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nl20 - 3 bet AK, facing flat and a shove - whats my play

rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
edited April 2012 in The Poker Clinic

hate this spot
PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalance
andybeth Small blind   £0.10 £0.10 £22.46
YellowEye Big blind   £0.20 £0.30 £48.36
  Your hole cards
  • A
  • K
     
b1tch23 Raise   £1.00 £1.30 £12.13
rancid Raise   £3.40 £4.70 £24.60
andybeth Call   £3.30 £8.00 £19.16
YellowEye Fold        
b1tch23 All-in   £12.13 £20.13 £0.00
rancid
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Comments

  • WHOAMI196WHOAMI196 Member Posts: 1,170
    edited April 2012
    love this spot, ezy shove, not too worried about anybeth tbh, short-stackers are generally fish (there are exceptions to the good ones with solid strategies ovc) your going too see jj, 1010, QQ, AQ etc its kinda a tempting squeeze spot for the shortie too, so range can be wider.
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  • splashiessplashies Member Posts: 3,680
    edited April 2012
    Yeh I'd shove.

    No need to change the villains name to that btw!!!!! :P lol
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: nl20 - 3 bet AK, facing flat and a shove - whats my play:
    love this spot, ezy shove, not too worried about anybeth tbh, short-stackers are generally fish (there are exceptions to the good ones with solid strategies ovc) your going too see jj, 1010, QQ, AQ etc its kinda a tempting squeeze spot for the shortie too, so range can be wider.
    Posted by WHOAMI196

    Should of said, concerned with the sb not the shover
    Only played andybeth a few times but seem to remember him/her being ok
    Obviously calling the shove, but it's either shove or fold
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  • WHOAMI196WHOAMI196 Member Posts: 1,170
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: nl20 - 3 bet AK, facing flat and a shove - whats my play:
    In Response to Re: nl20 - 3 bet AK, facing flat and a shove - whats my play : Should of said, concerned with the sb not the shover Only played andybeth a few times but seem to remember him/her being ok Obviously calling the shove, but it's either shove or fold
    Posted by rancid
    ie cant really see anyone flat with AA, KK, also we have blockers, this is a reason alone just to shove, ovb something bothered you with this hand or you would not be posting, but out of all the interesting hand you post on here (no sarcasm intended lolz) this is the most STANDARD in my eyes, and im am like super tight, no drama no head ache just get it in.
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: nl20 - 3 bet AK, facing flat and a shove - whats my play:
    In Response to Re: nl20 - 3 bet AK, facing flat and a shove - whats my play : ie cant really see anyone flat with AA, KK, also we have blockers, this is a reason alone just to shove, ovb something bothered you with this hand or you would not be posting, but out of all the interesting hand you post on here (no sarcasm intended lolz) this is the most STANDARD in my eyes, and im am like super tight, no drama no head ache just get it in.
    Posted by WHOAMI196
    I just really dithered over this, just want to see what people think
    Do we say sb is weak or strong - is it just position that dictates the play and also the short stack is really not even in the hand

    Suppose my reaction to the spot at the time bothered me more than what I actually done
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  • The_Don90The_Don90 Member Posts: 9,814
    edited April 2012
    SB is rarley flatting anything that crushes us in this spot. Just shove.
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  • Batkin88Batkin88 Member Posts: 1,682
    edited April 2012
    Wow I fold your flipping at best but highly doubt you are. Is this a shove because of the level your playing at? The original raiser can surely only hold AK AA KK QQ JJ maybe TT here and your behind to all of them but one and his AK might be suited :) and then your probably taking AK three way i can't see sb folding after flatting in the small blind out of posistion i would put him/her on a strong hand.
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: nl20 - 3 bet AK, facing flat and a shove - whats my play:
    Wow I fold your flipping at best but highly doubt you are. Is this a shove because of the level your playing at? The original raiser can surely only hold AK AA KK QQ JJ maybe TT here and your behind to all of them but one and his AK might be suited :) and then your probably taking AK three way i can't see sb folding after flatting in the small blind out of posistion i would put him/her on a strong hand.
    Posted by Batkin88

    mmmmmmmm I have lots of FE versus sb flat range
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  • simonnatursimonnatur Member Posts: 330
    edited April 2012
    I'ld assume Andybeth would have QQ+ or just possibly AKs here
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  • Dudeskin8Dudeskin8 Member Posts: 6,228
    edited April 2012
    5x raise UTG followed by BIG 3bet and andy just flats from SB surely he has to have like KK+ ?

    Plus first raiser still shoves over the top, although I think you can beat his range, andy I doubt you can. 
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  • The_Don90The_Don90 Member Posts: 9,814
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: nl20 - 3 bet AK, facing flat and a shove - whats my play:
    5x raise UTG followed by BIG 3bet and andy just flats from SB surely he has to have like KK+ ? Plus first raiser still shoves over the top, although I think you can beat his range, andy I doubt you can. 
    Posted by Dudeskin8
    i dont know opponent, but whaaaa cold calling 3bs oop with kings or better. hmmm im thinking ur giving too much credit here
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  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited April 2012


    It probably is AA, expecting half stacker to jam after 5xing

    And the fact the hand's been posted :P

    I think he would shove or fold AK and QQ depending on his reads on you.

    So AA/KK only imo. 
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited April 2012
    Lets cut to the chase, so I read AA/KK can't see why oppo would flat any other hand
    But had to shove incase oppo does flat hands that fold to my shove that I would be racing against

    I dither because i WANT to fold, hate this spot !

    Should I fold this spot ? Do I have to be nit to fold, even if I call it AA/KK in game





    b1tch23 All-in   £12.13 £20.13 £0.00
    rancid All-in   £24.60 £44.73 £0.00
    andybeth All-in   £19.16 £63.89 £0.00
    rancid Unmatched bet   £5.44 £58.45 £5.44
    andybeth Show
    • A
    • A
    		     
    b1tch23 Show
    • Q
    • Q
    		     
    rancid Show
    • A
    • K
    		     
    Flop
       
    • 9
    • Q
    • 5
    		     
    Turn
       
    • A
    		     
    River
       
    • 4
    		     
    andybeth Win Three Aces £56.65   £56.65
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  • grantorinograntorino Member Posts: 4,710
    edited April 2012
    KK+ only? If he cold 4bet everyone would say his range was KK+ as well

    He should have enough worse hands in his range to make shoving fine imo, given we have blockers. He may also fold some hands we flip with. Folding is levelling yourself without really good reads imo
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  • WHOAMI196WHOAMI196 Member Posts: 1,170
    edited April 2012
    ForTheRecord did not twig that the bets were as big for some reason lol, maybie not soo standard, andy beth has cold called a decent size 3-bet there for this level, i still like shove i think, its difficult not knowing these players and not "in game" but im happy to flip here.

    EDIT: just seen the hand lool UL m8, i told ya you shoulda folded....:\
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  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited April 2012
    Rigged for action!

    1outerments. 

    Toldya :P
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  • rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,945
    edited April 2012
    In Response to Re: nl20 - 3 bet AK, facing flat and a shove - whats my play:
    KK+ only? If he cold 4bet everyone would say his range was KK+ as well He should have enough worse hands in his range to make shoving fine imo, given we have blockers. He may also fold some hands we flip with. Folding is levelling yourself without really good reads imo
    Posted by grantorino
    I have to agree )

    My read was correct I should of folded, blaaaaaahhhhhh



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  • weedgiweedgi Member Posts: 103
    edited April 2012
    cant be too result orientated ,sometimes the right play looks bad when u hit the top of theyre range
    id shove too if its unknown opponenets on 20nl
    as said above folding is levelling yourself
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