The question was 'CAN' an RNG be set within a range. So the answer has to be yes. If the question was 'ARE' any RNG's set within a range, then my answer would be no. I'm definitely not suggesting online poker is rigged or that sites mess with the RNG. That would just send my paranoia out of control As I said, and Tony agreed with, why would they ? Just not a huge amount in it for them. Posted by Fortunatus
Well we are getting into semantics now, but to me, by definition, if you tried to programme a RNG "within a range",then it would not be Random, would it?
The question was 'CAN' an RNG be set within a range. So the answer has to be yes. If the question was 'ARE' any RNG's set within a range, then my answer would be no. I'm definitely not suggesting online poker is rigged or that sites mess with the RNG. That would just send my paranoia out of control As I said, and Tony agreed with, why would they ? Just not a huge amount in it for them. Posted by Fortunatus
How do you know this?
Surely any tampering with an RNG suddenly means it isn't an RNG.....
IT might be a SMTCMARNG. slightly modified to create more action random number generator. I have seen these on virtual monopaly and buckaroo. Posted by Chris_Mc
Played monopoly as a kid me 1st board game (aged 7) i was the Banker
random means unpredictable one by one - but doesn't mean that the distribution has to be continuous or discrete uniform. it could give twice as many A as any other card and still be random. however that RNG would not be fit for online poker!
The answer to your question in yes. The word random in RNG means that you cannot predict the outcome and that every outcome is possible, that's not to say that an RNG couldn't be programmed to make some outcomes more probable than others. That's just simple maths. The whole question of 'is online poker rigged' is a bit of a boring one though. Sites have their RNG's audited and verified and it's just not worth their time in making it anything other than a fair and random deal. There are so many pairs of eyes on the data that if anything could ever be proved with hard evidence that an RNG was fixed, then the reputation of the site (and online poker in general) would be destroyed. The good sites make a decent amount of money, without needing to get greedy. Posted by Fortunatus
Love monoply. I think everyone plays it diffrent... same as poker. Every family puts a twist on the rules.. small things. Like, all utility payments and and water payments go too free parking. If u land on free parking u get the money. i must the car... if i do not get set peice the game will not go ahead. Me be8ng the husband and the father this is rule no 1. Posted by Chris_Mc
i was always the car as well if they asked for a loan i said NO and took there property cards, 1st game i learnt how to play (which me mum taught me i was 5) was GIN RUMMY best thing she ever taught me after that i had 3 board games from 7-9 monopoly, RISK & Game Of Life, finished 1st 2 still playing the 3rd ONE as its never ending
In Response to Re: Can the RNG on all sites be programmed within a range of settings? : Very true - in Sky’s case it was 5 years ago. Posted by somer
It has to be verified every time a new "Client" or "Platform" is introduced.
So, the new HTML Client 2 years ago, & every one of the Mobile & Tablet products (App, Cash, SNG's, MTT's) had to FIRST be approved by the Regulator BEFORE it was introduced.
In Response to Re: Can the RNG on all sites be programmed within a range of settings? : Very true - in Sky’s case it was 5 years ago. Posted by somer
that's the great thing about maths - doesn't change from year to year - if it was uniform random then it'll be uniform random now - absolutely no reason to change it.
In Response to Re: Can the RNG on all sites be programmed within a range of settings? : It has to be verified every time a new "Client" or "Platform" is introduced. So, the new HTML Client 2 years ago, & every one of the Mobile & Tablet products (App, Cash, SNG's, MTT's) had to FIRST be approved by the Regulator BEFORE it was introduced. Posted by Tikay10
In Response to Re: Can the RNG on all sites be programmed within a range of settings? : Well we are getting into semantics now, but to me, by definition, if you tried to programme a RNG "within a range",then it would not be Random, would it? Posted by Tikay10
The dictionary defines the word random as "having equal opportunity to occur at any time"... in other words its not random, or its is random less the card it randomly selected the last time it randomly selected one!!!! a decreasing algorithm
Why not just call it a Nearly Random Number Generator!! real question is "is it fixed" and unless someone gets caught with their hand in the cookie jar (which as pointed out Absolute Poker already have) and proves otherwise then all of us sheep are told to believe its not... so back to the original question "is it set within a range" of course it is other wise it wouldn't do what its designed to do""
In Response to Re: Can the RNG on all sites be programmed within a range of settings? : Hi Lee, There have been, down the years, mercifully few examples of poker sites messing about, though Absolute Poker, for example, deffo pulled some dirty tricks. I can't ever recall a single credible example of ANY Online Poker Site messing with the RNG though. Why would they? There is nothing to gain. In modern society, when things go wrong, people look to blame others. So a small minority of losing poker players blame the RNG. I don't know what excuse they use when they lose "Live", though! Posted by Tikay10
I do not believe that the RnG is rigged however, All poker sites want their players to " enjoy " their game. I think that how this can be achieved is to have a totally random 2 hole cards, then to make sure that some players have a playable hand you can have a flop that encourages play. I.E. if the flop is K 9 2 then you may get no action but if you then make it Ks 9c 2c, theres top pair, flush draw that way it generates play.and then RANDOM turn and river That way the RnG has in no way determined the winner or chosen which players get the action. Just giving someone the choice to play. Of course this does not include BAD play or bad beats, just to generate play, and of course the rake
In Response to Re: Can the RNG on all sites be programmed within a range of settings? : I do not believe that the RnG is rigged however, All poker sites want their players to " enjoy " their game. I think that how this can be achieved is to have a totally random 2 hole cards, then to make sure that some players have a playable hand you can have a flop that encourages play. I.E. if the flop is K 9 2 then you may get no action but if you then make it Ks 9c 2c, theres top pair, flush draw that way it generates play.and then RANDOM turn and river That way the RnG has in no way determined the winner or chosen which players get the action. Just giving someone the choice to play. Of course this does not include BAD play or bad beats, just to generate play, and of course the rake Posted by bludreid11
Is it really that difficult to grasp the concept of an RNG?
