should i have just folded this hand

craigcu12

with me having 15K chips was i right to call this or could i have waited for an A

Player	Action	Cards	Amount	Pot	Balance
BOUNCY497	Small blind		600.00	600.00	12139.00
cottweiler	Big blind		1200.00	1800.00	24869.75
	Your hole cards	J Q
Adicts89	Fold
meledor	Fold
craigcu12	Raise		3600.00	5400.00	12115.50
alfarch30	Fold
BOUNCY497	Fold
cottweiler	All-in		24869.75	30269.75	0.00
craigcu12	All-in		12115.50	42385.25	0.00
cottweiler	Unmatched bet		10354.25	32031.00	10354.25
cottweiler	Show	J A
craigcu12	Show	J Q
Flop
		Q 10 4
Turn
		5
River
		A
cottweiler	Win	Pair of Aces	32031.00		42385.25

loololollo

with like 13 BB just look to shove pre 

cenachav

Fold or min raise pre and fold to the shove.  IMO you just have the stack to min raise fold once.  NEVER open shove 13 bb into an unopened pot.  You will only get called by better 

Curt360x27

In Response to Re: should i have just folded this hand:

Fold or min raise pre and fold to the shove.  IMO you just have the stack to min raise fold once.  NEVER open shove 13 bb into an unopened pot.  You will only get called by better 
Posted by cenachav

This is exactly what you shouldn't be doing. 

Shove or fold pre. In an MTT with antes its an auto shove from the c/o, without them its closer but probably still profitable. Once you open your calling it off all day long.

LnarinOO

In Response to Re: should i have just folded this hand:

Fold or min raise pre and fold to the shove.  IMO you just have the stack to min raise fold once.  NEVER open shove 13 bb into an unopened pot.  You will only get called by better 
Posted by cenachav

completly wrong, anythin less than 15BB should be jus shoving pre !!!

Batkin88

You def cannot raise fold, going on your posistion you can shove but I prefer a fold tbh But shoving or folding is fine.

bearlyther

In Response to Re: should i have just folded this hand:

You def cannot raise fold, going on your posistion you can shove but I prefer a fold tbh But shoving or folding is fine.
Posted by Batkin88

You cant fold the cutoff unopened with qj folding would be bad.  

Yes with your stack size just jam pre.

Batkin88

In Response to Re: should i have just folded this hand:

In Response to Re: should i have just folded this hand : You cant fold the cutoff unopened with qj folding would be bad.   Yes with your stack size just jam pre.
Posted by bearlyther

If you are not happy to get it in with QJ then a fold is correct, ofcourse you can fold here. If there was antes in play and 9 max maybe not but not on a 6 max with no antes you have plenty of play left

bearlyther

Folding is crazy perfect spot to jam this is how people fold down to 5 bigs when they miss spots like this with 13 bigs unopened in the cutoff my chips are going in here all day long good game if i bust i did the right thing.

Batkin88

your risking 13bigs to win 1 and a half. You are never getting called by worse and are praying for a race if called. You have 3 orbits before this play is necessary

LnarinOO

i agree that foldin would be bad .. with anythin less than 15bb i would be jammin the top 13% of hands.. and be happy to get the hand

bearlyther

In Response to Re: should i have just folded this hand:

your risking 13bigs to win 1 and a half. You are never getting called by worse and are praying for a race if called. You have 3 orbits before this play is necessary
Posted by Batkin88

I disagree at this stage of a tourney we should know how to manage a stack size and our calling and shoving ranges.  QJ in the cutoff is a shove.

Batkin88

Lol this could go back and forth all night but I have work in the morning. I am not saying it's 100% wrong as everyone playes different but for me it is never a shove. For the reason that you are never getting it in ahead and your stack is playable. If you are shoving QJ here are you shoving QT, JT, A4, A3, A2 or is QJ the bottom of your range? The thing is by shoving here and Ace is calling most high kings KQ, KJ and and PP so you are not gaining enough for the risk. If there had been a raise prior then shoving as a squeeze is great but not open shoving.

bearlyther

In Response to Re: should i have just folded this hand:

Lol this could go back and forth all night but I have work in the morning. I am not saying it's 100% wrong as everyone playes different but for me it is never a shove. For the reason that you are never getting it in ahead and your stack is playable. If you are shoving QJ here are you shoving QT, JT, A4, A3, A2 or is QJ the bottom of your range? The thing is by shoving here and Ace is calling most high kings KQ, KJ and and PP so you are not gaining enough for the risk. If there had been a raise prior then shoving as a squeeze is great but not open shoving.
Posted by Batkin88

Yep qj would be bottom of my range shoving all pairs qk,qj,kj,a10+

I would fold the hand if it was raised before me i wouldnt 3 bet jam as we cant expect any fold equity so shoving as a squeeze would be bad id rather shove a trash hand like j4 blind on blind than to 3 bet jam qj with no fold equity.