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Tight fold?

chaperchaper Member Posts: 20
edited August 2011 in The Poker Clinic
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalancechaperSmall blind £0.02£0.02£4.54tigergazBig blind £0.04£0.06£4.09 Your hole cardsKK   BATHY9Call £0.04£0.10£3.93Nats63Fold    pilgrim07Call £0.04£0.14£1.50chaperRaise £0.18£0.32£4.36tigergazCall £0.16£0.48£3.93BATHY9Call £0.16£0.64£3.77pilgrim07Call £0.16£0.80£1.34Flop  A710   chaperCheck    tigergazCheck    BATHY9Bet £0.80£1.60£2.97pilgrim07Fold    chaperFold    tigergazFold    BATHY9Muck    BATHY9Win £0.74 £3.71BATHY9Return £0.80£0.06£4.51
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Comments

  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8 Member Posts: 6,228
    edited August 2011
    Raise pre needs to be a LOT bigger, at least 30p.

    Flop as played is easy check fold.
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  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited August 2011
    Common problem every single nl4 hand I see is bet/raise sizing.

    DON'T BE SCARED OF LOSING YOUR CUSTOMER.

    Raise it RIGHT UP!!!!
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  • Lambert180Lambert180 Member Posts: 12,197
    edited August 2011
    Dohh, could you give your thoughts on my 10NL session please. Tell me what you think about my raise sizing as I've had a few comments on there about my raise sizing but no real suggestions for change.

    When you say raise it RIGHT UP, does this only apply to 4NL and not 10NL? And are you only raising it 'RIGHT UP' with AA/KK/QQ/AK?
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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited August 2011
    I think his raise size is ok, I prob make it a little bigger but w/e.

    flop looks fine
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  • debdobs_67debdobs_67 Member Posts: 3,615
    edited August 2011
    Raise at this level is poo poo i mean look how many callers ya got , 32p i reckon is good and may fold out raggy A's , fold on flop after the bet is gd xxx
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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    Raise at this level is poo poo i mean look how many callers ya got , 32p i reckon is good and may fold out raggy A's , fold on flop after the bet is gd xxx
    Posted by debdobs_67
    Why do you want to fold out rag As?

    Do they fold them anyway when you raise bigger?
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  • debdobs_67debdobs_67 Member Posts: 3,615
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tight fold? : Why do you want to fold out rag As? Do they fold them anyway when you raise bigger?
    Posted by grantorino
    Well thats a funny kinda reply in a way cos the LAST thing ya want on the flop with KK is an A and yeah ya can get a raggy A to fold here at this level cos 32p does look like it could be a stronger A , of course IF theres no A on flop then the KK doesnt want  raggy A to fold.
    All im sayin is long term at THIS level the pre flop raise HAS TO BE bigger than the OP did xxx
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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tight fold? : Well thats a funny kinda reply in a way cos the LAST thing ya want on the flop with KK is an A and yeah ya can get a raggy A to fold here at this level cos 32p does look like it could be a stronger A , of course IF theres no A on flop then the KK doesnt want  raggy A to fold. All im sayin is long term at THIS level the pre flop raise HAS TO BE bigger than the OP did xxx
    Posted by debdobs_67
    Why? Does this apply to all your raising range?
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  • percival09percival09 Member Posts: 3,804
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    Dohh, could you give your thoughts on my 10NL session please. Tell me what you think about my raise sizing as I've had a few comments on there about my raise sizing but no real suggestions for change. When you say raise it RIGHT UP, does this only apply to 4NL and not 10NL? And are you only raising it 'RIGHT UP' with AA/KK/QQ/AK?
    Posted by Lambert180
    I gave you suggestions, make them smaller
    correct bet sizing applies to all levels
    no - you raise it whenevr you want value or are bluffing - and i don't think it's fair to hijack somebody elses thread ....

    back to the OP i'd raise bigger pre - as played nice fold
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  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tight fold? : Why? Does this apply to all your raising range?
    Posted by grantorino
    I agree it has to be much bigger, and it doesn't apply to all his raising range.

