In Response to Re: The (imaginatively titled) Orford Poker Journal 2016 : Very well done Rich! That must be a decent "lifetime" profit now m8. Congrats! Posted by StayOrGo
Cheers Graham. Sadly my lifetime profit on Sky's MTTs has dipped to minus £900 according to Sharkscope, although that 'only' equates to £100 a year so I can live with that at the moment.
As for 2016 though, I've been up and down but I'm pretty much on +/- £0 for the year at this point. Which, for the half way mark of the year I would imagine is better than most recreational players, but obviously must be improved upon.
I've stopped being a losing player money-wise, and I can now win tournaments, but I've got to translate that into being a winning player money-wise.
I guess consistency and BRM is the key. Especially the latter, as my results are pretty solid these days.
PS- enjoying your thread. Up to Hand 2 (!). FWIW I'd have raised the K3o with a view to double-barrellling against a serial floater. But only those in those conditions (or against passive opponents on the button and blinds). Other than that I'm folding pre all day long.
here are your two profit charts from january 2014 to june 2016.
i recall our chats on your thread last year from the beginning of 2015 (a low point) and want to believe that it started a change, even though it was just a couple of tweaks.
regards, envious.
whilst the photo of your charts awaits authorisation you can see your full details by going to www.PokerSuperHero.com/r
type in or select your alias from the drop-down box.
In Response to Re: The (imaginatively titled) Orford Poker Journal 2016: [QUOTE]well played rich, again. here are your two profit charts from january 2014 to june 2016. i recall our chats on your thread last year from the beginning of 2015 (a low point) and want to believe that it started a change, even though it was just a couple of tweaks. regards, envious. whilst the photo of your charts awaits authorisation you can see your full details by going to www.PokerSuperHero.com/r type in or select your alias from the drop-down box. Posted by aussie09
Cheers Rob.
Excellent statwork once again.
Here's the thing I can't get my head around though- the discrepancy between your stats and Sharkscope. Both use only Sky's MTTs- yet you've got me pegged for a £744 profit on the year (and believe me, yours is the one I want to go with) and yet if you trace the line on my sharkscope...
i was interested to look in more depth at your figures. in particular the numbers that Sharkscope has compared to the number i have on PokerSuperHero.
there are three areas that differ between the two. All Games v All Major Games.
Sharkscope (SS) looks at all MTTs irrespective of size of buy-in whereas PokerSuperHero (PSH) looks at the top 7,000 MTTs a year all having a guarantee of £500 and more.
Satellites v No Satellites.
SS count expenditure in satellites, PSH does not.
Rebuys.
SS best guesses how much you spend on the buy-in, rebuys and add-on whereas PSH takes the initial buy-in amount. I am undecided which is best. I believe that a simple average might be best, that is the total buy-ins, rebuys and add-ons divided by number of entrants.
Conclusion
To my mind, the consequence of this is that SS is good if you look at your own figures, PSH is good if you want to compare player ability and performance. To produce performance league tables i believe that it is important to measure the things that are consistent and meaningful. PSH therefore does not include the smallest MTTs, satellites and freerolls.
Looking at your figures... the thing that i deduce is that you might be better off playing an MTT rather than satellites. Let's see if that holds water.
2014 for example. SS notes you playing 181 games and losing £758. PSH notes you playing 93 major MTTs and losing £544. Both SS and PSH used an average for rebuy MTTs. The difference is 88 games. These are non-major tournaments and satellites. You lost £214 in these. If you assign an average value of £4 to each of these you have an expenditure of £352, and therefore a ROI% of minus 61%. PSH has your total actual expenditure on the 93 major games was exactly £1,662. You lost £544 which is an ROI of minus 33%.
