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Brexit

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  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517




    Several front pages show Prime Minister Boris Johnson speaking on the phone to European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen. In the background of the photograph, taken in his office, we can see a strategically-placed Union flag.

    "Last call for a deal" is the Daily Mail's headline. It warns the talks appear to be running out of road.

    The Daily Express predicts there'll be a "showdown in Brussels" when Mr Johnson travels there for more talks.


    The Daily Telegraph says his decision to enter what it calls the "lion's den" of Brussels - for the first time since he became prime minister - is a huge gamble.

    It's an arena that both Theresa May and David Cameron "failed to conquer, to their ultimate cost", the paper warns. It says EU sources believe the trip may just be for show, so Mr Johnson can say he did everything he could.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-the-papers-55224733
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
  • HANSONHANSON Member Posts: 898
    i find hard to believe that both sides cannot find a sensible compromise more so on the fishing ...

    pretty sure i read the EU offered 15-18% returned to the UK who said they wanted 80% returned then revised that down to 60% returned and a transition period of 3/4 yrs the EU say no ..

    the UK then ask for 40% returned the EU now want 10yrs transition the UK say NO its all very confusing ...

    my understanding is the French will veto any trade deal if it effects there fisher men so that would mean the EU would keep 100% of there quota and no trade deal in place for access to UK waters to catch that quota very confusing ..

    there is other issues to get a agreement sorted on but the fish such a small % of GDP really cannot understand all the fuss on both sides
  • chillingchilling Member Posts: 3,774
    HANSON said:

    i find hard to believe that both sides cannot find a sensible compromise more so on the fishing ...

    pretty sure i read the EU offered 15-18% returned to the UK who said they wanted 80% returned then revised that down to 60% returned and a transition period of 3/4 yrs the EU say no ..

    the UK then ask for 40% returned the EU now want 10yrs transition the UK say NO its all very confusing ...

    my understanding is the French will veto any trade deal if it effects there fisher men so that would mean the EU would keep 100% of there quota and no trade deal in place for access to UK waters to catch that quota very confusing ..

    there is other issues to get a agreement sorted on but the fish such a small % of GDP really cannot understand all the fuss on both sides

    Well, it can’t be that significant if the French are prepared to veto any trade deal.
    No way is it significant 😁
  • chillingchilling Member Posts: 3,774
    Barnier the “ deal maker” is supposed to be stepping down next year.
    A no deal will not be one of his greatest accomplishments.
    The French fisherman won’t give a stuff about any other parts of the potential trade deal with the U.K. They will only be concerned about their own industry, and potentially they can cause chaos, which can hurt trade both ways.
    So forget about the % of GDP, it’s irrelevant.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
    HANSON said:

    i find hard to believe that both sides cannot find a sensible compromise more so on the fishing ...

    pretty sure i read the EU offered 15-18% returned to the UK who said they wanted 80% returned then revised that down to 60% returned and a transition period of 3/4 yrs the EU say no ..

    the UK then ask for 40% returned the EU now want 10yrs transition the UK say NO its all very confusing ...
    Fishing turns
    my understanding is the French will veto any trade deal if it effects there fisher men so that would mean the EU would keep 100% of there quota and no trade deal in place for access to UK waters to catch that quota very confusing ..

    there is other issues to get a agreement sorted on but the fish such a small % of GDP really cannot understand all the fuss on both sides

    Fishing turns over less than Harrods, so less than 1 shop.

    Our fishermen sold off lots of quotas to Europeans years ago.

    Our fishermen sell most of their fish in Europe.

    So bigger quotas may allow them to catch more fish that they cant sell.

    No deal means tariffs which will not make them easier to sell.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
    HANSON said:

    i find hard to believe that both sides cannot find a sensible compromise more so on the fishing ...

    pretty sure i read the EU offered 15-18% returned to the UK who said they wanted 80% returned then revised that down to 60% returned and a transition period of 3/4 yrs the EU say no ..

    the UK then ask for 40% returned the EU now want 10yrs transition the UK say NO its all very confusing ...

    my understanding is the French will veto any trade deal if it effects there fisher men so that would mean the EU would keep 100% of there quota and no trade deal in place for access to UK waters to catch that quota very confusing ..

    there is other issues to get a agreement sorted on but the fish such a small % of GDP really cannot understand all the fuss on both sides

    Toyota warns over future of its UK car making under No Deal Brexit


    The boss of Toyota in Europe says a No Deal Brexit would be a ‘disaster’ that could put the brakes on the chances of the Japanese giant building future planned electric cars in the UK.

    Ultimately it could threaten the viability of their UK factories altogether, he suggested.
    The warning comes as the Japanese carmaker unveiled plans to build its first fully electric car – a crossover sports utility vehicle – with five more zero-emissions vehicles in the pipeline by 2025, the bulk of them battery-powered.