    When he wants to get it in pre flop it should be bigger than normal.
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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tight fold? : I agree it has to be much bigger, and it doesn't apply to all his raising range. When he wants to get it in pre flop it should be bigger than normal.
    Posted by DOHHHHHHH
    How does that work exactly?

    Personally, I think some of the 4NL regs here are raising too big, I dont see much advantage to some of the massive raises. I can see some sense to it with big pairs (still not sure its best) but not with most of their raising range. I may be wrong, would appreciate if someone could explain it properly

    BTW I think OP should raise a bit more in hand above, I'm just wondering in general about the raise sizes
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  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tight fold? : How does that work exactly? Personally, I think some of the 4NL regs here are raising too big, I dont see much advantage to some of the massive raises. I can see some sense to it with big pairs (still not sure its best) but not with most of their raising range. I may be wrong, would appreciate if someone could explain it properly BTW I think OP should raise a bit more in hand above, I'm just wondering in general about the raise sizes
    Posted by grantorino

    Because 90% of the players we are playing against are looking at 2 things.

    The cards they are dealt, and the cards in the middle.

    To get more money in the pot?

    The biggest problem the majority of people who play nl4 have (imo) is giving too much credit to the players they are up against.

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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited August 2011
    raise to at least 28p here for 100% value at NL4
    More money in the pot the better )
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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8 Member Posts: 6,228
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tight fold? : Because 90% of the players we are playing against are looking at 2 things. The cards they are dealt, and the cards in the middle. To get more money in the pot? The biggest problem the majority of people who play nl4 have (imo) is giving too much credit to the players they are up against.
    Posted by DOHHHHHHH
    I seriously doubt they do.
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tight fold? : Why? Does this apply to all your raising range?
    Posted by grantorino
    so if you raising range is 55 /> then you raise to like 80p or more :s
    There are players will say i have 66 i am raising really big here so everyone folds :s

    Bad or good - you decide
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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tight fold? : Because 90% of the players we are playing against are looking at 2 things. The cards they are dealt, and the cards in the middle. To get more money in the pot? The biggest problem the majority of people who play nl4 have (imo) is giving too much credit to the players they are up against.
    Posted by DOHHHHHHH
    Well we cant get it in pre unless they raise, but w/e its not really my point

    Building a big pot pre is all well and good with big pairs, but I'm not sure its so great with other hands. We dont always get more money in pot by raising bigger. Also, I cant remember seeing a 4NL hand here where getting money across the line was a problem (Im sure there was a few, but generally players seem to be able to get stacks in when they want if they use any reasonable sizing).
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited August 2011
    In Response to Re: Tight fold?:
    In Response to Re: Tight fold? : How does that work exactly? Personally, I think some of the 4NL regs here are raising too big, I dont see much advantage to some of the massive raises. I can see some sense to it with big pairs (still not sure its best) but not with most of their raising range. I may be wrong, would appreciate if someone could explain it properly BTW I think OP should raise a bit more in hand above, I'm just wondering in general about the raise sizes
    Posted by grantorino
    When you have oppo all too willing to call raises very light and wide makes infalting the pot optimum.

    You pick up AA and you know if you raise it 4x your going to get at least one caller.
    if you have limpers before you and raise it to 6-7x then your still going to get at least one caller.

    It sounds mad but the sheer truth is like Dohhhh states they just look at there own cards.
    I think also there maybe the same thinking as someone suggested earlier that you should raise more to get players to fold because you hand is vulnerable. So they think you raise 6x because you have 66, not AA :s



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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited August 2011

    OK, I'll start a thread on this some other time when I collect my thoughts fully on the matter. Wont hijack this one anymore in case someone want to comment on hand (sorry if its too late for that OP). Also perfectly willing to accept I'm wrong if I am, just isnt immediately obv to me that we should raise bigger cos players are bad

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  • AMYBRAMYBR Member Posts: 3,432
    edited August 2011
    Snap fold flop.

    Only read Dohs post at top and strongly agree.  I was playing Nl4 t'other day and made it 0.86 in a similar spot and got a tonne of action.  People dont have any reason to fold at this level, most people I mean

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