Good to hear traffic on the site is on the up. As for the tv channel. I dont have a sky subscription and rarely watch it. I do put on master cash on my pc tho. Thats a great show along with totp. Instead of repeats all the time, why cant you show continuous cash games from tv marked tables, in realtime, with slight delay of course. You wont need any presenters or analysts , just show it. Far more interesting thaan repeats imo. I know its been mentioned before, but it would be great if you could have like a live sit n go that ppl qualified for online. Hole cams and everything. Thats a couple of shows worth... Posted by OMahonyO
Thanks for that suggestion, echoed by several others. I'll pass it upstairs for their reaction, & let you know what they say.
Personally, I cannot think of anything less appealing, (except, perhaps, Davina), but the fact that several people mentioned it suggests I'm out of step with most. Notrhing new there, then.
If you're taking a dimension away from the cards please don't go adding it to the presenters, I don't want Orford climbing out of the screen onto my lounge carpet "The Grudge" style. On second thought if Lisa-Marie... no, never mind. But seriously, my main issue with 2D over 3D is that the hand analysis seems terribly clinical and loses all entertainment factor. There really is a huge perceived difference to me between seeing someone analyzing the hands and hearing someone talk about a hand. I have tried to watch many instructional poker videos and it's hard enough to keep focussed for 30 minutes, let alone hours. I'm sure the presenters and analysts will bring their own unique style to this "cut to table" analysis. I guess time will tell if it goes down well with the viewers. Posted by Machka
You may well be right, Aaron, we shall see in due course.
It was interesting to note that on last night's Show thread, it was Posted that there are actually some positives on the way the 2D action panned out - more hands were shown, & more analysis. For both sides of the debate, there needs to be some reflection & re-appraisal, & in a week or two, everyone will have a better feel for it, & it's relative merits.
It's like a new hair-do - it takes some time to get used to.
Hi Tony, As i have said on other threads, I thought the Dealers Choice was a good programme and i think it does warrant a place in the schedule. If your base is moving north, will the current rota of presenters and analysts(how are great btw), still going to be on our screens, or have i jumped the gun again? col Posted by mr_mbro
Hi Col,
No, we are moving a mere 5 miles east, to "Big Sky" in Osterley, from Feltham, which is on the fringes of Heathrow Airport.
What was nice last night was that there more hands shown as was stated and although I can see why people prefer the 3D option, imo the set up was great and how nice it would be if all presenters/analysts were to play the competition as is the set up now (as ed did last night) and for some of their hands to be shown so that their words can be seen in action as well.
The desk thing may hide LML's cutticles so to speak but it does give the OAP an opportunity to sit down rather than collapse
Hasn't bskyb just announced huge, and record, profits? Surely they can afford to keep the current studio if it is such a valuable resource to their sky gaming subsidiary. Somebody needs to have a chat with James Murdoch lol. Posted by BrownnDog
Hi Lewis,
Yeah, I'll have a word in his ear......
SkyBet, which own Sky Poker, is a standalone subsidiary of BSKYB. As such, like all Group Companies, it optimises resources across it's broad portfolio.
Currently, Channel 865 lease a studio in a Studio Suite shared with Eurosport & others, 6 studios, & each TV Company has it's "own" Studio in the suite. The studio move will be to a Studio in the "Big Sky" Studio complex at Osterley, which obviously makes more sense, & optimises use of Group resources. It will bring with it both advantages & disadvantages. We plan to work hard to make it successful.
Tikay, Claire,Mandy & the suits, As business executives learn, sooner or later, people don't like radical change, so last Sunday at 8.00pm when we all got ready to put our feet into our "comfortable warm and nice old pair of slippers " AKA SKY865 Primo Live; the shock of not been greeted by our old friends in their familiar 3D surroundings, not seeing live hands, and being fed unrecognisable features and chat, was too much to take in one go; resulting in the torrent of comments. The beauty of this community is the fact that we can give both bad & good comments, because we've become friends with Sky Poker and each other over the past few years; it's only in this sort of environment you would feel happy & relaxed enough to be truthful in what you post. It's good to know you (and hopefully the suits) have recognised the issues and the mostly constructive comments you've had will be played into what 'you' do next. You do so many things right, and I'm sure you will in the future, and if not there will be three or four hundred people happy to tell you what they think. Tony, Max Clifford will be proud of your opening comments, let's hope the suits don't let you down. Cheers Dave Posted by kidgrimsby
Thank you Dave.
It's not, imo, so much that "people don't like radical change", it's more question of two things.....
1) "Radical change" is fine. Take any model of motor Car - a 3 series BMW, Golf, Mondeo, & after a few years, we grow comfy with the look, feel, design. When the "new" Model is introduced, nobody likes it at first, as it takes time to adjust to the difference.