hi richard and thanks. i was interested to look in more depth at your figures. in particular the numbers that Sharkscope has compared to the number i have on PokerSuperHero. there are three areas that differ between the two. All Games v All Major Games . Sharkscope (SS) looks at all MTTs irrespective of size of buy-in whereas PokerSuperHero (PSH) looks at the top 7,000 MTTs a year all having a guarantee of £500 and more. Satellites v No Satellites . SS count expenditure in satellites, PSH does not. Rebuys. SS best guesses how much you spend on the buy-in, rebuys and add-on whereas PSH takes the initial buy-in amount. I am undecided which is best. I believe that a simple average might be best, that is the total buy-ins, rebuys and add-ons divided by number of entrants. To my mind, the consequence of this is that SS is good if you only look at your own figures, PSH is good if you want to compare player ability and performance. To produce performance league tables i believe that it is important to measure the things that are meaningful and offer consistency. PSH therefore does not include the smallest MTTs, satellites and freerolls. Looking at your figures... the thing that i deduce is that you might be better off playing an MTT rather than satellites. Let's see if that holds water. Numbers 2014 for example. SS notes you playing 181 games and losing £758. PSH notes you playing 93 major MTTs and losing £544. Both SS and PSH used an average for rebuy MTTs. The difference is 88 games. These are non-major tournaments and satellites. You lost £214 in these. If you assign an average value of £4 to each of these you have an expenditure of £352, and therefore a ROI% of minus 61%. PSH has your total actual expenditure on the 93 major games was exactly £1,662. You lost £544 which is an ROI of minus 33%. Rob. Posted by aussie09
Ah yes, that now makes perfect sense.
I do try to satellite into the £55 and £110 games and so there's clearly some expenditure there.
That said, I'm pretty certain a couple of my big scores e.g the recent Super Roller FT for £1000+ was due to satelliting in so one could argue that it's a necessary expense as I wouldn't have played it otherwise.
I assumed SS took all buy-ins, rebuys, add-ins into account by adding or subtracting your actual profit/loss at the end of the tournament (which I assumed they got from Sky and which would be winnings minus all buy-in figures).
That seems like a major flaw in their reckoning if they're guessing at it.
I guess ultimately you can use SS and your brilliant PSH as fun guides and glean interesting and helpful info off them, but they're probably best used in conjunction with one's own detailed records. Because only you can be brutally honest about how much you've spent on the tables. Everyone else just hears the chirps and sees the results.
That's why I've long since laid off the cash tables in any meaningful way. First up- 16 years of experience has taught me the hard way- it's just not something I excel at. I seem to naturally fit MTTs, so it's cheaper for me to stick to them!
And secondly, playing the odd (usually losing) sessions of cash skews my profit figures in poker and doesn't make those you see on SS and PSH authentic.
To take it to extremes- what's the point in getting excited about a £900 profit for 2016 on SS and PSH if you've spent £3500 on cash?
So, I've been 'clean' for quite a while now. I'm Mr MTT and I'm not sure if you'll ever see me on the cash tables again.
Cheers for all your work anyway. It's massively impressive. And yes, based on the fact that your 'Moneyball' advice works wonders for tweaking my game, I'm going to take your latest advice and play less satellites and more MTTs!
i tried cash and stopped too. best to use data to do more of what you are good at, and less of the things your aren't. now all you and i need to do is work out what mattbates does and then simply copy and paste.
i tried cash and stopped too. best to use data to do more of what you are good at, and less of the things your aren't. now all you and i need to do is work out what mattbates does and then simply copy and paste. all that aside, well played. very well played. Posted by aussie09
Only Matt knows how many satellites, add-ons, rebuys, and losing cash sessions must be offset against his legendary MTT stats.
I suspect in fact we're both actually thrashing him.
In fact, let's just say we are. It's our word against his and there's two of us.
i have worked out how SS are calculating rebuy tournaments on sky poker. accurate information by player is not available so SS best guess by taking the total payouts and divide by number of players and then add one registration fee for each player. it is an approximation, however, this creates another error as all rebuys and add-ons on sky poker attract a registration fee which is not included in SS figures.
Just to say I'll be on the site again tonight. Targetting the Main, Mini and 9pm BH as standard and a few more tournies besides.
It's gone a little pear-shaped since my last bankroll update, in fact I'm a little embarrassed to reveal the full horror of it but maybe will be brave enough to show it once I have a cash under my belt which makes my graph look more respectable.
Without mentioning actual figures then, here's the last 9 weeks in a nutshell...
Whoops.
It was going so well in early July when I won a 167 runner £3K B/Hunter, cashing for £728.
And then THAT happened.
This, I think, is down to a combination of 3 things-
(1) overall ability, obvs
(2) variance- to be fair I have been improving over the years so I haven't suddenly got worse again
and (3) bankroll management. No matter how hard I try, I can't seem to stop buying in directly into tournaments which my poker profit cannot afford. Probably should be playing £5 MTTS only. This is an area I've been now been working on for the past 10 years so I think we can safely assume at this stage I'm never going to get it.
