Playing MTT's underrolled is the most soul-crushing route you can take in poker. The buyin was already too much, so that loss is painful, but also seeing the chunky top prizes which could be 100x your current roll beyond your grasp because you lose a standard flip on the cash bubble is pure devastation to your confidence. FORGET THEM. You are playing poker as if it's a casino table game. I'll risk too much, hoping it is my time to win big. I thought I had exceptional patience, until I saw how much time and effort JJ has devoted to you. You may think you're unlucky, but you're lucky to have someone as supportive as him on your side. I'm not saying anything more on the matter, lest I say something I regret. Posted by CoxyLboro
coxy im always open to suggestions. to have jj on side is a great help. Defo towards my game anyways, as Tikay says i probably do need help with mental things.
Although one thing you said here, im confused by you comment. Im guessing your referring to the UKIPT sat, of which i satt'd into for £3. Tbh UKIPTs i dw worry about too much. I like the social side of it with my dad and uncle, we rarley spend time together and a weekend away helps.
Although it comes straight after a comment rgarding a $2 mtt, which i can afford. Most tournys are top heavy i accept that. And nor do i ever worry about getting "lucky" waiting on my time to win, (Aimed at dudeskin) In honesty i started out playing tournys and ive always struggled to adapt o cash. Tournys are where im comfortable and where i see my future if i can ever get going. Tbh its either that or the towel because me and cash will not get on till i sort my mental health
Playing MTT's underrolled is the most soul-crushing route you can take in poker. The buyin was already too much, so that loss is painful, but also seeing the chunky top prizes which could be 100x your current roll beyond your grasp because you lose a standard flip on the cash bubble is pure devastation to your confidence. FORGET THEM. You are playing poker as if it's a casino table game. I'll risk too much, hoping it is my time to win big. I thought I had exceptional patience, until I saw how much time and effort JJ has devoted to you. You may think you're unlucky, but you're lucky to have someone as supportive as him on your side. I'm not saying anything more on the matter, lest I say something I regret. Posted by CoxyLboro
Massive +1 to this,the advice from chris,jj.scotty and probably others as got to be invaluable to you,you say your unlucky.
Seriously wish i had your luck mate.
Oh and by the way,you owned me when i ventured onto nl4 one very dark day sometime ago,you got the game .:)
In Response to Re: am i really this bad or am i just the unluckiest player ever, : and just read this mans blog to see what is possible with talent, hard work, luckboxing skillsand with a solid BRM strategy in place Posted by scotty77
If that’s how you feel Don and MTT suit you and that’s your game then why not try the £2-£5 mini on Sky, 300-400 runners –
Overall playing 1000+ fields is going to be tough to get through all them donks )
Still think a lower variance game such as cash will prove long term results + mix in some MTT’s and you can turn £80 into £800 in six months
If I can do it then I am sure you can.
I remember when I started with £80 and suffered some real downswings and mentally it was really tough. Building up to £220 then down to £110 was really a really hard month. Then I got it back to £300 and back down to £180.
At my lowest points mentally & emotionally I thought I would never be sitting where I am now with a overall BR over £1000.
During the course I had 3 MTT binks, which was a great bonus.
But I played MTT because I won at cash, so anything I won in MTT was a bonus and didn’t tilt me at all getting bad beats at crucial stages.
They were annoying but it wasn’t the end of the world, just go back win some at cash and play another one.
Not going to lie, it’s hard work – need to work on your game and be mentally tough enough to ride the variance/downswing.
And just be tough on yourself about your in game mistakes and correct them.
Winning is not easy, & is not meant to be, either. Some critical self-analysis is needed, & an ability to say "I got that one wrong", or "I need to stop making excuses, & play better".
"Back to basics" is the best & easiest route, & cash - in this instance - is best, Don is not at all suited - in my personal opinion, no offence intended - to the bruising variance of MTT's.
Even though I've only been playing Poker for a few months, the one thing I've learnt from the game is that it's very easy to say "I was unlucky", or "It's that idiot's fault for calling me". It's a million times harder to admit that you may actually be doing something wrong yourself.
