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More skullduggery on online poker ?.

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    Itsover4uItsover4u Member Posts: 1,534
    Yeah saw the jnandez video yesterday … makes you concerned how many competent people who would not play every hand may be doing this
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    tai-gartai-gar Member Posts: 2,603
    Essexphil said:

    Different world to Sky Poker.

    GG is working on a leak whereby someone could effectively see opponents' cards.

    Meanwhile, Sky is still not taking steps on change of tables whereby players cannot see their own cards :)


    I heard that they were going to issue us with special glasses to enable us to see our cards in the New Year instead of changing the software.

    Not only is it cheaper but you can also wear them to the SPT's.
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    green_beergreen_beer Member Posts: 1,789
    edited December 2023
    one thing that is worrying in that video regards sky, is the use of adobe air.......its sad that crooks target the games, but when money is involved there is always someone trying to scam it........


    what sites have the best security teams these days? is stars still the leader?
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    Bean81Bean81 Member Posts: 535
    edited December 2023
    I agree about the related concern for Sky regarding Adobe Air.

    Some additional concerns with Sky:
    1. No two factor authentication for accounts, just a four digit PIN (I could be wrong about this).
    2. Limited budget, which significantly raises the risk of RTA use. No HUD capability means players can't help detect RTA use or bots.
    3. Small player pool that know each other in person, increasing the risk of collusion. The small budget decreases the risk of detection.
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    TheWaddyTheWaddy Member Posts: 1,592
    Im surprised you guys admit that this can even happen.

    Whenever i spot suspicious play where players call with jack hi and win, but fold when you are really strong with no deviation at all (sometimes mid hand, such is the greed, theyd rather speed the win up and expose what they are doing, than playing out the hand they are drawing dead in), over numerous games, sites have always said opponents seeing my cards is 'impossible'.

    When sites are prepared to lie over such things, this is where the trust evaporates. Why you guys aggressively back sites, when it appears you recognise that they are prepared to tell barefaced lies rather then get to the bottom of these things, amazes me. It shows the level of disrespect right there.

    888 was rife with this from Ukranian players. When you get a reply that there is nothing to investgate, because it isnt possible, just shows the level of what sites think of you as a valued customer.

    As you know, i have my suspicions over several players at Sky.... and was told very quickly to shut up by Tikay.... it is something sites will throw back at you as doing something wrong, when you attempt to ask them to look at certain players.

    Clearly they try and keep things quiet, rather than admit its a potential problem... or to even entertain looking into it.... such is the level of care they have towards loyal players.

    You can argue about randomness and the likes, but one thing is 100% with sites. They tell lies. If thats someone you want to place your trust in, thats very naiive...

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    mumsiemumsie Member Posts: 7,412
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MsPjR60Aixo
    TheWaddy said:

    Im surprised you guys admit that this can even happen.

    Whenever i spot suspicious play where players call with jack hi and win, but fold when you are really strong with no deviation at all (sometimes mid hand, such is the greed, theyd rather speed the win up and expose what they are doing, than playing out the hand they are drawing dead in), over numerous games, sites have always said opponents seeing my cards is 'impossible'.

    When sites are prepared to lie over such things, this is where the trust evaporates. Why you guys aggressively back sites, when it appears you recognise that they are prepared to tell barefaced lies rather then get to the bottom of these things, amazes me. It shows the level of disrespect right there.

    888 was rife with this from Ukranian players. When you get a reply that there is nothing to investgate, because it isnt possible, just shows the level of what sites think of you as a valued customer.

    As you know, i have my suspicions over several players at Sky.... and was told very quickly to shut up by Tikay.... it is something sites will throw back at you as doing something wrong, when you attempt to ask them to look at certain players.

    Clearly they try and keep things quiet, rather than admit its a potential problem... or to even entertain looking into it.... such is the level of care they have towards loyal players.

    You can argue about randomness and the likes, but one thing is 100% with sites. They tell lies. If thats someone you want to place your trust in, thats very naiive...

    Before you claim a told you so.

    Lets not forget you believe logging out and back in again changes the outcome of future deals.

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    Bean81Bean81 Member Posts: 535
    I'd be amazed if any forum posters here ever said cheating was impossible or even unlikely. Your whine has always been about the site RNG favouring losing players.

    I've reported chip dumping, collusion and bots a number of times over the years across a number of sites. Each occurrence has been taken seriously and resulted in action. I suspect customer support doesn't take whining without evidence seriously. Especially when it's coming from a nano stakes player who doesn't understand how lags win at the nanos (and where those lags don't report out of the ordinary win rates).