2) Communication is the key to this. We failed - totally - to communicate the change. There were a number of reasons for this, & there is no finger-pointing at this end. As a Team, we failed to communicate a radical change. That was wrong, wrong, wrong, & whilst it's possible to throw up excuses & caveats, the fact is, we shot ourselves in the foot by failing to communicate. It's not a hanging offence, we've made well over a thousand Shows here, & largely speaking, been OK with communication. We got that single thing wrong though, & that's all there is to it, & we regret that.
There will always be change, though, there has to be change, or we would all be driving model T Ford Motor Cars, & using Wilkinson Sword wet razors (mainly the men).
But over & above everything, & in all things, to gain acceptance of any idea or notion, communication - or lack of it - is key.
There are no excuses from this end, & we have never tried to make any.
Would it be possible to have a show dedicated to "niche" poker games ? I'm thinking for instance of the following:
- Omaha
- Omaha Hi-Lo
- Heads Up
- ...
Those are very different games to what standard Texas Hold'em is and most players are worried about them. Having a show explaining how they work and anaylising hands and gameplay would do wonder to get new players trying them.
Just 30 minutes weekly focusing on one type a game could help a lot.
How far is Osterley from the old Hoover Factory? Surely worth a visit for its splendour if not too far, although sadly now a Tesco store. Posted by SoLack
Hi Solly,
I know & admire the classically art-deco Hoover Building on the Western Avenue (A40) very well indeed, as well as the "Vanguard" building some 3 miles west. The new Studio is some 10 miles from there, probably our current Studio is about the same distance.
But it is rather spooky that you should mention this. As students of the genre would know, the Great West Road from Chiswick Roundabout, in a westerly direction, is pretty much the epicentre of British art-deco buildings, with Beechams (as was, now SKB), Lincoln Motors, & most of all, Gillette, & Gillette Corner. "BIG SKY" at Osterly is in fact on the Great West Road, & right in the midst of all that splendid architecture. So I'll be able to bring you lots of photos of those lovely buildings, too.
Equally irrelevant, I'm sure, but Attila & myself started prepping for this move some 3 to 4 months ago, since when, she & I have worked from Big Sky in Osterley every Monday.
Thanks for the information Tikay - great news that Sky Poker is continuing to grow and flourish. I think the main gripe for a lot of the 'original' players is that the TV channel has changed so much over the years. I understand what you say about 'not standing still' but from a daily regular tournament being shown on the TV at the start to now only Thursdays and Sundays to watch a tournament it does not have the same appeal. Add into the equation that Thursday's are generally Bounty Hunters which for all the good will in the world does not promote some of the finer qualities of poker (ie making a decent laydown and getting a better spot rather than shoving all in in the hope of gaining a bounty) it does look disappointing! Online as well, the emphasis for tournies tends to be bounty hunters, rebuys and satelittes - all of which are limiting the choice for those players with a little larger bankroll who want a decent tournament with a decentish prize (something a little larger to ToT). I know that these will need players to play in, but how are they going to be attracted to play on the site with less TV emphasis on these type of tournaments? ABSOLUTELY ALL of the presenting team are great and I hope they will not fall by the wayside anytime soon and that the on screen chemistry is not lost with the new formats. I remember being a guest in the studio a couple of years ago and watching in awe at how the 3D images differ so greatly from the studio to on the screen. It gave Sky Poker that 'extra something' to other online poker TV shows (including the old PNL which I used to watch avidly before). I have been, and will continue to be, a Sky Poker regular - both on the tables and on the forum - and only want to see it succeed. I just hope that the balance can be maintained online and on TV to keep attracting and retaining new and existing customers. Phil Posted by phil12uk
Thanks Phil.
You have mentioned two entirely different matters there - the Shows, & the type of Tournaments that Sky Poker offer. They are unrelated, & if you don't mind, I think we need to keep this thread to Channel 865 stuff. Feel free to start a new Thread on Sky Poker's Tourney fayre, as you know, I have pretty strong views on that myself, too, which I'm happy - keen in fact - to discuss & air.
The channel has changed so much? Well yes, it has, & so has the market in which Sky Poker operate.
I think if they could have their time again, they'd have started the whole thing off in a different manner. It began as 7 nights a week of Live programming, which, with hindsight, was bizarre. Better, surely (with hindsight....) to have started as 1 night per week, & built up from there.
It costs a breathtaking amount of money - enough to make your eyes water - to produce Live TV for a single night. Multiply that by 7 nights per week, multiply that by 52 weeks per year, & it starts to get to eye-watering numbers.
Each year, Marketing - who, in essence, fund it from their budget - try to find different & better way to optimise their spend. I'm not going to list all their Promotions, but as a basket, or package, there are a lot of different demands on the Promo Budget, & the "spend per player" is a high as any. Did you know, by the bye, that a whole lot of Sky Poker players NEVER watch the Channel? Or want more Freerolls, or bigger or better this that & the other? It's not easy to be all things to all men.
