I have not seen one suggestion (including my own), which solves the problem without causing another. I dont know what Sky will choose to do but whatever it is, some people are going to be against it.
they have already scrapped the 50/100 a while ago... so 25/50 in the highest. But still there just waiting for the Very slim chance of a very very rich non reg to play:D table spawing isint the case that high i dont think. Altho there has been alot of players sat there recently :P Posted by shaun09
I have not seen one suggestion (including my own), which solves the problem without causing another. I dont know what Sky will choose to do but whatever it is, some people are going to be against it. Posted by ajs4385
The problem may not have a solution because it may not actually be deemed to be a problem which is the problem.
It would seem the problem is there's not enough nd's to go round & you resent people sitting at HU tables waiting for the nd's then everyone starts doing the same
then everyone starts moaning about no 6 max nd's
the answers in there somewhere, stop being selfish and think about the bigger picture
old skool saying "to get action, you have to give it"
It would seem the problem is there's not enough nd's to go round & you resent people sitting at HU tables waiting for the nd's then everyone starts doing the same then everyone starts moaning about no 6 max nd's the answers in there somewhere, stop being selfish and think about the bigger picture old skool saying "to get action, you have to give it" Posted by rancid
thats a very decent point.
there are some regs who sit at empty 6 max tables and just refuse to play when I sit.
the software doesn't spawn new 6 max 100bb deep tables until there are 3 on the last 1 to be spawned, so I can't choose to sit on a new table and play anyone.
of course even these 'NDs'/casual players/recreational players whatever you term you prefer aren't stupid. they soon realise how horrific the ettiquette of certain regular players are.
other things that regs do will insta sit out once the ND has lost his stack or sat out and then insta sit back in when the reload has come thru or they have sat back in. just look awful.
the have no big picture/concern for the long term of the game and only care about the now. so selfish and short sighted but of course you can't force people to play.
In Response to Re: Heads up tables : thats a very decent point. there are some regs who sit at empty 6 max tables and just refuse to play when I sit. the software doesn't spawn new 6 max 100bb deep tables until there are 3 on the last 1 to be spawned, so I can't choose to sit on a new table and play anyone. of course even these 'NDs'/casual players/recreational players whatever you term you prefer aren't stupid. they soon realise how horrific the ettiquette of certain regular players are. other things that regs do will insta sit out once the ND has lost his stack or sat out and then insta sit back in when the reload has come thru or they have sat back in. just look awful. the have no big picture/concern for the long term of the game and only care about the now. so selfish and short sighted but of course you can't force people to play. Posted by scotty77
very good post
what's even more annoying is when they sit out and then have the nerve to stand and take up a new seat directly to your right, so that they get position on a recreational player should they join the table. i could name a few regs at 100nl who i remember doing this, it's just such disgraceful etiquette.
I never understand why these 'pros' would only want to sit at heads up tables waiting for the off chance ONE random 'ND' is going to turn up.
I believe the saying goes 'to be the best, you've got to beat the best'
So if these 'pros' sat at 6 max tables, they now have five opponents of which they can play and beat, Five more chances to stack people, more rake as they are actually playing and not waiting and guaranteed action!!!
Ok it may take abit of work to learn there playing tendencies etc, but these 'pros' are good players, surely with abit of time and effort it would be more profitable in the long run??
I'll be honest, i don't understand the whole liquidity thing, but maybe this would help that too!??
Not sure if this makes sense to anyone else lol, I know in my head what i mean but not sure if it comes across how i've wrote it as i suck at writing!!!!!!
at the end of the day etiquette and 'being the best' and everything is by the by.
this game is about making money, not friends or a community or respect or anything else. money. whatever brings you the most money, go and do it. if people curse you for it then who cares.
Remove HU tables above a certain limit for a short period of time and see how it affects the games. If people really want to play HU they can still use 6max tables. Posted by offshoot
at the end of the day etiquette and 'being the best' and everything is by the by. this game is about making money, not friends or a community or respect or anything else. money. whatever brings you the most money, go and do it. if people curse you for it then who cares. fair play to them i say. Posted by Pipunch
Yeah, but you have to think about the longevity of the game (the thing which gives these people a living). Imagine every single 100NL+ player on the site would only play HU and 90% of them wouldn't play each other... so this destroys the amount of rake Sky get, and pretty much destroys the chances of these people making a living, cos no-one will play each other.