So, tonight I will be attempting to arrest the slide and post an upturn on Sharkscope, even if it's microscopic.
Hope to see many of you at the tables. Come and say hello, but please be gentle. I'm a little sensitive right now! ;-)
Hi all, Just to say I'll be on the site again tonight. Targetting the Main, Mini and 9pm BH as standard and a few more tournies besides. It's gone a little pear-shaped since my last bankroll update, in fact I'm a little embarrassed to reveal the full horror of it but maybe will be brave enough to show it once I have a cash under my belt which makes my graph look more respectable. Without mentioning actual figures then, here's the last 9 weeks in a nutshell... Whoops. It was going so well in early July when I won a 167 runner £3K B/Hunter, cashing for £728. And then THAT happened. This, I think, is down to a combination of 3 things- (1) overall ability, obvs (2) variance- to be fair I have been improving over the years so I haven't suddenly got worse again and (3) bankroll management. No matter how hard I try, I can't seem to stop buying in directly into tournaments which my poker profit cannot afford. Probably should be playing £5 MTTS only. This is an area I've been now been working on for the past 10 years so I think we can safely assume at this stage I'm never going to get it. So, tonight I will be attempting to arrest the slide and post an upturn on Sharkscope, even if it's microscopic. Hope to see many of you at the tables. Come and say hello, but please be gentle. I'm a little sensitive right now! ;-) Posted by RICHORFORD
We do pop in and say Hi but you usually have chat off. BTW Rose is through to Semi of charity challenge
In Response to Re: The (imaginatively titled) Orford Poker Journal 2016 : We do pop in and say Hi but you usually have chat off. BTW Rose is through to Semi of charity challenge Posted by Darkangel7
Excellent! Happy for Rose and happy for me, because it makes me look less bad if I lost to the eventual semi-finalist!
The chat is definitely on! If I don't respond straight away it's because I'm either concentrating on the table or I've switched over temporarily to check the game info.
Actually a pretty fun night at the tables. I played well in the three tournaments I entered and ended up cashing in all 3!
10th/180 in the Main Event for £122.50
12th/148 in the Mini Event for £41
7th/ in the 9pm Bounty Hunter for £56.25 head-prizes.
That was probably the closest I've got yet to the Sky Poker main and mini £5,000 jackpot. 10th and 12th on the same night!
As for the 9pm Bounty Hunter, it was annoying to finish on the bubble and miss out on a min cash of just under £100, but the £56 in head prizes meant the tournament was a freeroll.
Made a profit of around £115 tonight, which was nice, but it's the 100% cash rate that I'm most pleased with.
Is this a corner I'm turning here? Or a mere anomaly on my way further down? Only time will tell.
Thanks to the railers tonight and see you at the tables next time!
Mission accomplished! Slight upturn on Sharkscope achieved. Actually a pretty fun night at the tables. I played well in the three tournaments I entered and ended up cashing in all 3! 10th/180 in the Main Event for £122.50 12th/148 in the Mini Event for £41 7th/ in the 9pm Bounty Hunter for £56.25 head-prizes. That was probably the closest I've got yet to the Sky Poker main and mini £5,000 jackpot. 10th and 12th on the same night! As for the 9pm Bounty Hunter, it was annoying to finish on the bubble and miss out on a min cash of just under £100, but the £56 in head prizes meant the tournament was a freeroll. Made a profit of around £115 tonight, which was nice, but it's the 100% cash rate that I'm most pleased with. Is this a corner I'm turning here? Or a mere anomaly on my way further down? Only time will tell. Thanks to the railers tonight and see you at the tables next time! Posted by RICHORFORD
Well done Rich here's hoping for your long awaited upswing again
In Response to Re: The (imaginatively titled) Orford Poker Journal 2016 : This sounds like a song lyric. Maybe a future venture idea? WP on the cashes. Posted by dragon1964
Lol! Brilliant!
Another thought struck me today about my recent poker performance...
Is this the real life? Or is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality.
Already started as I mean NOT to go on, with a 10 minute appearance in the 7 @ 7 MTT. You know the exit, I've KKs, he's got JJs, the money all goes-in pre and he rivers a J.
Anyway, it's the 7.30pm comp next followed by the main and the mini, whilst I watch the football.
Remember this? (see above post for an explanation)
Well now...it's this!
Yes, loving the little upturn at the end there!