Meanwhile, the Online Poker market has entered a severely competitive phase. You will have seen the results of all the European facing sites recently - all of them down big percentages year on year. Sky Poker's traffic remains vigorously UP year on year, and intends to remain that way, by listening to it's players & trying to serve them well.
But it HAS to change, innovate, experiment, to keep that graph going the right way. And communicate.
Ok, my first post on this whole topic (what a week to take a holiday). I watched the repeat last night of 'Dealers Choice.' I've got to say I enjoyed the show thoroughly. Obviously this was in a more 'magazine' format but it appealed to me. I can totally understand those who have stated they preferred the Primo show, this is all down to personal preferences (or Players Choice, geddit!). 2D v 3D I'm going to stick my bottom on the chopping block, I prefer the 2D format. I love the interaction between presenter and analyst, I find this thoroughly entertaining. However on occasion I can get a little miffed when this 'crashes' into the hand and before we know it the clickers gone half-way or all the way through the hand without the play being examined at all. DP and Tikay worked the balance perfectly in Dealers Choice IMO, very good interaction and your usual tangents between the hands but having it as a 2D screen focused everyone on the hand in play when it started and helped deliver detailed and interesting analysis. The 2D also makes me think back to the 'Poker Night Live' days on another place which I still look back on fondly. Change Change happens. The Roman Empire lived by the motto 'expand or die.' Sheryl Crow said 'A Change will do you good.' All of our favourite shows will develop and change over time. This has to happen before shows go stale and stagnant. However what we are very lucky enough to have here is a site and 'powers that be' who I genuinely believe listen to our feedback and care about our opinions. If you want to try and find another pokersite that will do anything close to this please do, but I've been around a long time and kicked the cards over in most virtual gin joints, I've never found one. We should be constructive, give our opinions in a professional and respectful way. Our voices are being heard. So back to the tables, see you at the felt all. Peace. Posted by TommyD
Sigh, there's always an argumentative one. Usually a schoolteacher, too.
I was watching last nights show and really missed the usual standing interaction between presenters & analysts...I know that more hand were shown but to be fair Giddo usually cruises through hands anyway!!! I'd like the 2D for basic tourneys like ploppypoker show but i think you've lost something quite special by losing the green room!
I know that there is nothing we can do at the moment but in time and increasing skypoker take up I would hope that a green room can be installed into the new set at some point.
One question though, Rich mentioned on the show that the download is DEFO on it's way...is the plan to have the download client in 3D like some other sites with talk overs? Ths would indeed negate the use of a green room...
x
p.s. unrelated I know but.....can you chase up my question on the ask tk thread..pretty please??
Ok, my first post on this whole topic (what a week to take a holiday). I watched the repeat last night of 'Dealers Choice.' I've got to say I enjoyed the show thoroughly. Obviously this was in a more 'magazine' format but it appealed to me. I can totally understand those who have stated they preferred the Primo show, this is all down to personal preferences (or Players Choice, geddit!). 2D v 3D I'm going to stick my bottom on the chopping block, I prefer the 2D format. I love the interaction between presenter and analyst, I find this thoroughly entertaining. However on occasion I can get a little miffed when this 'crashes' into the hand and before we know it the clickers gone half-way or all the way through the hand without the play being examined at all. DP and Tikay worked the balance perfectly in Dealers Choice IMO, very good interaction and your usual tangents between the hands but having it as a 2D screen focused everyone on the hand in play when it started and helped deliver detailed and interesting analysis. The 2D also makes me think back to the 'Poker Night Live' days on another place which I still look back on fondly. Change Change happens. The Roman Empire lived by the motto 'expand or die.' Sheryl Crow said 'A Change will do you good.' All of our favourite shows will develop and change over time. This has to happen before shows go stale and stagnant. However what we are very lucky enough to have here is a site and 'powers that be' who I genuinely believe listen to our feedback and care about our opinions. If you want to try and find another pokersite that will do anything close to this please do, but I've been around a long time and kicked the cards over in most virtual gin joints, I've never found one. We should be constructive, give our opinions in a professional and respectful way. Our voices are being heard. So back to the tables, see you at the felt all. Peace. Posted by TommyD
In a formulaic Show, that has remained pretty much "as was" for over 1,000 Shows, it has more reason than most to try & freshen things up. At one time, the world & his wife all watched Davina, & Big Brother. Audience ratings of BB are now a fraction of what they were.
Peace to you, too, Tommy.
PS - How COULD you call me with that 4 high flush? Outrageous.