"The problem has been the times when he has ran bad....Deep in mtts which would have huge positive bankroll implications, or on the bubble of sattys into big mtt's.Prob is they hurt more coz the money he stands to win can literally be life changing for him, n that's where he struggles to cope."
- DOHHHHHHH
If this is the case, then consider having really strict BRM, and being massively over-rolled for a level so that the beats don't hurt as much. Although you won't be winning "literally life changing" amounts of money in smaller tournaments, you won't be spending literally life changing amounts of money on vet bills and new laptops when your aces get beat and the cat goes flying down the stairs, or the laptop goes out the window
Even though I've only been playing Poker for a few months, the one thing I've learnt from the game is that it's very easy to say "I was unlucky", or "It's that idiot's fault for calling me". It's a million times harder to admit that you may actually be doing something wrong yourself. " The problem has been the times when he has ran bad.... Deep in mtts which would have huge positive bankroll implications, or on the bubble of sattys into big mtt's. Prob is they hurt more coz the money he stands to win can literally be life changing for him, n that's where he struggles to cope." - DOHHHHHHH If this is the case, then consider having really strict BRM, and being massively over-rolled for a level so that the beats don't hurt as much. Although you won't be winning "literally life changing" amounts of money in smaller tournaments, you won't be spending literally life changing amounts of money on vet bills and new laptops when your aces get beat and the cat goes flying down the stairs, or the laptop goes out the window Posted by EvilPingu
umm im playing $1-$3 tournys mate. $500+ to the winner usually.
Even though I've only been playing Poker for a few months, the one thing I've learnt from the game is that it's very easy to say "I was unlucky", or "It's that idiot's fault for calling me". It's a million times harder to admit that you may actually be doing something wrong yourself. " The problem has been the times when he has ran bad.... Deep in mtts which would have huge positive bankroll implications, or on the bubble of sattys into big mtt's. Prob is they hurt more coz the money he stands to win can literally be life changing for him, n that's where he struggles to cope." - DOHHHHHHH If this is the case, then consider having really strict BRM, and being massively over-rolled for a level so that the beats don't hurt as much. Although you won't be winning "literally life changing" amounts of money in smaller tournaments, you won't be spending literally life changing amounts of money on vet bills and new laptops when your aces get beat and the cat goes flying down the stairs, or the laptop goes out the window Posted by EvilPingu
So very, very, true. beats don't hurt even a tinsy winsy bit if you are properly rolled. The pain, the rants, the "Sky Poker rivers", the moans & groans come when you can't afford to lose.
Part of my job is to encourage people to play more on Sky Poker, & I do, but another part is "be sensible, don't be spending more than you can afford to lose", & I bang that drum that too. Both messages are equally important.
I belong to a number of Sky Poker themed Facebook pages, the Teams, & it makes we weep to see the agony some guys suffer at standard beats. It says so much about them, rather than the "idiot calls" or "Sky Poker river".
In Response to Re: am i really this bad or am i just the unluckiest player ever, : So very, very, true. beats don't hurt even a tinsy winsy bit if you are properly rolled. The pain, the rants, the "Sky Poker rivers", the moans & groans come when you can't afford to lose. Part of my job is to encourage people to play more on Sky Poker, & I do, but another part is "be sensible, don't be spending more than you can afford to lose", & I bsng that drum that too. Both messages are equally important. I belong to a number of Sky Poker themed Facebook pages, the Teams, & it makes we weep to see the agony some guys suffer at standard beats. It says so much about them, rather than the "idiot calls" or "Sky Poker river". There's none so blind...... Posted by Tikay10
im going to reply for this on my own part and not for the majority. I do play within my BR on the most part. I have had a few times where maybe ill see a soft table and take a shot, but isnt poker about these shots?
The issue is, i hate losing. Ive taken beats in $1 tournys worse than i have in UKIPT events ive qualified into. I tyhink that says alot about my mentality and this is where the issue lies in my persoanl issue.
