Got to hand 18 or so and got bored! Plus I forgot what I was going to say about previous hands. Hand 12 I don't think you should be 3bet/folding AJs. If you're going to 3bet fold probably best to just flat it - unless you have a read that villain calls 3bets light a lot but only 4bets the nuts.
At least half of the ones I looked at looked completely standard and you probably know that since you went in a mile ahead and just got unlucky. Some of them you could maybe look to play differently. There was that post by DoubleAAA in the clinic where I was advocating not shoving in some spots just because it is +ev as vs a lot of players there's often a more EV route to take. My exit hand from the main last night I had QQ OTB and limped. Flop was 654 and I bet/called a shove. I was ahead against A6 but it got there. Still, I'd consider playing it like that again occasionally because had I open jammed A6 would have folded. I might also want to limp weaker hands OTB where I can then take it down with a 1bb c-bet. I've risked just 2bb to play the hand as opposed to my entire stack.
You'd be surprised how often people let you get away with limping/min-r and if they don't it's easy enough to adjust.
Anyway in short you're not doing too much wrong it seems but you could consider playing less gung ho in some spots against the right villains to take a higher ev approach.
Most looked pretty standard. The odd hand is possibly dubious (like the 44 hand that, I think, went raise, call and re/raise before you cold jammed with little F/E).
A lot of the hands looked pretty situation dependent. Like when Tommy M/R the button and you ship 19bb with 5 7s. Yes, people will say you don't need to get involved, but I personally like the play. We know Tommy is a good (sigh) aggro player who will be opening the button with almost any 2 cards, this shove will get through more often than not. And it's much better to jam 5 7s than A4o for example. But you already know this
A couple of hands you maybe could've got away from, but generally it all looks fine and very unlucky in some spots. I'd keep up that aggression with your circa 20bb stack.
PM me if you want something travel related finding....
See with the 57s hand I prefer a 3-bet more than a shove. If he's really opening very wide then a 3-bet should get through just as often and we save ourselves from going bust when he does have a hand he's willing to go to war with. I'll usually 3bet to just over 4bb's. We can balance a small 3-bet here by 3-betting TT-AA/broadways this small - and we can still just shove hands like medium pairs and some off suit AQ/AJ hands.
See with the 57s hand I prefer a 3-bet more than a shove. If he's really opening very wide then a 3-bet should get through just as often and we save ourselves from going bust when he does have a hand he's willing to go to war with. I'll usually 3bet to just over 4bb's. We can balance a small 3-bet here by 3-betting TT-AA/broadways this small - and we can still just shove hands like medium pairs and some off suit AQ/AJ hands. Posted by F_Ivanovic
And if i get called and the flop comes down A high (like it did)?
Or if i get reraised pre i've committed much more of my stack for little point. Shoving gives maximum FE to tommy to fold out precisely the type of hand he's holding. I'd do this with medium to high PPs too.
Yeah I think it would be foolish to basically click it back vs Tommy out of position. He could easy 4bet stick us in with air, and we've just donated nearly 25% of our stack for no real reason.
But remember, Ivan thinks it is fine to raise/fold a 12bb stack
Doesn't matter if we're balanced though does it? Tommy isn't going to just call with any 2 cards he raises with if he's really raising the BTN that wide - he'd be the one that's bleeding chips in that case.
It's funny I should say that, I've just remembered I was sat with Tommy last night in the BH main at one point. He min- opened in the CO I think it was to 1k and I 3-bet on the SB to 2.2k with Q8s - and he folded. If he's that spewy that he's going to 4bet it in with air then we can just 3-bet wider for value and profit. I doubt that Tommy will do that though!
As for what happens if we see a flop - easy easy c-bet. Unless the board is super wet and hit's their range we can c-bet small with our entire range. And by small I mean 1/4 to 1/3 bet. Especially so on an A high board that's all we need to bet.
Yeah one thing someone suggested to me ages ago for MTTs is to have like a set schedule for the night, so pick whatever it is you wanna play (probably only about 4 MTTs of a night on here), if you bust them all then just call it a night, rather than flicking it in to loads of rubbish MTTs cos you have nothing else to play. Posted by Lambert180
yeah right - probably great advice but no way could i do this - nor would i guess gazza - rather try to play with a different style than not play at all
It's very easy to dismiss hand 1 as #lolStandard. Mainly because it. You have a hand that crushes a randomly selected hand in the BB, you have an ace blocker and 10bb. It's a jam v most players. However let's look a little deeper and think about what we are jamming here and what the match ups are when called.