Everything must evolve - including 865 - so GL with the changes. (OK - that's not quite true. It's clear from our photo's that neither TK nor myself have changed much in the last 230,000,000 years - but everything else must evolve!) On a serious note - I had a real problem with the 2D display on Sunday and would like to offer some solutions. The problem is that both the names nd the bet amounts are displayed smaller than they used to be in the "3D" display and I simply could not read them so could not follow the programme. It's not that I need new glasses; it's because I have to sit farther back from the TV if I'm also playing ... in order to make room for a couple of poker screens. I tried watching it on-line but again the text is much less readable than the old 3D format because the player frame is not adjustable. Solutions: 1. The easiest solution is simply to zoom in further so that the action fills the whole screen rather than be surrounded by a large dead area of blue. No tech time required. 2. Better would be to transmit with a larger font for names and bets. There is plenty of room because we don't really need these ***** avatars - which is why you ditched them last year in the 3D display. This should take only a few tech hours - mainly for testing before release. 3. For watching on-line, please use a user-adjustable frame your player. (Indeed, this would also be great for your tables though I guess that would need to wait for the download version!!!) This option woul probably require a few days of tech time. 4. Obviously, in the long term it would be great to return to the 3D display because this really added interest to the programming, as it would to any new programmes which might emerge. Please do something as on Sunday I actually stopped playing in order to watch the show - not an optimal solution!!!! Posted by metaraptor
Thanks Mr Raptor.
Fascinating alias - raptors are awesome birds, though quite what a "metaraptor" is I don't know.
You make some excellent points there, which may or may not be do-able. I'm not sufficiently versed in the technicals to know the answers to most of the questions you pose, so I'll pass that one upstairs, & let you know how they respond.
My views on this: The 2d/3d doesn't bother me when it comes to graphics, but I think a lot will be lost with the presenter/analyst 'in hand' reactions to how the hand was player/miracle rivers etc. I think that we need more TV time to in-play tournies. The Primo is the best show of the week IMO. I am mainly a cash player and like Master Cash a lot, but you do see the same players week in week out just hogging the TV time meaning that the 'casual' player who is channel hopping at 9.15 has little chance to be featured. In a 500 runner MTT Mr Joe Bloggs has just as much chance of being on the air as anyone else. TK you go on about the USP. One of the major reasons why the site has grown was that it had a very simple and easy to remember selling point. 9pm....big guaranteee tournie...with live in play TV coverage. While I understand that it is not financially viable to do this 7/days a week but I think that Friday night should definatly be added to the live TV format. If you are advertising the Primo, show just the Primo. Don't dip out of it for an hour to show a 500 BH. Less of the brainless ad breaks. Who cares about a load of poker journos talking about Chris Ferguson when its been repeated 50 times/week for 2 years. And update the infomercials which go on about tournies that you no longer offer. Having TK, who loves a super deep stack slow structure and advertises them on the forum/facebook/the tv channel on a daily basis, 'advertise' a RUSSIAN ROULETTE is frankly embassing. Put that VT in the recylce bin now More James Hartigan in analyst duties. As the action is now 2d some Omaha action. EDIT YES THAT IS AWFUL SPELLING but i aint going thru it again soyou'll just have to deal with it merenovice Posted by scotty77
Thanks Ryan,
It's no surprise to me that you make some excellent points there.
Is Omaha now showable, in 2D? It'd be pretty neat if it were, how good would THAT be? I was so revved up by that question that I sent it upstairs in the middle o the night, as I agreed with you 100%. It appears the issue of showing Omaha is now not so much a studio issue, as a gallery matter. (The Gallery is where the Producer, Director, Vision Mixer, Graphics Peep, Technical Blokey-Wokey, Hand-Pickers, Sound Crew etc all sit).
The hands are sent down from the Head Office Server about 2 minutes afer being played out (they cannot come down in real-time for obvious reasons), & they arrive in the form of an on-screen animated Hand History, street by street. They are viewed, in the gallery, on a "Console" from which the Hand-Picker has the task of finding "interesting" hands from the thousands played. And it is this "console" which is the key bit of kit, & would need some serious tinkerage to adapt to the 4 card game. But Attila is on that case, & is reviewing the financial & practical impediments to showing Omaha in the near future. If - IF - it happens, it will be after we move studios.
Showing Friday night Tourneys, & by implication, returning to 4 days of Live Shows? There's nothing I'd love more. In fact, I presented a "How Can We Do Better?" document to the Suits this week, in which I said that we plan to give the Head Office Boys a big problem next year - by making the Show so good, & driving so much extra traffic via the Show, that they'd be "forced" to think about returning to 4, 5, 6 or even 7 days per week. So, we'll have to see. Or not.