In Response to Re: Can the RNG on all sites be programmed within a range of settings? : I do not believe that the RnG is rigged however, All poker sites want their players to " enjoy " their game. I think that how this can be achieved is to have a totally random 2 hole cards, then to make sure that some players have a playable hand you can have a flop that encourages play. I.E. if the flop is K 9 2 then you may get no action but if you then make it Ks 9c 2c, theres top pair, flush draw that way it generates play.and then RANDOM turn and river That way the RnG has in no way determined the winner or chosen which players get the action. Just giving someone the choice to play. Of course this does not include BAD play or bad beats, just to generate play, and of course the rake Posted by bludreid11
So certain players always get a flop which encourages them to play? You're going to set a non-random flop based on the live randomly drawn hole cards (for only certain players) then set a random turn and river. Sounds overly complicated to me, prob easier to let it all be random.
If you have time count the number of times action finishes on the flop, or the number of times that all the money doesn't go in by the river on cash tables. There'll be a few.
In Response to Re: Can the RNG on all sites be programmed within a range of settings? : It has to be verified every time a new "Client" or "Platform" is introduced. So, the new HTML Client 2 years ago, & every one of the Mobile & Tablet products (App, Cash, SNG's, MTT's) had to FIRST be approved by the Regulator BEFORE it was introduced. Posted by Tikay10
I was basing my comment on:
The sites Help and Support section: “Random Number Generator” states (today 20/10/2014) - TST conducted an audit of Sky Betting and Gaming in September 2009.
Perhaps the site could consider modifying the above information and confirming that the site has had a more recent audit.
In Response to Re: Can the RNG on all sites be programmed within a range of settings? : I was basing my comment on: The sites Help and Support section: “Random Number Generator” states (today 20/10/2014) - TST conducted an audit of Sky Betting and Gaming in September 2009. Perhaps the site could consider modifying the above information and confirming that the site has had a more recent audit. Posted by somer
Why would the RNG need to be checked more often? This isn't WarGames, mate
Having said that: anyone fancy a nice game of chess?
Comments
Surely any tampering with an RNG suddenly means it isn't an RNG.....
i was always the car as well if they asked for a loan i said NO and took there property cards, 1st game i learnt how to play (which me mum taught me i was 5) was GIN RUMMY best thing she ever taught me after that i had 3 board games from 7-9 monopoly, RISK & Game Of Life, finished 1st 2 still playing the 3rd ONE as its never ending
So, the new HTML Client 2 years ago, & every one of the Mobile & Tablet products (App, Cash, SNG's, MTT's) had to FIRST be approved by the Regulator BEFORE it was introduced.
Why not just call it a Nearly Random Number Generator!! real question is "is it fixed" and unless someone gets caught with their hand in the cookie jar (which as pointed out Absolute Poker already have) and proves otherwise then all of us sheep are told to believe its not... so back to the original question "is it set within a range" of course it is other wise it wouldn't do what its designed to do""
I think that how this can be achieved is to have a totally random 2 hole cards, then to make sure that some players have a playable hand you can have a flop that encourages play. I.E. if the flop is K 9 2 then you may get no action but if you then make it Ks 9c 2c, theres top pair, flush draw that way it generates play.and then RANDOM turn and river
That way the RnG has in no way determined the winner or chosen which players get the action. Just giving someone the choice to play.
Of course this does not include BAD play or bad beats, just to generate play, and of course the rake
Having said that: anyone fancy a nice game of chess?