Analyse please

sighcall

LOL i really dunno how to play this differently!

Can someone give feedback thanks!PlayerActionCardsAmountPotBalancehaidyboySmall blind £0.10£0.10£18.30sighcallBig blind £0.20£0.30£18.70 Your hole cards99   wudibluffFold    terry07Raise £0.60£0.90£17.33TJQKAFold    shepso1212Fold    haidyboyCall £0.50£1.40£17.80sighcallRaise £2.40£3.80£16.30terry07Fold    haidyboyCall £2.00£5.80£15.80Flop  6Q3   haidyboyCheck    sighcallBet £4.35£10.15£11.95haidyboyAll-in £15.80£25.95£0.00sighcallAll-in £11.95£37.90£0.00sighcallUnmatched bet £0.50£37.40£0.50haidyboyShow33   sighcallShow99   Turn  9   River  4   sighcallWinThree 9s£35.60 £36.1

DOHHHHHHH

You've got 50% equity against his range if you have middle set here. 

percival09

any reads? Played this guy a few times and although he does weird stuff occasionaly he seems ok. I think - feel free to correct me.

Why are you squeezing w/ 99?

bet smaller otf and fold to the raise. Might even check back the flop sometimes.

pr1nnyraid

You don’t need to 3bet..

Once you have you don’t need to c bet that large..

But once you not sure if need to call it off..  

sighcall

Just call and set mine then?

grantorino

Flat pre

B/f flop smaller readless. 

percival09

Well 99 holds more value than just set mining but you'll get most of its value set mining.

It's probably +ev to squeeze here, but it's more +ev to call 

lpool67

unlike every1 else i like the 3 bet u found out were u are u isolated and got rid of the orginal raiser.theguy who came along flatted your bet telling me he didnt have ak aq big pairs looks 2 me like hes set mining or playing suited conectors ,if your behind on that flop with what u have behindi d never folding 9s  In Response to Analyse please:

LOL i really dunno how to play this differently! Can someone give feedback thanks! Player Action Cards Amount Pot Balance haidyboy Small blind   £0.10 £0.10 £18.30 sighcall Big blind   £0.20 £0.30 £18.70   Your hole cards 9 9       wudibluff Fold         terry07 Raise   £0.60 £0.90 £17.33 TJQKA Fold         shepso1212 Fold         haidyboy Call   £0.50 £1.40 £17.80 sighcall Raise   £2.40 £3.80 £16.30 terry07 Fold         haidyboy Call   £2.00 £5.80 £15.80 Flop     6 Q 3       haidyboy Check         sighcall Bet   £4.35 £10.15 £11.95 haidyboy All-in   £15.80 £25.95 £0.00 sighcall All-in   £11.95 £37.90 £0.00 sighcall Unmatched bet   £0.50 £37.40 £0.50 haidyboy Show 3 3       sighcall Show 9 9       Turn     9       River     4       sighcall Win Three 9s £35.60   £36.1
Posted by sighcall

percival09

In Response to Re: Analyse please:

unlike every1 else i like the 3 bet u found out were u are u isolated and got rid of the orginal raiser.theguy who came along flatted your bet telling me he didnt have ak aq big pairs looks 2 me like hes set mining or playing suited conectors ,if your behind on that flop with what u have behindi d never folding 9s  In Response to Analyse please :
Posted by lpool67

You shouldn't be raising to find out where you are - it's too exploitable. If you sqz here and get 4b you have to fold and youve lost all the hands value. If you sqz here and get called it puts you in a tricky spot on almost any flop, and even more so on the turn if called. Flatting pre keeps all worst hands in and gives you the best opportunity to win a big pot. Set mining and winning a huge pot every now and then is much more +ev than squeezing and taking down a small pot - and that's without even taking the difficult spots youll get into postflop into consideration

rancid

flat pre, if IP then 3 bet is ok

b/f smaller on flop
what reads do you have that you think oppo is bluffing flop

lpool67

whys the guy going 2 4bet u when he called the orginal raiser unless hes trapping with a big hand .not knowing the player but in the general situation i would rather be in control and know what his range is if he 4bets me it cut his hand range down 2 med to large pairs or ak giving you the chance 2 get off it after the flop.by playing it your way u will be bluffed more and probably play all the streets on alot of flops not knowing were u are and having little control of the hand i really cant see him playing a big hand like this though with an early raise b4 him and players after, when unlikly hes going 2 be reraised more likely flat called by the bb and maybe sb making even aces behind to the table of 3 other flat or 4 callers behind your play is much more suited 2 omaha   In Response to Re: Analyse please:

In Response to Re: Analyse please : You shouldn't be raising to find out where you are - it's too exploitable. If you sqz here and get 4b you have to fold and youve lost all the hands value. If you sqz here and get called it puts you in a tricky spot on almost any flop, and even more so on the turn if called. Flatting pre keeps all worst hands in and gives you the best opportunity to win a big pot. Set mining and winning a huge pot every now and then is much more +ev than squeezing and taking down a small pot - and that's without even taking the difficult spots youll get into postflop into consideration
Posted by percival09

percival09

yes he could be trapping, but what about the original raiser? It seems you've forgotten about him. 

But being in 'control' means youre not going to know when to bet for value, when to bluff, when to bluff catch.. it seems you havent really thought about what youre saying in much detail.