"If you are advertising Primo, JUST show Primo, don't duck in & out of it". Could not agree more (personally), but it's a case of trying to please as many players & viewers as possible. I get more complaints about that subject than anything else, & I wholly sympathise, as it really does spoil the flow. But you & me are not everyone, & not everyone thinks alike. To "come off" the Monthly "BIGGIE" & show a half-hour from the £500 Gtd can, from some angles, seem annoying & stupid, but it depends if you are playing the £500 or not.....! Really, the Producers try to squeeze in as much varied Content as possible, & who can blame them for that?
Showing me, a deep-stack lover, advertising/promoting "Russian Roulette" is mad? Not really. I would never play that game in a month of Sundays, I'd rather watch Davina (well maybe not), but that misses the point completely. MANY players HATE deepstacks, & WANT to play Russian Roulette. I went to the house of a Sky Poker playing family recently, & it was a real eye-opener. The Lady of the House insisted on a Tourney that lasted a MAXIMUM of 30 minutes. So she could watch Corrie & play the Tourney at the same time. My gob had never been so smacked, but that's the real world - we are all different, & I see & have no issues with acknowledging & addressing that.
Primo is the best Show of the week? You bet. It's back this Sunday. To stay, I hope.
Take care now Ryan, see you soon I hope. You coming to the Nottingham Grand Final? The cash games will be awesome.....
This is what I posted on another threat, however, after reading Tikays thoughts on not standing still I hope improoved wrong. I agree with most of the posts on here, the only reason I joined Sky Poker over any other site was because of the live tournaments shown on TV, and in particualr the 3D studio set up. This is one of the big reasons for watching and joining Sky Poker in the first place. I also enjoy the presenting of Rich Orford and Tikey together (great chemistry) and also LML with anyone. I think Sky are lucky to have her, she is a great presenter and is not just a pretty face, she knows her stuff too, as well as being ammusing with her on screen banter. In my opinion to lose lots of live tournaments in favour of re runs and repeats, and to lose the unique 3D imaging and how that works with the presenters will be a huge step back for Sky. I understand that the cost might be high for the 3D studio, but how many people will not sign up or even leave Sky Poker because it will just become one of many similar Poker formats. Keep things the way they are, 3D screen, on screen presenter chemistry and the live tournaments are what sets Sky Poker apart from the rest. Posted by cobbler78
Thanks Cobbler.
When you refer to a non3d studio being the same as "many similar poker formats", who are they, please? I'm not aware of "many" Online Rooms that even cover their own Online Tourneys on Live TV.
I know we all want 24/7 free poker on telly, but it really is a huge ask, which is why it is such a rare thing for an Online Poker Room to offer.
We'd love to offer 7 Live Shows per week, & 24/7 "fresh" content, but I have to be honest, it's just not that easy to do in the real world. We are trying though.....
greetings and salutations. Well written and explained Tikay. Thank you. i do have my own view and hopefully i can put this foreward almost as well as yourself (or not). The'Dealers choice' show was ok as a magazine type show,but in my opinion should never replace one of the few live tournament shows; we see too little of those anyway! If Sky were to add this to another night, even as a replacement for the Club, i believe it would be a very good and welcome addition. Personaly, i much prefer the 3D version to the 2D - this may be because it is all i have seen, Imo the fact that we can see not only the cards but the presenters/analysts reactions make for a vastly more enjoyable show, than just having a voice over to a screen that doesn't show anywhere enough detail. As others have said it was the 3Dversion that originaly drew me to the show and is what seperates a 'good' show into a 'brilliant' show. There can be no argument that the presenters and analysts are anything other than brilliant (even that Orford chap)!! It would be nice if we could see them more often in a live environment and maybe that will happen in the future; i hope so anyway. I quite agree that the breaks are getting a 'touch' tedious....well OK seriously tedious!! A change would do wonders for the sanity of the viewers! Many thanks Laurie (lozgo) Posted by lozgo
Thanks Lozzy.
I agree about Orford. Hopeless, helpless & hapless.
Nice to see more of them in a Live environment? Watch this space, then. I did mention earlier that there are a few surprises in store, down the line, did I not?
MANY players HATE deepstacks, & WANT to play Russian Roulette. I went to the house of a Sky Poker playing family recently, & it was a real eye-opener. The Lady of the House insisted on a Tourney that lasted a MAXIMUM of 30 minutes. So she could watch Corrie & play the Tourney at the same time.
Are those people watching channel 865 ? If she is watching Coronation Street, she is not watching Sky Poker channel...
Can someone enjoy "playing" (I'm adding the quote signs to please purists) Roulette, and at the same time enjoy listening to 3 hours of analysis from the Primo ? I'm not sure ...
Tikay, do you know who the viewers are and what they want ? I'm not talking about who shouts the most but who watches ?