You should do what you want, cos it's all about winning money, but in the long run, you need to do things to help the games keep running. Even if doing these things are not as +EV as other options (playing HU with terrible players), they're still ALOT more +EV than there being no games running, which is what would happen if everyone was super selfish.
Ok 1st response from me, good idea to cancel HU tables & I play both 6max and HU. I'm literally willing to play anyone HU bar a couple of players. I don't think you can force people to play eachother some battles are personal & are -EV long run. I have to say though I can't help but think this is a desperate plea from AJS as he has noticed his win rate has obviously dwindled severly this year. please note this isn't a personal dig merely an observation. Thats part of the game though I'm afraid & I'm sure everyones has to be honest. I'm not really sure what can be done really Sky is a small site & it always will be - yes its growing but its still tiny in comparison to others. I'm happy the way it is, as soon as things like software changes happen, along come the nits with there HEM (I prefer playing the player not the stats) anyone can read stats and react to it. Also the bots will arrive and will be compatible with the site, believe me they exist I have seen them in action on other sites. So this question is, is it really worth changing anything at all? or best to leave the site as it is.. Sky is one of the purist sites left, yes the software isn't lightning quick but you dont get bots & u can't use HEM its as close as real poker as you can get! Posted by lJAMESl
Ok, so i'll try and be as unbiased as i can here.. But first of all it is ironic that the player who treats recreational players worse than anyone on 6max tables with regards to etiquette has the nerve to post this kind of astounds me to begin with, though i shouldn't be suprised given previous posts by you. I definitely don't agree with taking out heads up tables(shock i know), reg on reg games still do happen and some recreational players much prefer it over 6max, to just outright delete it seems abrupt without trying other less extreme solutions. This is obviously a very difficult thing to do as all the other sites are trying to find the same solutions. We do kind of have the king of the hill system in place already and from all i've read on the subject it seems the fairest way to distribute tables. I guess the main issue is Sky's software and what it can implement on the current system, can you actually restrict the amount of empty tables each reg can sit? can you give out punishments to people who table block because they aren't willing to fight for a table? etc. so this system is more effective. It would be nice if Sky consulted us with major decisions like this before they go ahead or atleast outlined what solutions they are looking at and what are most likely in their thoughts so no clangers are potentially dropped. As for the incoming chat ban for observers it's clear this was needed so kudos for that. People complaining about lower numbers need to look at themselves on the tables along with obvious external issues, heads up hasn't just come out of nowhere to ruin 6max action. Posted by zing
Sigh @ this thread just becoming a slanging match... Ok Beaneh's response could be taken in a slightly derogatory manner (lol) but at least he had a point, and was making it well. But now this is just silly, how is it relevant how much Percival plays on the site? He obviously does play on here because he nearly did the Jackpot the other night, but volume is irrelevant really. And then we got Pipunch again... Posted by Lambert180
This happens everywhere, but there is no solution, if there was a solution don't you think another site would have come up with it. if the HU tables were limited to say 8 /level would be even better for me, limiting tables would make its so only the best HU players would get a table, in which case would mean more money would be taken out of site, as recreational players would have less chance of beating them.
basically whatever you do to try and solve the problem, it will cause a different problem.
Sky works well with cash, and thats the truth. think they should be looking less at cash tables and look more at improving tournaments, ironically i sent some ideas over to priority centre this morning regarding stt and mtt.
dont forget Sky is a stand alone site, and it has similar traffic on 6 max cash tables as do big networks such as ipoker and entraction, entraction has recently closed, or is soon too as traffic is so low, on there there are no games above 200 nl and only a few of them going daily. This network had 50+ skins, and is open to all of Europe, unlike skys UK only. Only site similarar to sky is PKR as it is a stand alone site sky has much better traffic, only thing they have better there is there are regularly 1k 6 max nl games going, but then again it is in $ so its like our 500 nl games, and these also run every day, and 90% of the time is a deepstack/mastercash.
I play ring and HU although i prefer HU, as i like the pace of the game, this is the same for recreational players too, sometimes you just want a fast paced action game. I play ring games also cos if i solely played HU, i would not earn enough. and lately have been playing more mtts and sit and goes, as money doesnt come as easy as it used to, so i have adapted, branched out and play all variations on the game.
To sum up the people that are moaning, should work on there game, maybe try different variations, this is online poker its not a charity. to survive you must work hard.
