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Bad hand - feel free to critizise
MP33
Member Posts: 6,300
It was early and partly my fault for not getting better reads on opponents otherwise i,d have shoved the flop
A bit more standard butr again - not enough reads - he turned out to be v.tight but know knowing that how would you play it then? thx
| Player | Action | Cards | Amount | Pot | Balance |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| njdkvbdfed | Small blind | £0.04 | £0.04 | £5.55 | |
| JIMMY77777 | Big blind | £0.08 | £0.12 | £8.20 | |
| Your hole cards |
| ||||
| brunetteace | Fold | ||||
| MP33 | Raise | £0.24 | £0.36 | £5.92 | |
| xxxx | All-in | £0.60 | £0.96 | £0.00 | |
| Tsaaaar | Fold | ||||
| njdkvbdfed | Fold | ||||
| JIMMY77777 | Call | £0.52 | £1.48 | £7.68 | |
| MP33 | Call | £0.36 | £1.84 | £5.56 | |
| Flop | |||||
| |||||
| JIMMY77777 | Bet | £1.84 | £3.68 | £5.84 | |
| MP33 | Call | £1.84 | £5.52 | £3.72 | |
| Turn | |||||
| |||||
| JIMMY77777 | Bet | £5.52 | £11.04 | £0.32 | |
| MP33 | All-in | £3.72 | £14.76 | £0.00 | |
| JIMMY77777 | Unmatched bet | £1.80 | £12.96 | £2.12 | |
| JIMMY77777 | Show |
| |||
| MP33 | Show |
| |||
| xxxxx | Show |
| |||
| River | |||||
| |||||
| JIMMY77777 | Win | Full House, 4s and Aces | £11.98 | £14.10 | |
| Player | Action | Cards | Amount | Pot | Balance |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| garner909 | Small blind | £0.04 | £0.04 | £11.09 | |
| kcxyz | Big blind | £0.08 | £0.12 | £13.39 | |
| Your hole cards |
| ||||
| MP33 | Raise | £0.24 | £0.36 | £10.11 | |
| kenook | Fold | ||||
| Tsaaaar | Fold | ||||
| garner909 | Call | £0.20 | £0.56 | £10.89 | |
| xxxx | Raise | £0.64 | £1.20 | £12.75 | |
| MP33 | Raise | £0.96 | £2.16 | £9.15 | |
| garner909 | Fold | ||||
| xxxx | All-in | £12.75 | £14.91 | £0.00 | |
| MP33 | All-in | £9.15 | £24.06 | £0.00 | |
| xxxx | Unmatched bet | £3.12 | £20.94 | £3.12 | |
| xxxx | Show |
| |||
| MP33 | Show |
| |||
| Flop | |||||
| |||||
| Turn | |||||
| |||||
| River | |||||
| |||||
| xxxx | Win | Three Kings | £19.54 | £22.66 | |
Comments
2. I 4bet bigger, but other than that, I'm not folding QQ pre 110xBB deep at 8NL.
Id just fold AJ pre their. Especially without reads. A player cold calling a 3 bet generally indicates strength. When deciding whether to call a 3 bet I ask myself whether i can extract value from weaker hands if I hit, and will this outweigh the times reverse implied odds kicks in, when I am dominated. If not I will generally fold, or if someone is 3 betting very wide and folds to 4 bets, then i may 4 bet certain hands. AJ can be a decent hand to call a 3 bet (particularly in position) against a very wide 3 betting range that includes a lot of weaker aces and Jacks. However in general I would bin it to a 3 bet, without good solid reads. You don't want to be stepping into the unknown to much in poker. Post flop I would call the flop bet, to keep bluffs in and let them pot commit themselves more with weaker aces on the turn. Hoping that a flush card doesn't come on the turn, that's only a 20% shot, so i think it's worth running this slight risk, for the benefits of flatting the flop.
Hand 2
Raise early position from u, will generally indicate strength
Therefore 3 bet from blinds will generally indicate strength.
Therefore your 4 bet equals a lot of strength
Therefore a 5 bet here is usually huge strength.
But we cant really fold after we 4 bet, unless we are very certain they only have AA or KK.
The optimal way to play the hand will depend on the opponents 3 betting range from blinds when you open from early position.
Very narrow range eg aa kk qq ak then we can call and set mine profitably with qq this deep Be very careful if a board comes low or jack high or something, Remember that against a range this narrow you have made profitable pre flop decision to set mine. Maybe call one bet on these boards, but don't get carried away just because your hand looks good relative to the board.
Wide range we could 4 bet and call off with qq. However we would have to be pretty sure the opponent would 5 bet ak. in this situation.As a general rule it is standard to 4 bet and get QQ in 6 max, in particular in battles residing in the area from the cutoff inwards, with wider opening and thus 3 and 4 betting ranges.Outside of the aforementioned area you should be more reluctant to get QQ allin , and desire more extensive reads before doing so.
As you have indicated yourself mate, This is why is is very important to have good precise information on the players you are playing with. It makes it far easier to make optimal decisions.
I'd probably play the hand the same. I'm not folding AJs pre-flop, in position to the short-stack's all-in and a call. I doubt I'd find the fold on the flop either, although I hate seeing him bet full-pot into a dry side pot, knowing that I'm playing for my stack.
I just can't put him on AK, AA or QQ as he'd 4-bet those pre-flop most of the time. AQ, A4 and 44 are the only hands I'm concerned about here. Without reads I don't fold the flop. If I fold to a bet on the Ace-high flop, then I probably shouldn't call pre-flop with AJ. I'd have been calling for a two-pair or better flop, which isn't really what I want to be doing with a hand like AJ (or with any hand, facing a 3-bet).
Obviously that means I'm getting it in either on the flop or turn. I don't like it but I don't fold against a randomer unless I know they're not going to be doing this with Ax or a flush draw. (I'm not saying it's definitely right to stack-off. It's just what I'd do)
The second hand: If you're going to 4-bet to get it in then, as the others have said, it should be a little bigger. I'm all for making small 4-bets but this is virtually a min-raise and that's just too small.
With regard to this 4-bet-folding business, I think it can definitely be defended. It depends solely on whether you think the 3-better flat calls your 4-bet with alot of his 3-betting range. If he flats here with AK, AQ, JJ, TT and perhaps some other hands but only (and always) 5-bets with AA or KK, then 4-bet-folding is fine, even potentially optimal. You need to have some reads on your opponents to know that, though.
Most of the time you're better off calling the 3-bet and playing the flop - Allow him to c-bet most flops with his entire range rather than folding out his weak 3-betting hands. 4-betting to get it in isn't too bad as he's probably not 3-bet-folding AK or JJ...