In Response to Re: Turning KK into a bluff : hes not bluffing. If he has Ax then it would be pretty bad to call a shove as im rarely bluffing, not out of the question though. Thinking about it, when he checked back flop and called turn i obviously assume hes pot controlling pp's or Ax/Jx. When he raises river i can rule out pp's so its more likely Ax. At the time i thought he could feel like hes underrepped his hand here and so would raise for value but fold to shove. thinking more about it im not sure he raises the river with Ax. Posted by offshoot
If he is pot controlling the flop/turn why has he done a u turn and raised the river and not just call, that story does not add up. He is surely only raising to either get more out of you as he knows he got you beat or to get you off your hand. Does not seem like he is raising to fold here, more like for value. Seems like he putting you on a Ax and he sitting there with a boat.
he should only raise Ax to get you to call Jx, idk whether you two have that agrro of a dynamic so you probably hav the best idea if the bluff is profitable or not
offshoot, could you post some reads as I assume you have some if you flat KK pre and think he is never bluffing on river
Also if you or beaneh could explain why you think flatting pf is good, because I think it would have to be a very specific type of opponent that I consider flatting KK against
I'm not sure how many Axs he can raise for value on river against you unless there is some weird dynamic between you. If hes not bluffing ever its a fold imo
his button range should be pretty wide he may tighten it up if hes getting played back at a lot, if hes folding to 3 bets then kk aa is fine to flat as he closes the action also i guess he can flat some raggy hands and rep strength on later streets??
he should only raise Ax to get you to call Jx, idk whether you two have that agrro of a dynamic so you probably hav the best idea if the bluff is profitable or not Posted by LOL_RAISE
Offshoot could raise/shove on river and turn his hand into a value bluff and get a crazy call from QQ or Jx :S It's just one crazy hand ) All read dependant, who's playing who Meta Value Town
yeah Im sure there are reasons to flat KK, folds lots to 3bets, barrells a lot, spews when c/r etc, but they require reads imo, I find it hard to see doing this against an unknown being the best line.
Comments
If he is pot controlling the flop/turn why has he done a u turn and raised the river and not just call, that story does not add up. He is surely only raising to either get more out of you as he knows he got you beat or to get you off your hand. Does not seem like he is raising to fold here, more like for value. Seems like he putting you on a Ax and he sitting there with a boat.
Love to know what the outcome was
lol - +1
offshoot, could you post some reads as I assume you have some if you flat KK pre and think he is never bluffing on river
Also if you or beaneh could explain why you think flatting pf is good, because I think it would have to be a very specific type of opponent that I consider flatting KK against
I'm not sure how many Axs he can raise for value on river against you unless there is some weird dynamic between you. If hes not bluffing ever its a fold imo
Offshoot could raise/shove on river and turn his hand into a value bluff and get a crazy call from QQ or Jx :S
It's just one crazy hand ) All read dependant, who's playing who