Are Lisa Marie and Sarah going to be hidden behind a desk ? what a shame. Obviously for Tikay the taller the desk and shorter the chair the better. Posted by -Dino66-
Hi Tikay, I think you forgot one of the most important USP for Sky Poker: you communicate with us. And that is a two-way communication: you tell us what you plan or what you are doing and you listen to feedback. It is a big sign of respect towards us and a good enough reason for me to stay here. Regards, Max Posted by lastpoet22
Thanks Max.
We usually communicate well, is perhaps more accurate. But thank you. We certainly respect everyone.
Years ago, many yars ago - in 1962 in fact - Hertz Rent-a-Car had some 90% of the world market in hire cars. Then along came an upstart called Avis, & they had a great advertising line. "We try harder". With "because we are 2nd" as a clincher. And that's the thing.
Pardon my diversion here, but Avis Car Rental is a right stonker of a story, in so many ways. It began in the Internationally famous "Willow Run Airport" in Ypsilanti (where else?), by a chap named Warren Avis. These days, it's Corporate HQ is in a place called......Parsippany-troy. Eh?
It was the first fleet operator ever to introduce a tracking system to it's cars. They called it, with great wit, "Advanced Vehicle Identification System". Or, "AVIS" for short!
Which is nearly as clever as the famous page ranking system that google use. Which many claim (erroneously, imo), to have been designed by one of the two founders of google. That'd be Mr Page.
Hi Tikay, Many thanks for taking the time to write the blog, which is very informative. I like the sound of the final table action from the main events early in the week being shown. I think this will encourage people to play. Sure, it's not quite the same as having the live tv show, but at least they won't be forgotten, which has perhaps happened over the last couple of months (I know you used to name check the nightly ME winners on a weekend show, but hasn't happened recently I don't think). I am also quite enjoying the 2D hand reviews, which I didn't think would be the case to be honest, as I thought some of the interraction may be lost, but as TommyD comments higher up, the reviews seem now to be more card/hand focussed, and it won't be as easy for transgressions to effectively allow occasional hands to be played out in their entirety without any feedback. That isn't to say that the banter isn't great entertainment, but perhaps in 2D it will occur between the hands more and not over the top of them. If I had one small gripe in the past, it would be to finally see one of your hands from an MTT appear on TV, but the hand may almost have played out before the presenter/analyst banter from the previous hand had finished. Kepp up the excellent work Sky! Posted by darich
Thanks Rich. That may in fact be a idea!
To be fair, to expect a Presenter or Analyst to play the Tourney (in itself, quite possible given that they are at a Desk, with an attached Laptop module if necessary), and at the same time....
1) LOOK at the (correct) camera - a must must.
2) Take talkback instructions down their earpiece from Producer & Director in the Gallery.
3) Concentrate on addressing the viewing audience, & be respectful by not ignoring them a la "ooh, can't talk now, I have Aces" or "I'm in the Big Blind, can't talk now" would be a tall order.
The Presenters (more than the Analystys) have a very tough job on, & do a brill job to look & sound natural. Adding to their brief "Play the Tournament, & don't put a foot wrong, because you'll be called out big time if you do" is maybe a step too far.
Comments
Personally, I cannot think of anything less appealing, (except, perhaps, Davina), but the fact that several people mentioned it suggests I'm out of step with most. Notrhing new there, then.
It was interesting to note that on last night's Show thread, it was Posted that there are actually some positives on the way the 2D action panned out - more hands were shown, & more analysis. For both sides of the debate, there needs to be some reflection & re-appraisal, & in a week or two, everyone will have a better feel for it, & it's relative merits.
It's like a new hair-do - it takes some time to get used to.
No, we are moving a mere 5 miles east, to "Big Sky" in Osterley, from Feltham, which is on the fringes of Heathrow Airport.
What was nice last night was that there more hands shown as was stated and although I can see why people prefer the 3D option, imo the set up was great and how nice it would be if all presenters/analysts were to play the competition as is the set up now (as ed did last night) and for some of their hands to be shown so that their words can be seen in action as well.
The desk thing may hide LML's cutticles so to speak but it does give the OAP an opportunity to sit down rather than collapse
Yeah, I'll have a word in his ear......
SkyBet, which own Sky Poker, is a standalone subsidiary of BSKYB. As such, like all Group Companies, it optimises resources across it's broad portfolio.
Currently, Channel 865 lease a studio in a Studio Suite shared with Eurosport & others, 6 studios, & each TV Company has it's "own" Studio in the suite. The studio move will be to a Studio in the "Big Sky" Studio complex at Osterley, which obviously makes more sense, & optimises use of Group resources. It will bring with it both advantages & disadvantages. We plan to work hard to make it successful.
It's not, imo, so much that "people don't like radical change", it's more question of two things.....