In Response to Re: am i really this bad or am i just the unluckiest player ever, : im going to reply for this on my own part and not for the majority. I do play within my BR on the most part. I have had a few times where maybe ill see a soft table and take a shot, but isnt poker about these shots? The issue is, i hate losing. Ive taken beats in $1 tournys worse than i have in UKIPT events ive qualified into. I tyhink that says alot about my mentality and this is where the issue lies in my persoanl issue. Posted by The_Don90
Don as has been said many times on this thread and elsewhere mate there is varience in poker + / - and we've got to learn to deal with it. No one likes losing mate but if you're properly rolled it shouldn't get to you as much as it does...........
Also mentioned on this thread read "The Mental Game Of Poker"....... I see you say "it doesn't apply to me"
but I very much think it does, going from what I've seen people are giving you the same advice over and over again, but you still post the same things over and over again. Listen to that advice bud somewhere along the line you never know THEY could be right.
In Response to Re: am i really this bad or am i just the unluckiest player ever, : im going to reply for this on my own part and not for the majority. I do play within my BR on the most part. I have had a few times where maybe ill see a soft table and take a shot, but isnt poker about these shots?The issue is, i hate losing. Ive taken beats in $1 tournys worse than i have in UKIPT events ive qualified into. I tyhink that says alot about my mentality and this is where the issue lies in my persoanl issue. Posted by The_Don90
At last, we got there.
Don, if losing upsets you that much, you should not play poker. Really, it's your HOBBY, not your job, why do a hobby where you get so upset, so often? It makes no sense.
Get your head in a different place & accept the little few bumps & brusies that are part & parcel of poker, or quit the game, would be my advice. I so hate to see folks torturing themselves like this. There are much more worthy causes in life to get uppity about than a two bit game of cards, save the angst for those.
In Response to Re: am i really this bad or am i just the unluckiest player ever, : Don as has been said many times on this thread and elsewhere mate there is varience in poker + / - and we've got to learn to deal with it. No one likes losing mate but if you're properly rolled it shouldn't get to you as much as it does........... Also mentioned on this thread read "The Mental Game Of Poker"....... I see you say "it doesn't apply to me" but I very much think it does, going from what I've seen people are giving you the same advice over and over again, but you still post the same things over and over again. Listen to that advice bud somewhere along the line you never know THEY could be right. Posted by scouse_red
Not often a scouser talks that much sense.....
I'm out of here, like everyone else, I've tried very hard to help. Time to move on, I need to walk the dog.
So many people talk a good game but very few translate their words into results! Discipline your game! Plan your poker timetable! Commit pre flop to your cards or fold don't mess around with wishy washy hands Concentrate on specific MTT's Keep records of your betting patterns and speed of responses to try and establish where you're giving away reads to your opponents. And as Tikay stresses enjoy your game! My belief is the wording of this thread sets you up as a target. Good players are going to exploit the fact you're on tilt and take you on with a wider range of hands because they know it won't be long before your emotions get the better of your game. So far as variance goes every time we go out of a tournament we lose to a miracle flop if we didn't Carlo's phrase "poker is a never ending game" would become a reality and tournaments would take days rather than hours! Next time you play a tournament make a note of how many times you got lucky as opposed to how many times your opponent hit! You may well be surprised at the result! Good Luck
1) toughen up - its a game of cards ffs 2) delete this thread - it does you no favours and a lot of your posts make you sound like a 5 year old who lost a game of top trumps. 3) stop ignoring people and assuming you know better - there are professional poker players giving advice you and it is good advice. 4) no offence but when '$500' becomes the amount considered 'life changing' then you need to stop spending money on poker until financially it becomes irrelevant to you. unless you're professional there should be no link between your overall financial security and your poker bankroll
you probably won't like this but: 1) toughen up - its a game of cards ffs 2) delete this thread - it does you no favours and a lot of your posts make you sound like a 5 year old who lost a game of top trumps. 3) stop ignoring people and assuming you know better - there are professional poker players giving advice you and it is good advice. 4) no offence but when '$500' becomes the amount considered 'life changing' then you need to stop spending money on poker until financially it becomes irrelevant to you. unless you're professional there should be no link between your overall financial security and your poker bankroll sorry for being harsh but it looked necessary. Posted by huuuuume
Don, after reading all the posts on this thread & many others by yourself i think the answer you are looking for is simple .................. Stop playing poker if you are not enjoying it, and you dont like losing.
