Its trickier than just getting it in. What does he flat 3 bets pre flop with? Thats the key to the hand imo. He prob re raises with AA most of the time so we can rule that out, its unlikely he has KK as we have two of them, does he flat with QQ/JJ? Probably, and they are beating us now so there isnt much we are beating, maybe 10,10 or AK. Its not a drawy board so there are no draws he is calling with on the flop so i think we are behind a fair bit here. Therefore, if villain can make a few moves let him try and float turn with worse hands. Dont think i put it down to be fair but i like giving him some room to make his bluffs. Your losing quite a bit here i think but at least we can try to keep worse hands in if we cant fold by check calling.
Checking the turn is ok we are showing weakness and the villan may think all the hands that are losing against us are infront.Also if he checks the turn we can value bet the river confident were in front.But your image at the table is very important here im a lag player so wen i have cowboys here i want 3 streets as im capable off multi barreling my junk so when i have marjinal spots like cowboys in this spot i wanna squeeze the max value from my hand.If your a nitty player i understand its more difficult to get 3 streets off value on this spot unless were beat as the villan will know were tight,Checking the turn and if he bets into the pot he will be pot commited either way never folding here as the villan has like £7 back and were getting just over 2-1 on a call either way im happy to stack off here.
if oppo flopped a set on u then really well played w/e, reload u have to ask the question "why is oppo flatting pre against me" hands like this just annoy me ) Posted by rancid
Why does it annoy you?
What does answering your question achieve?
No one has suggested anything other than getting stacks in. It's questionable imo what's the best way to achieve this is. Percival suggested if we check (which wasn't line he suggested) it should be to c/ f. Against a good tag reg with no aggro history I can see merit to c/f turn when you think about ranges, but if turn checked thru it would be a clear vbet on river
In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn? : Why does it annoy you? What does answering your question achieve? No one has suggested anything other than getting stacks in. It's questionable imo what's the best way to achieve this is. Percival suggested if we check (which wasn't line he suggested) it should be to c/ f. Against a good tag reg with no aggro history I can see merit to c/f flop when you think about ranges, but if flop checked thru it would be a clear vbet on river Posted by grantorino
just don't get what the great debate is, oppo flats our 3 bet pre with £10 ish behind, if oppo flops a set yeah w/e - how do we ever consider c/f
we can check or bet, don't think we ever fold
if the board flops comes nine high does oppo stack off with JJ kinda the same situation in my eyes _)
We can bet and get it in, and imo, readless, more times than not if villain is good you're not going to get called by a hand that hero is ahead of, occasionaly you might be ahead ofc and villain might have floated AQ on flop or something random
We can check and imo fold to a reasonably sized bet on the turn. I'm not saying I do this but what's villain betting on the turn that we beat? He's checking back most of his 1pair range.
We can bet and get it in, and imo, readless, more times than not if villain is good you're not going to get called by a hand that hero is ahead of, occasionaly you might be ahead ofc and villain might have floated AQ on flop or something random We can check and imo fold to a reasonably sized bet on the turn. I'm not saying I do this but what's villain betting on the turn that we beat? He's checking back most of his 1pair range. Posted by percival09
More to the point, what is capable reg flatting 3 bet pre with that we now are ahead by the turn and like you say will stack off to us - such an annoying hand
what I was trying to put across in a previous post is why is vill flatting verus hero's 3 bet in this spot, and maybe hero should ask himself that question - can't see why vill would set mine
In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn? : More to the point, what is capable reg flatting 3 bet pre with that we now are ahead by the turn and like you say will stack off to us - such an annoying hand what I was trying to put across in a previous post is why is vill flatting verus hero's 3 bet in this spot, and maybe hero should ask himself that question - can't see why vill would set mine Posted by rancid
If villian has jj (which he does) and is playing against a reasonably aggro reg (which I would say I am at this level) I don't think a call of my 3 bet in position is bad. Its not just set mining he might be prepared to get it all in on a 10 high or lower flop.
Once he calls my flop bet, sets are such a large proportion of his holding, perhaps a check on turn from me is best play, whether I can fold to bet on turn I'm not sure. In play I shoved. At the time i shrugged and thought nh move on, but I do think a better player than me might be able to c/f
In Response to Re: Whats my move on the turn? : If villian has jj (which he does) and is playing against a reasonably aggro reg (which I would say I am at this level) I don't think a call of my 3 bet in position is bad. Its not just set mining he might be prepared to get it all in on a 10 high or lower flop. Once he calls my flop bet, sets are such a large proportion of his holding, perhaps a check on turn from me is best play, whether I can fold to bet on turn I'm not sure. In play I shoved. At the time i shrugged and thought nh move on, but I do think a better player than me might be able to c/f Posted by mattless
I hear all this but u have 3 bet a 4x UTG open
think if your deeper you can b/f with a smile on your face
don't think you can c/f and feel happy about it tbh, even though I do agree when the Q pops on turn it takes away the only hand that you getting value from apart from AJ - so if you really believe oppo would 4x UTG and flat a 3 bet ip w/AJ versus you then hey ho your good
Comments
u have to ask the question "why is oppo flatting pre against me"
hands like this just annoy me )
how do we ever consider c/f
we can check or bet, don't think we ever fold
if the board flops comes nine high does oppo stack off with JJ
kinda the same situation in my eyes _)
what I was trying to put across in a previous post is why is vill flatting verus hero's 3 bet in this spot, and maybe hero should ask himself that question - can't see why vill would set mine
Once he calls my flop bet, sets are such a large proportion of his holding, perhaps a check on turn from me is best play, whether I can fold to bet on turn I'm not sure. In play I shoved. At the time i shrugged and thought nh move on, but I do think a better player than me might be able to c/f
think if your deeper you can b/f with a smile on your face
don't think you can c/f and feel happy about it tbh, even though I do agree when the Q pops on turn it takes away the only hand that you getting value from apart from AJ - so if you really believe oppo would 4x UTG and flat a 3 bet ip w/AJ versus you then hey ho your good