1) "Radical change" is fine. Take any model of motor Car - a 3 series BMW, Golf, Mondeo, & after a few years, we grow comfy with the look, feel, design. When the "new" Model is introduced, nobody likes it at first, as it takes time to adjust to the difference.
2) Communication is the key to this. We failed - totally - to communicate the change. There were a number of reasons for this, & there is no finger-pointing at this end. As a Team, we failed to communicate a radical change. That was wrong, wrong, wrong, & whilst it's possible to throw up excuses & caveats, the fact is, we shot ourselves in the foot by failing to communicate. It's not a hanging offence, we've made well over a thousand Shows here, & largely speaking, been OK with communication. We got that single thing wrong though, & that's all there is to it, & we regret that.
There will always be change, though, there has to be change, or we would all be driving model T Ford Motor Cars, & using Wilkinson Sword wet razors (mainly the men).
But over & above everything, & in all things, to gain acceptance of any idea or notion, communication - or lack of it - is key.
There are no excuses from this end, & we have never tried to make any.
I know & admire the classically art-deco Hoover Building on the Western Avenue (A40) very well indeed, as well as the "Vanguard" building some 3 miles west. The new Studio is some 10 miles from there, probably our current Studio is about the same distance.
But it is rather spooky that you should mention this. As students of the genre would know, the Great West Road from Chiswick Roundabout, in a westerly direction, is pretty much the epicentre of British art-deco buildings, with Beechams (as was, now SKB), Lincoln Motors, & most of all, Gillette, & Gillette Corner. "BIG SKY" at Osterly is in fact on the Great West Road, & right in the midst of all that splendid architecture. So I'll be able to bring you lots of photos of those lovely buildings, too.
Equally irrelevant, I'm sure, but Attila & myself started prepping for this move some 3 to 4 months ago, since when, she & I have worked from Big Sky in Osterley every Monday.
You have mentioned two entirely different matters there - the Shows, & the type of Tournaments that Sky Poker offer. They are unrelated, & if you don't mind, I think we need to keep this thread to Channel 865 stuff. Feel free to start a new Thread on Sky Poker's Tourney fayre, as you know, I have pretty strong views on that myself, too, which I'm happy - keen in fact - to discuss & air.
The channel has changed so much? Well yes, it has, & so has the market in which Sky Poker operate.
I think if they could have their time again, they'd have started the whole thing off in a different manner. It began as 7 nights a week of Live programming, which, with hindsight, was bizarre. Better, surely (with hindsight....) to have started as 1 night per week, & built up from there.
It costs a breathtaking amount of money - enough to make your eyes water - to produce Live TV for a single night. Multiply that by 7 nights per week, multiply that by 52 weeks per year, & it starts to get to eye-watering numbers.
Each year, Marketing - who, in essence, fund it from their budget - try to find different & better way to optimise their spend. I'm not going to list all their Promotions, but as a basket, or package, there are a lot of different demands on the Promo Budget, & the "spend per player" is a high as any. Did you know, by the bye, that a whole lot of Sky Poker players NEVER watch the Channel? Or want more Freerolls, or bigger or better this that & the other? It's not easy to be all things to all men.
Meanwhile, the Online Poker market has entered a severely competitive phase. You will have seen the results of all the European facing sites recently - all of them down big percentages year on year. Sky Poker's traffic remains vigorously UP year on year, and intends to remain that way, by listening to it's players & trying to serve them well.
But it HAS to change, innovate, experiment, to keep that graph going the right way. And communicate.
I was watching last nights show and really missed the usual standing interaction between presenters & analysts...I know that more hand were shown but to be fair Giddo usually cruises through hands anyway!!! I'd like the 2D for basic tourneys like ploppypoker show but i think you've lost something quite special by losing the green room!
I know that there is nothing we can do at the moment but in time and increasing skypoker take up I would hope that a green room can be installed into the new set at some point.
One question though, Rich mentioned on the show that the download is DEFO on it's way...is the plan to have the download client in 3D like some other sites with talk overs? Ths would indeed negate the use of a green room...
x
p.s. unrelated I know but.....can you chase up my question on the ask tk thread..pretty please??
Peace to you, too, Tommy.
PS - How COULD you call me with that 4 high flush? Outrageous.
Fascinating alias - raptors are awesome birds, though quite what a "metaraptor" is I don't know.
You make some excellent points there, which may or may not be do-able. I'm not sufficiently versed in the technicals to know the answers to most of the questions you pose, so I'll pass that one upstairs, & let you know how they respond.
It's no surprise to me that you make some excellent points there.
Is Omaha now showable, in 2D? It'd be pretty neat if it were, how good would THAT be? I was so revved up by that question that I sent it upstairs in the middle o the night, as I agreed with you 100%. It appears the issue of showing Omaha is now not so much a studio issue, as a gallery matter. (The Gallery is where the Producer, Director, Vision Mixer, Graphics Peep, Technical Blokey-Wokey, Hand-Pickers, Sound Crew etc all sit).