Don i think you need to ask sky to stop this thread,You need to take the advice imo or give up playing like others said its your hobby not your job,,Enjoy it or give it up 50/50 choice m8,G/l in whatever you decide.
I remember when we used to play the £2.20@2.20 a year or 2 back. What fun that was, i was new to the game and i really enjoyed the banter of those tournaments.
In a very shot space of time i had managed a second in the doublestack, my first main event final table (after losing HU to tikay if i remember rightly). Every time i played that small £2.20 tournament i went over my hands, my losing hands, winning hands and exit hands, made a mental note and attempted to improve next game. My game improved rapidly. Up until recently i had stopped doing that, after one week of starting again i had won the open. It is SO SO SO SO SO important to be critical of your play, go over hands you have played badly and REMEMBER what you are doing wrong and learn from this.
If your really stuck on playing tourneys and not cash then you can reduce variance. Play deepstacks with good structures. Forget 1$ turbos etc play small tourneys that will let you play for longer periods. If you play tight and solid you can suffer some bad beats and still go deep and win.
Also don't multi table mtts. Personally i find it hard to get the crucial reads that are needed to win when playing lots of them. Obviously the better players on here that do that regularly can multi table with ease and still maintain a high standard of play but it takes alot of practise, so play one or two tables and really focus. Turn off your music, or tv, or film, or anything and FOCUS on what your doing.
Also one more thing i found works for me recently. When your running bad your big hands are often getting busted but how often have you got busted when your all in pre. For example getting it in with 1010-kk and getting busted by that killer Ax hand. Try just calling with your big hands pre, seeing a safe flop or using a read to play your hand rather than trusting luck even if you are a 90-20 fave. Maybe not the standard way of playing it but i have found it is a safer way, as long as you are willing to accept one time in 20 you will get outdrawn.
Sorry for ranting a load of rubbish, beats are part of the game mate, everybody needs luck to win don, if your getting unlucky then you've just got to accept that there is NOTHING you could do about it and move on. If your getting it in behind, or committing your stack too early even if you are ahead then there is SOMETHING you can do, but you have to understand where you are going wrong and be willing to change as often it is something you do without even realising.
There is no doubt you have the ability to do well, toughen up your mind a bit and focus on improving. As long as your playing poker your getting bad beats its part of the game and poker wouldn't be anything without them.
Hi don, hope your feeling better today. I remember when we used to play the £2.20@2.20 a year or 2 back. What fun that was, i was new to the game and i really enjoyed the banter of those tournaments. In a very shot space of time i had managed a second in the doublestack, my first main event final table (after losing HU to tikay if i remember rightly). Every time i played that small £2.20 tournament i went over my hands, my losing hands, winning hands and exit hands, made a mental note and attempted to improve next game. My game improved rapidly. Up until recently i had stopped doing that, after one week of starting again i had won the open. It is SO SO SO SO SO important to be critical of your play, go over hands you have played badly and REMEMBER what you are doing wrong and learn from this. If your really stuck on playing tourneys and not cash then you can reduce variance. Play deepstacks with good structures. Forget 1$ turbos etc play small tourneys that will let you play for longer periods. If you play tight and solid you can suffer some bad beats and still go deep and win. Also don't multi table mtts. Personally i find it hard to get the crucial reads that are needed to win when playing lots of them. Obviously the better players on here that do that regularly can multi table with ease and still maintain a high standard of play but it takes alot of practise, so play one or two tables and really focus. Turn off your music, or tv, or film, or anything and FOCUS on what your doing. Also one more thing i found works for me recently. When your running bad your big hands are often getting busted but how often have you got busted when your all in pre. For example getting it in with 1010-kk and getting busted by that killer Ax hand. Try just calling with your big hands pre, seeing a safe flop or using a read to play your hand rather