the ambassador that he appears to be.
All I could think watching this episode was how bad he runs in HSP seasons 1,2 and 3. Where he keeps flopping straights and getting boated or quaded by river. Just strongly felt that if someone had acted the way he did in those pots then it would clearly be out of order, him being the first to say so.
Hellmuth isnt perfect. He is a brat, but he kind have has earned the right to be. Like it or not he is the most accomplished Tournament poker player in history, fact I'm afraid. So when he is being "Hellmuthian" it is coming from a genuine standpoint.
It is very true that he conducts himself badly at times. I think its borne out of the frustration of not getting the credit and respect that he does infact deserve, conversely though it is his attitude and personality that prevent him getting said respect.
You have to take the guy with a pin..... bag of salt. Much of what you see is a performance IMO. He wants people to go after him. Its how he gets paid.
But Negranue/Laak and G's conduct would not have been toterated if it was someone else in the pot.
Also like it or not Hellmuth is great for poker, always has been.
You can read more at the IthinkPHellmuthisadoucheylegend.com
the thing that gets me is why o why would u run it 4 times lol is phil hellmuth crazy hes like 95 per cent to win it normally why give the other guy a chance and run it 4 times just stupid hes own mistake and he should get stick for it for slow rolling and doing the oscars speech before he goes all in Posted by angie6108
I honestly thought he ran it 4 times to give the guy a chance not to go bust.
And it's moot, to say the least, that it even was a slow-roll.
As an aside, although he plays up to his persona a lot, almost every pro I've heard talk of Helmuth says he's a total gent away from the table. I doubt the same could be said about TonyG. Negreanu's always struck me as somewhat false too.
In Response to Re: Cash game on Channel 5 : I honestly thought he ran it 4 times to give the guy a chance not to go bust. And it's moot, to say the least, that it even was a slow-roll. As an aside, although he plays up to his persona a lot, almost every pro I've heard talk of Helmuth says he's a total gent away from the table. I doubt the same could be said about TonyG. Negreanu's always struck me as somewhat false too. Posted by bandini
Comments
Also Phil Hellmuth has terrible etiquette so he has opened himself up to taunting like this from other players. If you sit there telling people how bad they are and berating people then you should not be surrprised when people celebrate when you lose. Phil knows this and accepts it i think. He realises its all for tv.
great tv.
to me it looked more like a 'haha I am so far ahead, ieven if we run it loads of times you would hardly ever win, look how good i am'
rather than him being gracious, i think he was being more mean
The loose cannon in this case would be foolish not to run it multiple times he is all in and all of his money is on the line as a huge underdog. If he gets it right 1/4 then he has half his chip stack back. The pot being divided into 4 for the different runs. He still had hands to play so could of got to play on rather than be out.
As stated above i believe it was arrogance of hellmuth as he offered to run it twice then without prompting upped it to three then 4 times.
Tim
He has also been dettered from taking out insurance in hands by directors so upping the hand run is a simple way to reduce his variance.
Doesnt seem to matter what the guy does, people just love to attack him. I dont see that he did a thing wrong, acting with class (for a change) vs the ridic suckouts. How Tony G (and Negranue/Lakk to a lesser degree) come off as good guys here and Hellmuth comes off as the arrogant douc/he is beyond me.
Snap call? He 3bet aiof?
Was good tv i guess though
How would G have reacted if Phil had started laughing and high-fiving Negreanu when he (DN) housed his AK straight on the river?
Pretty funny hand nonetheless, but the reaction stunk of schoolyard behaviour IMO.
All I could think watching this episode was how bad he runs in HSP seasons 1,2 and 3. Where he keeps flopping straights and getting boated or quaded by river. Just strongly felt that if someone had acted the way he did in those pots then it would clearly be out of order, him being the first to say so.
Hellmuth isnt perfect. He is a brat, but he kind have has earned the right to be. Like it or not he is the most accomplished Tournament poker player in history, fact I'm afraid. So when he is being "Hellmuthian" it is coming from a genuine standpoint.
It is very true that he conducts himself badly at times. I think its borne out of the frustration of not getting the credit and respect that he does infact deserve, conversely though it is his attitude and personality that prevent him getting said respect.
You have to take the guy with a pin..... bag of salt. Much of what you see is a performance IMO. He wants people to go after him. Its how he gets paid.
But Negranue/Laak and G's conduct would not have been toterated if it was someone else in the pot.
Also like it or not Hellmuth is great for poker, always has been.
You can read more at the IthinkPHellmuthisadoucheylegend.com
And it's moot, to say the least, that it even was a slow-roll.
As an aside, although he plays up to his persona a lot, almost every pro I've heard talk of Helmuth says he's a total gent away from the table. I doubt the same could be said about TonyG. Negreanu's always struck me as somewhat false too.