The hands are sent down from the Head Office Server about 2 minutes afer being played out (they cannot come down in real-time for obvious reasons), & they arrive in the form of an on-screen animated Hand History, street by street. They are viewed, in the gallery, on a "Console" from which the Hand-Picker has the task of finding "interesting" hands from the thousands played. And it is this "console" which is the key bit of kit, & would need some serious tinkerage to adapt to the 4 card game. But Attila is on that case, & is reviewing the financial & practical impediments to showing Omaha in the near future. If - IF - it happens, it will be after we move studios.
Showing Friday night Tourneys, & by implication, returning to 4 days of Live Shows? There's nothing I'd love more. In fact, I presented a "How Can We Do Better?" document to the Suits this week, in which I said that we plan to give the Head Office Boys a big problem next year - by making the Show so good, & driving so much extra traffic via the Show, that they'd be "forced" to think about returning to 4, 5, 6 or even 7 days per week. So, we'll have to see. Or not.
"If you are advertising Primo, JUST show Primo, don't duck in & out of it". Could not agree more (personally), but it's a case of trying to please as many players & viewers as possible. I get more complaints about that subject than anything else, & I wholly sympathise, as it really does spoil the flow. But you & me are not everyone, & not everyone thinks alike. To "come off" the Monthly "BIGGIE" & show a half-hour from the £500 Gtd can, from some angles, seem annoying & stupid, but it depends if you are playing the £500 or not.....! Really, the Producers try to squeeze in as much varied Content as possible, & who can blame them for that?
Showing me, a deep-stack lover, advertising/promoting "Russian Roulette" is mad? Not really. I would never play that game in a month of Sundays, I'd rather watch Davina (well maybe not), but that misses the point completely. MANY players HATE deepstacks, & WANT to play Russian Roulette. I went to the house of a Sky Poker playing family recently, & it was a real eye-opener. The Lady of the House insisted on a Tourney that lasted a MAXIMUM of 30 minutes. So she could watch Corrie & play the Tourney at the same time. My gob had never been so smacked, but that's the real world - we are all different, & I see & have no issues with acknowledging & addressing that.
Primo is the best Show of the week? You bet. It's back this Sunday. To stay, I hope.
Take care now Ryan, see you soon I hope. You coming to the Nottingham Grand Final? The cash games will be awesome.....
When you refer to a non3d studio being the same as "many similar poker formats", who are they, please? I'm not aware of "many" Online Rooms that even cover their own Online Tourneys on Live TV.
I know we all want 24/7 free poker on telly, but it really is a huge ask, which is why it is such a rare thing for an Online Poker Room to offer.
We'd love to offer 7 Live Shows per week, & 24/7 "fresh" content, but I have to be honest, it's just not that easy to do in the real world. We are trying though.....
Thanks Lozzy.
I agree about Orford. Hopeless, helpless & hapless.
Nice to see more of them in a Live environment? Watch this space, then. I did mention earlier that there are a few surprises in store, down the line, did I not?
We usually communicate well, is perhaps more accurate. But thank you. We certainly respect everyone.
Years ago, many yars ago - in 1962 in fact - Hertz Rent-a-Car had some 90% of the world market in hire cars. Then along came an upstart called Avis, & they had a great advertising line. "We try harder". With "because we are 2nd" as a clincher. And that's the thing.
Pardon my diversion here, but Avis Car Rental is a right stonker of a story, in so many ways. It began in the Internationally famous "Willow Run Airport" in Ypsilanti (where else?), by a chap named Warren Avis. These days, it's Corporate HQ is in a place called......Parsippany-troy. Eh?
It was the first fleet operator ever to introduce a tracking system to it's cars. They called it, with great wit, "Advanced Vehicle Identification System". Or, "AVIS" for short!
Which is nearly as clever as the famous page ranking system that google use. Which many claim (erroneously, imo), to have been designed by one of the two founders of google. That'd be Mr Page.
To be fair, to expect a Presenter or Analyst to play the Tourney (in itself, quite possible given that they are at a Desk, with an attached Laptop module if necessary), and at the same time....
1) LOOK at the (correct) camera - a must must.
2) Take talkback instructions down their earpiece from Producer & Director in the Gallery.
3) Concentrate on addressing the viewing audience, & be respectful by not ignoring them a la "ooh, can't talk now, I have Aces" or "I'm in the Big Blind, can't talk now" would be a tall order.
The Presenters (more than the Analystys) have a very tough job on, & do a brill job to look & sound natural. Adding to their brief "Play the Tournament, & don't put a foot wrong, because you'll be called out big time if you do" is maybe a step too far.