Old level thinking was jam ATC here, they need a hand to call. IMO poker has moved on somewhat. Yes there are still cases for ATC jams but we must think about the BBs thoughts on us, our range and what we think their call range is. I got into a long drawn out conversation with some people who will remain nameless. The discussion is my claim that I would rather be jamming Q9s small to big than 22. And if you're reading guys, all the Stoves in the world won't change my mind. Let's change this slightly and look at jamming Q9s against A5o, your hand here. When they fold, we might as well have two napkins. When they call, what do they call with? On this site the mean range seems to be all pairs, most if not all aces and some high kings (let's say this isn't a Bounty Hunter, that would widen things). Now A5o plays pretty bad against this range. In fact the only advantage A5 has against Q9s is the narrow top end of an oppos calling range (QQ, KK). Q9s will have a ton more 40/60s compared to a significant amount of 30/70s for A5o.
So what am I saying? A5o should be a hand we consider folding against some people dependant on their impression of us, particularly how many times we have been jamming blind on blind. What do we think of their call range? Try to avoid just thinking 'tight' unless we are talking super tight (prems only).
Well that was a pretty drawn out look at a super standard hand, can't wait to see where I go with the rest.
Now I like turning a hand into a bluff as much as the next guy, I managed to do it with a set a few days ago, a new invigorating experience. However there is a time and a place. The key is obviously 'what fold equity do with have?' They lead against flow on a monotone board and our jam just isn't deep enough to get many folds from the range of hands that lead. If he has the weak Jack or the bare Big Heart he's still calling. I don't think we are bluffing here, we're just hoping he has a draw and we can hold.
Be aware of stack sizes and the ratio between the effective one and the pot. Also consider if they really are looking like they will fold. Board texture is key to this.
Ok, three down, many many mnay more to go. Will resume tomorrow.
Ok just one more thing as I have seen there has been some discussion on the 3bet 20bb jam.
This is a tricky one to explain and I apologise right now if I don't make myself clear. Luckily there is an edit function on these posts. Is a 20bb jam too big in Poker or on SkyPoker? It depends.
So SkyPoker doesn't have antes, meaning when we 3bet jam and get it through we win less. We also put in less in an orbit without antes and therefore have less pressure on our stack. So on this count we can reduce our benchmarks for open shoving, 3bet shoving and raise/folding. However, and here's the part a bunch of people don't get, it's 6max. The blinds come around quicker. The structure of blind levels are also different in some spots and MTTs. So while our M is lower without antes, those blinds come around a lot faster. You'd be amazed how many people don't realise this.
Now let's factor in oppo ranges. Is the person who opened mostly peeling a small 3bet 100% but sometimes/often folding to a shove. Just got off a table where any 3bet was peeled pretty wide but jams were folded to except for the real top end. Does it matter if we are balanced against this player? Some players on this and all sites it is essential to be balanced lest we become exploited, against others it can be utterly pointless and we end up exploiting ourselves.
There are no adjusted ranges for 3bet jamming I can give you, no real number where you must 3bet jam or can now raise/fold. That comes with experience and for me the most important thing, getting into oppos minds and thinking what they are thinking. On a site like Sky (6max, plenty of regs you will see over and over again, no HUDs to use as a crutch) this is essential.
Meh, not 100% I explained myself well there. I'll leave it up anyway and just leave this cliff:
Working out a Reg's thoughts in shallow (sub 30 BB) MTT spots is like printing money. You should work really hard to figure them out. And as it's 6max there is plenty of time to get a feel for a player you have not seen before at the table.
Cheers Tommy... interesting to hear youre views on Hand number 1. So if I understand it correctly, you dont consider what I did to be wrong, but its entirely villain dependant/history to whether I expect to called light with KQ, QJ,J10s, K10 type hands or whether im solely going to get called by hands that crush my range (i.e. all pps and all Ax hands). So relative to the opponent if he thinks we are shoving any two cards then a shove is less likely to get through, however villains calling range is wider. Similarly, the opposite if he see's me as tight. I dunno, I understand that our A5os is likely to be dominated if we are called so the Q9s argument makes a heap of sense, however Im not sure I can bring myself to just fold A5 in the sb of an unopened pot with <10bb. Raise/folding makes no sense, and throwing away hands like this when you are so shallow.... and when the blinds do come round quick can just result in you dwindling away chips, so even when you do get a hand your FE just isnt there.
Hand 32 was just a nightmare. It went bet,call,raise,call,jam,rejam, fold. I was thinking at the time that when I am called in two spots with a 3 bet pre and both players want to shovel the money on a lowish flop, either one has the flush draw and the other an overpair or im crushed by a set. I still think that after the bet/call/raise I possibly could have gotten away. It was clear other villain wasnt going away and im unlikely to be too far ahead even if I am ahead... Still I think it was an OK fold - although pretty standard as I had all the signs from two villains that I was behind.
