DYM Strategy - Fold or Shove?

Doubleblow

A situation I've faced before and I'm still unsure about the best strategy and would be interested in your opinions, and why. Its a DYM tournament and we are down to 4 players. One player is way out in front in terms of chipstack. I'm second but only 500 and 700 chips in front (or thereabouts) of the 3rd and 4th chipstacks. In the hand below should I shove or fold. I don't see calling or raising less than an all in as an option.

Hotspur101	Small blind		100.00	100.00	1205.00
Doubleblow	Big blind		200.00	300.00	1910.00
	Your hole cards	8 8
lark1000	Fold
CILLA	Raise		800.00	1100.00	5905.00
Hotspur101	Fold

PiAnOpLaYa

Easy fold with the chip stacks. Chances are has nothing and just using his big stack but it's not worth finding out when your only playing for top 3

SHANXTA

this is a super standard fold

Herbie536

In Response to DYM Strategy - Fold or Shove?:

A situation I've faced before and I'm still unsure about the best strategy and would be interested in your opinions, and why. Its a DYM tournament and we are down to 4 players. One player is way out in front in terms of chipstack. I'm second but only 500 and 700 chips in front (or thereabouts) of the 3rd and 4th chipstacks. In the hand below should I shove or fold. I don't see calling or raising less than an all in as an option. Hotspur101 Small blind   100.00 100.00 1205.00 Doubleblow Big blind   200.00 300.00 1910.00   Your hole cards 8 8       lark1000 Fold         CILLA Raise   800.00 1100.00 5905.00 Hotspur101 Fold    
Posted by Doubleblow

As its a DYM its a simple fold, theres no need to risk anything in your situation, let the 3rd and 4th stacks go at it and get paid

profman15

Hi 'double'

Its a fold, IMO.

!. your m=6.5. You are not in a call all-in situation as you still have a good ss.
2. You are up v big stack and your fold equity with this stack size isn't quite there as he may feel he can afford the extra chips.
3. He should have a good hand as big stack otherwise why would he get involved?
4. Best bet is your up against two highers so 54%:46% ie coin flip. Other two players want you to take a hance.
5. If the roles were reversed(you on BTN) you could shove with this stack as its put the others to a difficult decision.
6. I notice Hotspur is down to m=4 (even less if blinds re about to change) so he is getting desperate now and other chap has about 3k so its Hotspur that's under pressure.
Hope this makes sense. Some may disagree but that's what make poker a competitive game.

percival09

I fold. Villain aint folding to a shove and with chip stacks you can lay it down and be ok

DoubleAAA

Easy fold.

 Question for you though, If you swapped places with the big stack, so you were the btn and big stack was the BB with hotspur as the sb and it folded around to you, what would your action be?

1267

Never ever ever ever ever ever do anything other than fold.

Doubleblow

In Response to Re: DYM Strategy - Fold or Shove?:

Easy fold.  Question for you though, If you swapped places with the big stack, so you were the btn and big stack was the BB with hotspur as the sb and it folded around to you, what would your action be?
Posted by DoubleAAA

Hmmm, especially with Hotspur being small blind I'd be tempted to shove to put the pressure on him. If I've taken the initiative, I feel even the bigstack isn't going to call unless he has a real premium hand - why would he want to get involved?

DoubleAAA

In Response to Re: DYM Strategy - Fold or Shove?:

In Response to Re: DYM Strategy - Fold or Shove? : Hmmm, especially with Hotspur being small blind I'd be tempted to shove to put the pressure on him. If I've taken the initiative, I feel even the bigstack isn't going to call unless he has a real premium hand - why would he want to get involved?
Posted by Doubleblow

This becomes 'read' dependant.  If the big stack is loose, then we fold, but if big stack is a nit then we shove.  With no reads (you should have reads by this stage) it's a fold.

If big stack is calling you with 50% of his range then we're a 60-40 fav.

Just out of curiosity, what stack size does lark1000 have as it's not showing up.

rancid

snap fold

cenachav

Snap fold.  Twice on Sundays.  No point taking on the big stack at this stage.  If you were 4th in chips then probable shove but as you aren't then fold fold fold

bearlyther

If the big stack is doing this every hand then this is a snap rejam folding would be really bad however if he has a tight image then yes it would be best to fold here and wait for 1 of the others to go bust.  You have to remember tho that you still only have 4 bbs more than them you may have to take a flip at some stage.

DoubleAAA

In Response to Re: DYM Strategy - Fold or Shove?:

If the big stack is doing this every hand then this is a snap rejam folding would be really bad however if he has a tight image then yes it would be best to fold here and wait for 1 of the others to go bust.  You have to remember tho that you still only have 4 bbs more than them you may have to take a flip at some stage.
Posted by bearlyther

Sorry but I have to disagree with you here.  At this stage we do not take a 60-40 flip (that's if he's opening 50% of his hands) whilst we have 4.5bbs more than the short stack. We only need to flip if/when the shorty doubles up.

GREGHOGG

Easy fold

Doubleblow

Thanks for your input, was pretty sure that's what I should have done but, of course I didn't. Shoved, big stack called with K6 and he hit his king on the river. I was left thinking what did I do that for - it's a DYM, dummy, no need to take the risk.

Maybe I'll learn from my mistakes - well I can live in hope

cenachav

If you do learn from it then it will be the best buy in that you have ever lost