    It's certainly worrying that GG didn't spot this sooner via a review of the highest winning players. GG has notoriously bad security. Stars is excellent. You'll notice it was the players that spotted this hack via collated data. After 20+ years of online poker, we are still waiting for a group of players to bring forward the evidence of RNG rig.
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    TheWaddyTheWaddy Member Posts: 1,592
    You have a long history of misquoting. A big part of bankroll management is to stop playing when the cards are against you, you are welcome to disagree. Therefore i log out when this is happening and take a few hours out... this is more to the fore online, as when compounded long odds are happening, they are not going to stop if you continue.

    I do this out of huge experience. It works for me, as you simply lose ability to make correct decisions. To log back in later in the day/evening generally improves the experience, both for silly outcomes and more importantly, to stop any tilt that may set in.

    Then there was your claim that my stake backing deal, was in fact a 'rakeback deal'... this was simply made up by you and then you got backing from Tikay, simply because you run some things on the site.

    This is how things work on poker sites. You are able to tell lies if your face fits.



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    TheWaddyTheWaddy Member Posts: 1,592
    Bean81 said:

    I'd be amazed if any forum posters here ever said cheating was impossible or even unlikely. Your whine has always been about the site RNG favouring losing players.

    I've reported chip dumping, collusion and bots a number of times over the years across a number of sites. Each occurrence has been taken seriously and resulted in action. I suspect customer support doesn't take whining without evidence seriously. Especially when it's coming from a nano stakes player who doesn't understand how lags win at the nanos (and where those lags don't report out of the ordinary win rates).

    It's certainly worrying that GG didn't spot this sooner via a review of the highest winning players. GG has notoriously bad security. Stars is excellent. You'll notice it was the players that spotted this hack via collated data. After 20+ years of online poker, we are still waiting for a group of players to bring forward the evidence of RNG rig.

    We know what my main 'whine' is, my point is their conduct in such things and the trust element.

    I have had many sites replying that seeing other players cards is impossible. Thats a clear lie. Ive had many sites stating that a deck rig would not benefit them financially... even though this would mean maximising customer retention and rake... a clear lie. GGpoker even though they knew of the problem, did not tell the players for some time. A clear case of contempt for their loyal customers.

    Even Sky im afraid, got fined millions for sending out promotional material to vulnerable gambling addicts, that had opted out of such and also those that were taking self imposed breaks.

    This behaviour tells me they are happy to tell you complete lies and withold information if it benefits them and not you. Yet you guys refuse to think they would ever do anything other than being squeaky clean and are here to serve you and not themselves.

    You always ask 'why would they do that'..... because they are in a business notorious for greed.
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    goldongoldon Member Posts: 8,557
    I had player on my table some time ago said, he could see my cards ... thot he was joking and asked " what are they " he said correctly K J Mm! lucky guess I folded.
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    Bean81Bean81 Member Posts: 535
    Sites don't care about your whining because it's not a legitimate claim and it's never backed up by evidence. That's why you get short shrift. We've had 20+ years of online poker and still no evidence of a faulty deal, let alone one that favours weaker players. Players cheating has nothing to do with a faulty deal.

    There's only been one known case of players being able to see cards due to a site problem, which was the Ultimate Bet employee. The recent GG instance is not dissimilar but did not involve seeing cards. Other instances with HU players have been due to problems on the player side e.g. Doug Polk had an opponent install something on his desktop in-person.

    How would rigging the deck benefit a site financially in the medium-long term?

    Not being open with internal business problems, lacking sufficient internal controls and staff incompetence are all very different to being deceitful. Underhand activity is obviously possible but there's been no evidence of RNG rigging so far. What makes you think a site should let you know immediately if they suspect somebody has hacked their software and are conducting investigations?
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    TheWaddyTheWaddy Member Posts: 1,592
    I think we established long ago how naive you are, no need to repeat.

    Everytime something comes up in fines or something new such as this, where sites have swore blind its not possible..... you are the first there to back them.

    Very, very odd.


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    TheEdge949TheEdge949 Member Posts: 5,295
    TheWaddy said:

    I think we established long ago how naive you are, no need to repeat.

    Everytime something comes up in fines or something new such as this, where sites have swore blind its not possible..... you are the first there to back them.

    Very, very odd.


    ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
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    rancidrancid Member Posts: 5,940
    Everything can be hacked if it’s vulnerable!!!



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    green_beergreen_beer Member Posts: 1,789
    Has it impacted on gg’s traffic? Or does nobody care?

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    TheWaddyTheWaddy Member Posts: 1,592
    If bean81 plays there, he will be actively using their forum to allay any fears about it!

    They wont be losing his business thats for sure..... :D:D:D
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    Bean81Bean81 Member Posts: 535
    TheWaddy said:

    If bean81 plays there, he will be actively using their forum to allay any fears about it!

    They wont be losing his business thats for sure..... :D:D:D

    No, only a total idiot would play somewhere that can be hacked and known to be rife with bots. Ditto playing on a site where they think the RNG is manipulated
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