In Response to Re: Heads up tables : Yeah, but you have to think about the longevity of the game (the thing which gives these people a living). Imagine every single 100NL+ player on the site would only play HU and 90% of them wouldn't play each other... so this destroys the amount of rake Sky get, and pretty much destroys the chances of these people making a living, cos no-one will play each other. You should do what you want, cos it's all about winning money, but in the long run, you need to do things to help the games keep running. Even if doing these things are not as +EV as other options (playing HU with terrible players), they're still ALOT more +EV than there being no games running, which is what would happen if everyone was super selfish. Posted by Lambert180
so basically the solution is to play in a 6max game where 4/5 sharks have to dodge each other to feed on the fish? LOL.
some people are so short sighted. the industry will NEVER run out of fish. so you might have to play elsewhere to find them. so what? and there are only a few on here that purely sit on HU tables and they mostly sit empty. the original post is just someone whining cause the easy games have dried up for him
To sum up the people that are moaning, should work on there game, maybe try different variations, this is online poker its not a charity. to survive you must work hard. Posted by Keysasoze6
but just sitting at 5/10 HU waiting for a rec player to come and play you is the complete opposite of what you have just described
Comments
I have not seen one suggestion (including my own), which solves the problem without causing another. I dont know what Sky will choose to do but whatever it is, some people are going to be against it.
& you resent people sitting at HU tables waiting for the nd's
then everyone starts doing the same
then everyone starts moaning about no 6 max nd's
the answers in there somewhere, stop being selfish and think about the bigger picture
old skool saying "to get action, you have to give it"
what's even more annoying is when they sit out and then have the nerve to stand and take up a new seat directly to your right, so that they get position on a recreational player should they join the table. i could name a few regs at 100nl who i remember doing this, it's just such disgraceful etiquette.
I never understand why these 'pros' would only want to sit at heads up tables waiting for the off chance ONE random 'ND' is going to turn up.
I believe the saying goes 'to be the best, you've got to beat the best'
So if these 'pros' sat at 6 max tables, they now have five opponents of which they can play and beat, Five more chances to stack people, more rake as they are actually playing and not waiting and guaranteed action!!!
Ok it may take abit of work to learn there playing tendencies etc, but these 'pros' are good players, surely with abit of time and effort it would be more profitable in the long run??
I'll be honest, i don't understand the whole liquidity thing, but maybe this would help that too!??
Not sure if this makes sense to anyone else lol, I know in my head what i mean but not sure if it comes across how i've wrote it as i suck at writing!!!!!!
this game is about making money, not friends or a community or respect or anything else. money. whatever brings you the most money, go and do it. if people curse you for it then who cares.
fair play to them i say.
You should do what you want, cos it's all about winning money, but in the long run, you need to do things to help the games keep running. Even if doing these things are not as +EV as other options (playing HU with terrible players), they're still ALOT more +EV than there being no games running, which is what would happen if everyone was super selfish.
This happens everywhere, but there is no solution, if there was a solution don't you think another site would have come up with it. if the HU tables were limited to say 8 /level would be even better for me, limiting tables would make its so only the best HU players would get a table, in which case would mean more money would be taken out of site, as recreational players would have less chance of beating them.
basically whatever you do to try and solve the problem, it will cause a different problem.
Sky works well with cash, and thats the truth. think they should be looking less at cash tables and look more at improving tournaments, ironically i sent some ideas over to priority centre this morning regarding stt and mtt.
dont forget Sky is a stand alone site, and it has similar traffic on 6 max cash tables as do big networks such as ipoker and entraction, entraction has recently closed, or is soon too as traffic is so low, on there there are no games above 200 nl and only a few of them going daily. This network had 50+ skins, and is open to all of Europe, unlike skys UK only. Only site similarar to sky is PKR as it is a stand alone site sky has much better traffic, only thing they have better there is there are regularly 1k 6 max nl games going, but then again it is in $ so its like our 500 nl games, and these also run every day, and 90% of the time is a deepstack/mastercash.
I play ring and HU although i prefer HU, as i like the pace of the game, this is the same for recreational players too, sometimes you just want a fast paced action game. I play ring games also cos if i solely played HU, i would not earn enough. and lately have been playing more mtts and sit and goes, as money doesnt come as easy as it used to, so i have adapted, branched out and play all variations on the game.
To sum up the people that are moaning, should work on there game, maybe try different variations, this is online poker its not a charity. to survive you must work hard.
some people are so short sighted. the industry will NEVER run out of fish. so you might have to play elsewhere to find them. so what? and there are only a few on here that purely sit on HU tables and they mostly sit empty. the original post is just someone whining cause the easy games have dried up for him