than trusting luck even if you are a 90-20 fave. Maybe not the standard way of playing it but i have found it is a safer way, as long as you are willing to accept one time in 20 you will get outdrawn. Sorry for ranting a load of rubbish, beats are part of the game mate, everybody needs luck to win don, if your getting unlucky then you've just got to accept that there is NOTHING you could do about it and move on. If your getting it in behind, or committing your stack too early even if you are ahead then there is SOMETHING you can do, but you have to understand where you are going wrong and be willing to change as often it is something you do without even realising. There is no doubt you have the ability to do well, toughen up your mind a bit and focus on improving. As long as your playing poker your getting bad beats its part of the game and poker wouldn't be anything without them. Gl sir Posted by Wacko90
Do you fancy making the 2.20@2.20 big again? used to love that tourny but its a shade of its former self.. great post mate btw
you probably won't like this but: 1) toughen up - its a game of cards ffs 2) delete this thread - it does you no favours and a lot of your posts make you sound like a 5 year old who lost a game of top trumps. 3) stop ignoring people and assuming you know better - there are professional poker players giving advice you and it is good advice. 4) no offence but when '$500' becomes the amount considered 'life changing' then you need to stop spending money on poker until financially it becomes irrelevant to you. unless you're professional there should be no link between your overall financial security and your poker bankroll sorry for being harsh but it looked necessary. Posted by huuuuume
Im going to reply to this i wasnt gonna but i feel the need to.
1) theres things here that are in my personal life that im not willing to go into it. However even if i did i expect you wouldnt understnad.
2) thats not my authority
3) When did i ever ignore advice from anyone??? I dont recall i ever have. If your referring to the MGOP issue then thats different. I took advice to get it and i did read it. I didnt think it helped me personally. I never took a beat in the manner the book expressed. Again this means me going into persoanl issues that i will not go into. I will however state i have never ignored any advice without debating my point and usually hats a friendly debate.
4) MKust be nice to have your kind of money. Not everyone has a perfect start in life where money is automatically there. Some people do have to start from the bottom and since im still young and yes very much at the bottom of that ladder then yes $500 extra probably wouldnt change my life, but it would certainly be a stepping stone.
Lastly one more point, if you wish to go moaning about me on twitter then your completely free to do so. However at least have the deceny to say it to me. Rather than to others.
Comments
Although one thing you said here, im confused by you comment. Im guessing your referring to the UKIPT sat, of which i satt'd into for £3. Tbh UKIPTs i dw worry about too much. I like the social side of it with my dad and uncle, we rarley spend time together and a weekend away helps.
Although it comes straight after a comment rgarding a $2 mtt, which i can afford. Most tournys are top heavy i accept that. And nor do i ever worry about getting "lucky" waiting on my time to win, (Aimed at dudeskin) In honesty i started out playing tournys and ive always struggled to adapt o cash. Tournys are where im comfortable and where i see my future if i can ever get going. Tbh its either that or the towel because me and cash will not get on till i sort my mental health
Seriously wish i had your luck mate.
Oh and by the way,you owned me when i ventured onto nl4 one very dark day sometime ago,you got the game .:)
If that’s how you feel Don and MTT suit you and that’s your game then why not try the £2-£5 mini on Sky, 300-400 runners –
Overall playing 1000+ fields is going to be tough to get through all them donks )
Still think a lower variance game such as cash will prove long term results + mix in some MTT’s and you can turn £80 into £800 in six months
If I can do it then I am sure you can.
I remember when I started with £80 and suffered some real downswings and mentally it was really tough. Building up to £220 then down to £110 was really a really hard month. Then I got it back to £300 and back down to £180.
At my lowest points mentally & emotionally I thought I would never be sitting where I am now with a overall BR over £1000.
During the course I had 3 MTT binks, which was a great bonus.
But I played MTT because I won at cash, so anything I won in MTT was a bonus and didn’t tilt me at all getting bad beats at crucial stages.