Finished 2nd in tonight's 9pm Bounty Hunter, losing heads-up to ChickenMelt. Really enjoyed the tornament and was chip leader for most of it- in fact managed to take more head prizes than anyone else including the winner, meaning I cashed for £600.
Not out the woods yet though- that little red line needs to travel above the previous highest point for me to break even in poker over a lifetime.
Remember this? (see above post for an explanation) Well now...it's this! Yes, loving the little upturn at the end there! Finished 2nd in tonight's 9pm Bounty Hunter, losing heads-up to ChickenMelt. Really enjoyed the tornament and was chip leader for most of it- in fact managed to take more head prizes than anyone else including the winner, meaning I cashed for £600. Not out the woods yet though- that little red line needs to travel above the previous highest point for me to break even in poker over a lifetime. The mission continues! Thanks to everyone who said hello tonight! Posted by RICHORFORD
Comments
well played rich, again.
here are your two profit charts from january 2014 to june 2016.
i recall our chats on your thread last year from the beginning of 2015 (a low point) and want to believe that it started a change, even though it was just a couple of tweaks.
regards,
envious.
whilst the photo of your charts awaits authorisation you can see your full details by going to www.PokerSuperHero.com/r
type in or select your alias from the drop-down box.
[QUOTE]well played rich, again. here are your two profit charts from january 2014 to june 2016. i recall our chats on your thread last year from the beginning of 2015 (a low point) and want to believe that it started a change, even though it was just a couple of tweaks. regards, envious. whilst the photo of your charts awaits authorisation you can see your full details by going to www.PokerSuperHero.com/r type in or select your alias from the drop-down box.
Posted by aussie09
hi richard and thanks.
i was interested to look in more depth at your figures. in particular the numbers that Sharkscope has compared to the number i have on PokerSuperHero.
there are three areas that differ between the two.
All Games v All Major Games.
Sharkscope (SS) looks at all MTTs irrespective of size of buy-in whereas PokerSuperHero (PSH) looks at the top 7,000 MTTs a year all having a guarantee of £500 and more.
Satellites v No Satellites.
SS count expenditure in satellites, PSH does not.
Rebuys.
SS best guesses how much you spend on the buy-in, rebuys and add-on whereas PSH takes the initial buy-in amount. I am undecided which is best. I believe that a simple average might be best, that is the total buy-ins, rebuys and add-ons divided by number of entrants.
Conclusion
To my mind, the consequence of this is that SS is good if you look at your own figures, PSH is good if you want to compare player ability and performance. To produce performance league tables i believe that it is important to measure the things that are consistent and meaningful. PSH therefore does not include the smallest MTTs, satellites and freerolls.
Looking at your figures... the thing that i deduce is that you might be better off playing an MTT rather than satellites. Let's see if that holds water.
2014 for example. SS notes you playing 181 games and losing £758. PSH notes you playing 93 major MTTs and losing £544. Both SS and PSH used an average for rebuy MTTs. The difference is 88 games. These are non-major tournaments and satellites. You lost £214 in these. If you assign an average value of £4 to each of these you have an expenditure of £352, and therefore a ROI% of minus 61%. PSH has your total actual expenditure on the 93 major games was exactly £1,662. You lost £544 which is an ROI of minus 33%.
Rob.
i tried cash and stopped too. best to use data to do more of what you are good at, and less of the things your aren't. now all you and i need to do is work out what mattbates does and then simply copy and paste.
all that aside, well played. very well played.
i have worked out how SS are calculating rebuy tournaments on sky poker. accurate information by player is not available so SS best guess by taking the total payouts and divide by number of players and then add one registration fee for each player. it is an approximation, however, this creates another error as all rebuys and add-ons on sky poker attract a registration fee which is not included in SS figures.
10th/180 in the Main Event for £122.50
12th/148 in the Mini Event for £41
7th/ in the 9pm Bounty Hunter for £56.25 head-prizes.
That was probably the closest I've got yet to the Sky Poker main and mini £5,000 jackpot. 10th and 12th on the same night!
As for the 9pm Bounty Hunter, it was annoying to finish on the bubble and miss out on a min cash of just under £100, but the £56 in head prizes meant the tournament was a freeroll.
Made a profit of around £115 tonight, which was nice, but it's the 100% cash rate that I'm most pleased with.
Is this a corner I'm turning here? Or a mere anomaly on my way further down? Only time will tell.
Thanks to the railers tonight and see you at the tables next time!