Why would you want to 3bet 99 only to be called by med-large pairs and AK? That range absolutely owns 99. Postflop flatting pre you can just get away from it w/ 2 players behind if there are overcards and a bit of action, sure if it's a low dry board stick around and re-evaluate on later streets.

If you 3b here you're essentially bluffing - sure this 3b might be ok with a lot of dynamic and reads but in a nut shell it isn't that good. 

it is more profitable to call 99 pre here rather than to 3bet, imo. 

jams88

i don't mind the 3bet pre but prefer a flat. Never stacking off on this flop you are only really beating an airball.
What did you put villian on when you called the shove?

lpool67

if ufeel like 99 isnt a stronge hand with 6 players then your advice should be 2 fold the hand your out of position basicallyset mining  meaning your dropping nearly all flops 3 ways    meaning it a none profitable move esp as there no pot been build and a bet from u is going 2 look like u were set mining    In Response to Re: Analyse please:

yes he could be trapping, but what about the original raiser? It seems you've forgotten about him.  But being in 'control' means youre not going to know when to bet for value, when to bluff, when to bluff catch.. it seems you havent really thought about what youre saying in much detail. Why would you want to 3bet 99 only to be called by med-large pairs and AK? That range absolutely owns 99. Postflop flatting pre you can just get away from it w/ 2 players behind if there are overcards and a bit of action, sure if it's a low dry board stick around and re-evaluate on later streets. If you 3b here you're essentially bluffing - sure this 3b might be ok with a lot of dynamic and reads but in a nut shell it isn't that good.  it is more profitable to call 99 pre here rather than to 3bet, imo. 
Posted by percival09

percival09

I can promise you set mining with 99 here is profitable. More profitable than 3betting.

Now your putting words into my mouth - I didn't say 99 isn't a strong hand 6 handed. It is, but not facing a 4bet it isnt - and if we 3b and get called it leads to many difficult spots.

Lambert180

99 is a strong hand pre-flop 6-handed but as Percival says, you put yourself in horrible spots post flop unnecessarily by 3betting. If he just flats the pot is £1.80 I believe, then he doesn't bet ouy when he hits sets, he checks and lets the pre-flop raiser c-bet for say £1.10ish so we got £2.90 in there now, £4 if the 2nd villian calls, £5.10 when you call (so already this pot has built up from a 40p call pre).

It depends on players how much you get paid, but I'd say it's ALWAYS gonna be +EV to set-mine with any PP when you're 100xBB deep or more, when it's going 3way and you only have to call 2BB (cos he's on the BB in this hand), especially when you're closing the action so you KNOW the price you're paying to definitely see the flop.

Betting 'to find out where you are' is bad.

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If you 3bet and get called, and the flop comes 26Kr, you're always gonna c-bet this, right? If you get called and the turn is an 8, what do you do? Chances are you'll have no idea where you are, sometimes you'll be bluffed off the best hand, and sometimes you'll level yourself into getting stacked.

rancid

don't think your going to love flops or stand up well enough to oppo's continuation range to make 3 betting this spot w/99 profitable


if you want folds then 3 bet ATC, should be a reason + reads to 3 bet this spot and not just do it because you have 9's


don't think 9's are the strong in this spot anyway

percival09

fwiw 99 does hold more value than solely to set mine but that's where it'll get most of its value here

grantorino

Flatting better than 3b here readless imo, it's going to be very tough to play a bloated pot oop v a strong range when we are called, it also sucks 3b/f and I'm not willing to get it in without history

You can 3bet sometimes, but I'd like reads. If I had reasons to 3bet I would prob call off on that board. 

Pipunch

set mine and then check the flop. calling the shove is burning money long term

BorinLoner

I'd agree that 3-betting out of position with 99 is second best to calling here.

This is especially true of the times when our opponents have a big pair. If we call pre-flop, when the opening raiser has KK or AA and the flop comes 9-high, we now are very likely to be able to stack them and win a huge pot. If we 3-bet pre-flop, we're very likely to be 4-bet and now are forced to fold and lose the opportunity to win that big pot. After we're 4-bet, set-mining is no longer a profitable option as our implied odds will be too greatly diminished.

So when we 3-bet with 99, we likely only win a small pot and lose out on the possibility of winning a large one. When that 3-bet is called, we know that there will be overcards on the flop far more often than not and that makes things difficult for us when we don't flop the set. We're forced to c-bet and when that c-bet is called or raised we're faced with a very tough decision and likely have to give up on our hand. Playing an inflated pot, out of position through the streets with 99 is a very tricky situation and one we don't need to get ourselves into. If we have superb reads on our opponents it can be profitable but usually not as profitable as set-mining.

Generally speaking, when 3-betting out of position, our range should be only big hands which we're 3-betting for value or very weak hands which we're 3-betting as a pure bluff. Hands like small or medium pairs and suited connectors are much better to just call with as these are the hands we want to see a flop with, so we can make really big hands and win big pots.

3-betting with 72 is much better than 3-betting with 99 because we know exactly why we're doing it. If we are faced with a 4-bet it's an easy fold, whereas with 99 we can still be tempted to call.

Anyway, in this hand I definitely c-bet smaller and I fold to the flop raise. I can't see what you're being raised by that you beat on this flop that called the 3-bet pre-flop. Your c-bet is definitely too big as I can't see how it can ever be called by worse and it's unlikely to fold out better.