They were annoying but it wasn’t the end of the world, just go back win some at cash and play another one.
Not going to lie, it’s hard work – need to work on your game and be mentally tough enough to ride the variance/downswing.
And just be tough on yourself about your in game mistakes and correct them.
Good luck whatever you do
Cash is for dough – MTT for show
GREAT Post by rancid.
Winning is not easy, & is not meant to be, either. Some critical self-analysis is needed, & an ability to say "I got that one wrong", or "I need to stop making excuses, & play better".
"Back to basics" is the best & easiest route, & cash - in this instance - is best, Don is not at all suited - in my personal opinion, no offence intended - to the bruising variance of MTT's.
Part of my job is to encourage people to play more on Sky Poker, & I do, but another part is "be sensible, don't be spending more than you can afford to lose", & I bang that drum that too. Both messages are equally important.
I belong to a number of Sky Poker themed Facebook pages, the Teams, & it makes we weep to see the agony some guys suffer at standard beats. It says so much about them, rather than the "idiot calls" or "Sky Poker river".
There's none so blind......
The issue is, i hate losing. Ive taken beats in $1 tournys worse than i have in UKIPT events ive qualified into. I tyhink that says alot about my mentality and this is where the issue lies in my persoanl issue.
Don, if losing upsets you that much, you should not play poker. Really, it's your HOBBY, not your job, why do a hobby where you get so upset, so often? It makes no sense.
Get your head in a different place & accept the little few bumps & brusies that are part & parcel of poker, or quit the game, would be my advice. I so hate to see folks torturing themselves like this. There are much more worthy causes in life to get uppity about than a two bit game of cards, save the angst for those.
I'm out of here, like everyone else, I've tried very hard to help. Time to move on, I need to walk the dog.
Discipline your game!
Plan your poker timetable!
Commit pre flop to your cards or fold don't mess around with wishy washy hands
Concentrate on specific MTT's
Keep records of your betting patterns and speed of responses to try and establish where you're giving away reads to your opponents.
And as Tikay stresses enjoy your game!
My belief is the wording of this thread sets you up as a target. Good players are going to exploit the fact you're on tilt and take you on with a wider range of hands because they know it won't be long before your emotions get the better of your game.
So far as variance goes every time we go out of a tournament we lose to a miracle flop if we didn't Carlo's phrase "poker is a never ending game" would become a reality and tournaments would take days rather than hours!
Next time you play a tournament make a note of how many times you got lucky as opposed to how many times your opponent hit!
You may well be surprised at the result!
Good Luck
1) toughen up - its a game of cards ffs
2) delete this thread - it does you no favours and a lot of your posts make you sound like a 5 year old who lost a game of top trumps.
3) stop ignoring people and assuming you know better - there are professional poker players giving advice you and it is good advice.
4) no offence but when '$500' becomes the amount considered 'life changing' then you need to stop spending money on poker until financially it becomes irrelevant to you. unless you're professional there should be no link between your overall financial security and your poker bankroll
sorry for being harsh but it looked necessary.
Don, after reading all the posts on this thread & many others by yourself i think the answer you are looking for is simple .................. Stop playing poker if you are not enjoying it, and you dont like losing.
1) theres things here that are in my personal life that im not willing to go into it. However even if i did i expect you wouldnt understnad.
2) thats not my authority
3) When did i ever ignore advice from anyone??? I dont recall i ever have. If your referring to the MGOP issue then thats different. I took advice to get it and i did read it. I didnt think it helped me personally. I never took a beat in the manner the book expressed. Again this means me going into persoanl issues that i will not go into. I will however state i have never ignored any advice without debating my point and usually hats a friendly debate.
4) MKust be nice to have your kind of money. Not everyone has a perfect start in life where money is automatically there. Some people do have to start from the bottom and since im still young and yes very much at the bottom of that ladder then yes $500 extra probably wouldnt change my life, but it would certainly be a stepping stone.
Lastly one more point, if you wish to go moaning about me on twitter then your completely free to do so. However at least have the deceny to say it to me. Rather than to others.