Hand 6 I kind of kicked myself over. I didnt think i'd get the shove through at the time, although looking at villains cards I am surprised he managed a call as he could be drawing mega thin given action. I was hoping he was on a draw, yes - just a tad unlucky to run into my exact hand and still end up losing! Meh it happens I guess.
Not entirely sure what you're point is in the last post. Summary sounds like I should be reading villains thought processes regarding shoving/calling ranges/their perception on me slightly better to know what range I can get away with. You say balancing doesnt matter... but if villains have only seen me get to showdown with premium then noone will want to pay me off when I do get a hand - although the upside is I can get away with bullying people with a wider range.
I suppose as is always true in poker, each hand can't be taken in isolation - each hand is very much situation dependant as to whether it was the 'correct play'. Its understanding how that 'correct play' may vary from hand to hand, table to table as ultimately there is no uniform way to play each hand. A 3 bet jam with 64s with 19bb may be ideal on one table, but completely spewy on another.
Poker eh?
Look forward to reading your other thoughts on the other 30+ hands
It didnt help that in the rebuy i could just re-enter and spew another buy-in away. One or two were just poor plays tbh but the others were awful. Deepstack I was plodding along quite happily biding my time. Picked up KK about 60bb deep and got it in v QQ and got outdrawn. Other tournaments werent any better including a very simlar spot in the mini.
Withdrawn BR.
Watching a film.
Evaluate if/when I come back. Had enough of poker tbh... I can't do anything right at the minute.
Hi Gazza and all. This really is fascinating reading. Been playing on the site for about a year now but never really delved into the forum. glad I have. Great to read evaluations of hands from players with far far more experience than me. I am thinking about setting one of these 'diaries' up myself to make me focus on my bankroll more, as at the moment, I have virtually no management skills of it. WOuld people be interested even though I am new here? One other question which will make me seem a total 'noob', what does NL mean when refering to buy in at a table?
Hi Gazza and all. This really is fascinating reading. Been playing on the site for about a year now but never really delved into the forum. glad I have. Great to read evaluations of hands from players with far far more experience than me. I am thinking about setting one of these 'diaries' up myself to make me focus on my bankroll more, as at the moment, I have virtually no management skills of it. WOuld people be interested even though I am new here? One other question which will make me seem a total 'noob', what does NL mean when refering to buy in at a table? Posted by Jack3010
Hi Jack - welcome to the forum.
NL is the maximum buy in for that particular table. 10NL is £10. 100NL is £100. Etc. Etc.
Hi Gazza and all. This really is fascinating reading. Been playing on the site for about a year now but never really delved into the forum. glad I have. Great to read evaluations of hands from players with far far more experience than me. I am thinking about setting one of these 'diaries' up myself to make me focus on my bankroll more, as at the moment, I have virtually no management skills of it. WOuld people be interested even though I am new here? One other question which will make me seem a total 'noob', what does NL mean when refering to buy in at a table? Posted by Jack3010
Glad you like the read, even if its just me complaing the whole time. I try not to, but when youre in the middle of the biggest downswing its hard to stay positive.
Starting a diary has its pro's and con's. You get to interact with the community a lot more and share your experiences which is good, but sharing everything can be a drain especially if things arent going well - although advice is always offered when needed which is great - shows the community at sky arent half bad!
Comments
Or if i get reraised pre i've committed much more of my stack for little point. Shoving gives maximum FE to tommy to fold out precisely the type of hand he's holding. I'd do this with medium to high PPs too.
I did warn you...
Old level thinking was jam ATC here, they need a hand to call. IMO poker has moved on somewhat. Yes there are still cases for ATC jams but we must think about the BBs thoughts on us, our range and what we think their call range is. I got into a long drawn out conversation with some people who will remain nameless. The discussion is my claim that I would rather be jamming Q9s small to big than 22. And if you're reading guys, all the Stoves in the world won't change my mind. Let's change this slightly and look at jamming Q9s against A5o, your hand here. When they fold, we might as well have two napkins. When they call, what do they call with? On this site the mean range seems to be all pairs, most if not all aces and some high kings (let's say this isn't a Bounty Hunter, that would widen things). Now A5o plays pretty bad against this range. In fact the only advantage A5 has against Q9s is the narrow top end of an oppos calling range (QQ, KK). Q9s will have a ton more 40/60s compared to a significant amount of 30/70s for A5o.
So what am I saying? A5o should be a hand we consider folding against some people dependant on their impression of us, particularly how many times we have been jamming blind on blind. What do we think of their call range? Try to avoid just thinking 'tight' unless we are talking super tight (prems only).
Well that was a pretty drawn out look at a super standard hand, can't wait to see where I go with the rest.
