dude,i put in previous post i WAS NOT thinking about folding kks pre,my point was SHOULD i have thought about folding kings pre? big difference bud. Posted by pod1
In Response to Re: is there ever a time to fold kings pre! : you should really look at some of your own threads with AK which are pretty standard yet you dismiss others thats LOL Posted by YOUNG_GUN
I'd think getting it in pre with KK is a little more comfortable than AK.
In Response to Re: is there ever a time to fold kings pre! : I'd think getting it in pre with KK is a little more comfortable than AK. Posted by Dudeskin8
obviously but im talking about hands i have seen you post which are standard but i dont say, but may start as you seem to rub everyone else down for their standard hands no?
In Response to Re: is there ever a time to fold kings pre! : obviously but im talking about hands i have seen you post which are standard but i dont say, but may start as you seem to rub everyone else down for their standard hands no? Posted by YOUNG_GUN
I personally don't think they're amazingly standard especially against REGS who are min4betting me pre, yes I should just shove and get it in but often feel why do it when I know most I can hope for is being 42% against a guy who I have zero fold equity against and is unlikly to have AQ/AJ.
KK is 100% different as your only losing to 1 hand.
Also if you think a hand is standard please say why it standard, as that will help me learn, here I just don't see the point in explaining as it's quite obvious.
In Response to Re: is there ever a time to fold kings pre! : I personally don't think they're amazingly standard especially against REGS who are min4betting me pre, yes I should just shove and get it in but often feel why do it when I know most I can hope for is being 42% against a guy who I have zero fold equity against and is unlikly to have AQ/AJ. KK is 100% different as your only losing to 1 hand. Also if you think a hand is standard please say why it standard, as that will help me learn, here I just don't see the point in explaining as it's quite obvious. Posted by Dudeskin8
lol well this hand is standard obviously but im just pointing out that so are a few of yours, in future i will put standard then but its a pretty blunt way of putting it. its better if you put why aswell :P
In Response to Re: is there ever a time to fold kings pre! : lol well this hand is standard obviously but im just pointing out that so are a few of yours, in future i will put standard then but its a pretty blunt way of putting it. its better if you put why aswell :P Posted by YOUNG_GUN
Many hands probably are standard but I'm still learning all the time and hence I want to know if what I'm doing is 'standard' or completely wrong, if it's standard great if not I learn and get better.
In Response to Re: is there ever a time to fold kings pre! : Many hands probably are standard but I'm still learning all the time and hence I want to know if what I'm doing is 'standard' or completely wrong, if it's standard great if not I learn and get better. Posted by Dudeskin8
haha ok ill bare in mind and put standard, obviously i will explain why i think its standard too out of courtesy. We are all still learning and always will be
It was Paul Jackson on one of the shows a few months back that said something along the lines of, " It's ok to fold K-K pre as long as you are good enough to put your opponent on aces. " I think it was James Williams, the West Country assassin, that did it. There was a 3-way dynamic to that particular hand tho. I have done it a few times with people i have played a lot ( 10k + ) of hands with. I agree with AMYBR in that sometimes you just know that the betting pattern suggests one thing only.
wow,wasnt expecting this. like i say i wasnt going to fold,didnt even cross my mind, but and its a big but, if the guy has never 4bet all the time on the table and remember this is only nl30 not nl100 when people may do this light. the question was SHOULD IT HAVE CROSSED MY MIND? it screamed aces . was i shocked when he should them definatly not. i was always taught (by an mtt player mind) always get your money in ahead, and with this betting pattern at this level i couldnt say i was. ps black mass i was good enough to put him on aces , just not good enough to threw them ks away lol
the one thing im not getting, alot of players are saying that you really cant be folding kings in a cash game. If we have good enough reads to put the villain on AA then surely you have to dont ya. After all 77 has a better chance of beating aces but only a donk would call a shove or shove over the top.
i think what people are trying to say leon is that a good cash player wont always 4 bet with aces, qq kk ak at this level are well in there range to do this with, so over time you will lose money by folding, and i assume the higher the level the wider range of 4 betting becomes (look at dohhhs hand in the clinic at nl100). what i was trying to say was being on a table with this player for an hr and never see him do this should you even contemplate it. hope this helps leon
In a tournament early yes or if your huge in chips! In cash you would need very specific reads, however every single player who have commented on this when the player comes back over the top you all know he is holding aces here .. come on admit it. Queens he shoves AK he folds calls or shoves only hand raisng is AA, But yet everyone calls Posted by Batkin88
Really dont get how you know this. If he views pod as competent I dont see why he should 5bet small with any hand. I think maybe its more likely its AA, but he doesnt have to do it often with worse to make getting it in correct
Great bit of 'verbal tennis' between Young_Gun and Dudeskin8 (thnx guys) right back to the hand imo at any level between nl4 and nl100 i dont reckon any player in a 2 way pot folds KK pre when only 100 bb's or so deep , and i mean nobody. i just dont see how you can polarise a players hand to be AA and nowt else , no matter what reads ya may or may not have on them.
PS pod mate ive had this on many occasions at diff levels and really put oppo on AA but ive still never ever folded my KK xx
Comments
Even starting this thread is amazing lol.
obviously never fold kings pre <100bb in cash , doubt id fold it ever if im honest :P unless it was the nittiest nit of nitville then maybe
KK is 100% different as your only losing to 1 hand.
Also if you think a hand is standard please say why it standard, as that will help me learn, here I just don't see the point in explaining as it's quite obvious.
It was Paul Jackson on one of the shows a few months back that said something along the lines of, " It's ok to fold K-K pre as long as you are good enough to put your opponent on aces. "
I think it was James Williams, the West Country assassin, that did it. There was a 3-way dynamic to that particular hand tho. I have done it a few times with people i have played a lot ( 10k + ) of hands with.
I agree with AMYBR in that sometimes you just know that the betting pattern suggests one thing only.
PS pod mate ive had this on many occasions at diff levels and really put oppo on AA but ive still never ever folded my KK xx