Hand 32) This is a well played hand by you in an absolutely nightmarish spot. I don't think you folded too late, I think it's a solid fold.
Now I like turning a hand into a bluff as much as the next guy, I managed to do it with a set a few days ago, a new invigorating experience. However there is a time and a place. The key is obviously 'what fold equity do with have?' They lead against flow on a monotone board and our jam just isn't deep enough to get many folds from the range of hands that lead. If he has the weak Jack or the bare Big Heart he's still calling. I don't think we are bluffing here, we're just hoping he has a draw and we can hold.
Be aware of stack sizes and the ratio between the effective one and the pot. Also consider if they really are looking like they will fold. Board texture is key to this.
Ok, three down, many many mnay more to go. Will resume tomorrow.
This is a tricky one to explain and I apologise right now if I don't make myself clear. Luckily there is an edit function on these posts. Is a 20bb jam too big in Poker or on SkyPoker? It depends.
So SkyPoker doesn't have antes, meaning when we 3bet jam and get it through we win less. We also put in less in an orbit without antes and therefore have less pressure on our stack. So on this count we can reduce our benchmarks for open shoving, 3bet shoving and raise/folding. However, and here's the part a bunch of people don't get, it's 6max. The blinds come around quicker. The structure of blind levels are also different in some spots and MTTs. So while our M is lower without antes, those blinds come around a lot faster. You'd be amazed how many people don't realise this.
Now let's factor in oppo ranges. Is the person who opened mostly peeling a small 3bet 100% but sometimes/often folding to a shove. Just got off a table where any 3bet was peeled pretty wide but jams were folded to except for the real top end. Does it matter if we are balanced against this player? Some players on this and all sites it is essential to be balanced lest we become exploited, against others it can be utterly pointless and we end up exploiting ourselves.
There are no adjusted ranges for 3bet jamming I can give you, no real number where you must 3bet jam or can now raise/fold. That comes with experience and for me the most important thing, getting into oppos minds and thinking what they are thinking. On a site like Sky (6max, plenty of regs you will see over and over again, no HUDs to use as a crutch) this is essential.
Meh, not 100% I explained myself well there. I'll leave it up anyway and just leave this cliff:
Working out a Reg's thoughts in shallow (sub 30 BB) MTT spots is like printing money. You should work really hard to figure them out. And as it's 6max there is plenty of time to get a feel for a player you have not seen before at the table.
Hand 32 was just a nightmare. It went bet,call,raise,call,jam,rejam, fold. I was thinking at the time that when I am called in two spots with a 3 bet pre and both players want to shovel the money on a lowish flop, either one has the flush draw and the other an overpair or im crushed by a set. I still think that after the bet/call/raise I possibly could have gotten away. It was clear other villain wasnt going away and im unlikely to be too far ahead even if I am ahead... Still I think it was an OK fold - although pretty standard as I had all the signs from two villains that I was behind.
Hand 6 I kind of kicked myself over. I didnt think i'd get the shove through at the time, although looking at villains cards I am surprised he managed a call as he could be drawing mega thin given action. I was hoping he was on a draw, yes - just a tad unlucky to run into my exact hand and still end up losing! Meh it happens I guess.
Not entirely sure what you're point is in the last post. Summary sounds like I should be reading villains thought processes regarding shoving/calling ranges/their perception on me slightly better to know what range I can get away with. You say balancing doesnt matter... but if villains have only seen me get to showdown with premium then noone will want to pay me off when I do get a hand - although the upside is I can get away with bullying people with a wider range.
I suppose as is always true in poker, each hand can't be taken in isolation - each hand is very much situation dependant as to whether it was the 'correct play'. Its understanding how that 'correct play' may vary from hand to hand, table to table as ultimately there is no uniform way to play each hand. A 3 bet jam with 64s with 19bb may be ideal on one table, but completely spewy on another.
Poker eh?
Look forward to reading your other thoughts on the other 30+ hands
Genuinely.
It didnt help that in the rebuy i could just re-enter and spew another buy-in away. One or two were just poor plays tbh but the others were awful. Deepstack I was plodding along quite happily biding my time. Picked up KK about 60bb deep and got it in v QQ and got outdrawn. Other tournaments werent any better including a very simlar spot in the mini.
Withdrawn BR.
Watching a film.
Evaluate if/when I come back. Had enough of poker tbh... I can't do anything right at the minute.
NL is the maximum buy in for that particular table. 10NL is £10. 100NL is £100. Etc. Etc.
Starting a diary has its pro's and con's. You get to interact with the community a lot more and share your experiences which is good, but sharing everything can be a drain especially if things arent going well - although advice is always offered when needed which is great - shows the community at sky arent half bad!