    No Deal would bring in tariffs and increase the cost of the firm exporting its UK built vehicles – of which nine out of ten go to the European Union, he said.


    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/cars/news/toyota-warns-over-future-of-its-uk-car-making-under-no-deal-brexit/ar-BB1bHqoW?ocid=anaheim-ntp-feeds
  • chillingchilling Member Posts: 3,774
    When you have a good produce to sell, markets are easy to find.
    If fish caught in U.K. waters can go to China, then back to the U.K, then that speaks for itself.
    Disgruntled EU fisherman, disgruntled EU consumers😁

    Those fish are a great commodity to have, swimming through our waters.
    Very healthy,which is the way the world will be going.
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
    HANSON said:

    i find hard to believe that both sides cannot find a sensible compromise more so on the fishing ...

    pretty sure i read the EU offered 15-18% returned to the UK who said they wanted 80% returned then revised that down to 60% returned and a transition period of 3/4 yrs the EU say no ..

    the UK then ask for 40% returned the EU now want 10yrs transition the UK say NO its all very confusing ...

    my understanding is the French will veto any trade deal if it effects there fisher men so that would mean the EU would keep 100% of there quota and no trade deal in place for access to UK waters to catch that quota very confusing ..

    there is other issues to get a agreement sorted on but the fish such a small % of GDP really cannot understand all the fuss on both sides

    We have a large number fish processing companies, that process fish and shellfish.

    They are apparently scared because time is the essence for deliveries of fresh products.

    Any border delays may result in tonnes of their produce being binned.

    The government says there will be no border delays, but are making arrangements for the military to deliver the vaccine from January onwards.

    Why would they do that if there wont be a problem.


    UK fish processing operations could move to European countries after Brexit, warns expert
    UK fish processing operations could move to European countries after Brexit, according to an industry expert.


    In 2016 the UK sea fish processing industry provided around 13,554 full-time jobs across 307 units.

    https://inews.co.uk/news/brexit/fish-processing-move-europe-162514
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
    HANSON said:

    i find hard to believe that both sides cannot find a sensible compromise more so on the fishing ...

    pretty sure i read the EU offered 15-18% returned to the UK who said they wanted 80% returned then revised that down to 60% returned and a transition period of 3/4 yrs the EU say no ..

    the UK then ask for 40% returned the EU now want 10yrs transition the UK say NO its all very confusing ...

    my understanding is the French will veto any trade deal if it effects there fisher men so that would mean the EU would keep 100% of there quota and no trade deal in place for access to UK waters to catch that quota very confusing ..

    there is other issues to get a agreement sorted on but the fish such a small % of GDP really cannot understand all the fuss on both sides

    Toss ers. Ooops not another u-turn.

    Pound jumps as UK agrees to drop controversial Brexit legislation



    The pound jumped on Tuesday after UK cabinet minister Michael Gove confirmed the government would drop controversial legislation that would break the Brexit withdrawal deal.

    The EU-UK Joint Committee announced it has agreed “in principle” on all issues relating to the Brexit withdrawal agreement.

    “Ensuring that the Withdrawal Agreement, in particular the Protocol on Ireland and Northern Ireland, is fully operational at the end of the transition period, i.e. as of 1 January 2021, is essential,” a statement by the Cabinet Office read.

    “In view of these mutually agreed solutions, the UK will withdraw clauses 44, 45 and 47 of the UK Internal Market Bill, and not introduce any similar provisions in the Taxation Bill,” the statement added.

    An agreement in principle has been found in the following areas, amongst others: Border control posts/entry points specifically for checks on animals, plants and derived products, export declarations, the supply of medicines, the supply of chilled meats, and other food products to supermarkets, the Cabinet Office said.

    https://uk.yahoo.com/finance/news/uk-eu-brexit-northern-ireland-protocol-withdrawal-agreement-135321410.html
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
    UK to ditch international law-breaking clauses of Brexit legislation after reaching deal with EU




    The government will drop parts of legislation that could have seen the UK break international law after reaching an "agreement in principle" on Brexit divorce issues.

    As a result, the government said it would withdraw the most controversial parts of its Internal Market Bill.

    The proposed legislation had seen the EU launch legal action against the UK as part of a bitter row.

    The government also promised not to introduce any similar measures in its Taxation Bill, which is due to be debated by MPs in the House of Commons later on Tuesday.


    The government's publication of the Internal Market Bill earlier this year brought condemnation from critics both in Westminster and across European capitals.

    US president-elect Joe Biden also intervened to warn against the Good Friday Agreement in Northern Ireland becoming "a casualty of Brexit".

    The bill's most controversial clauses, which will now be withdrawn, sought to allow ministers to override the UK's Withdrawal Agreement.

    The government admitted this could have seen the UK breach international law, but argued it was needed to protect the integrity of the UK, as well as the Good Friday Agreement.

    In agreeing to remove law-breaking clauses in the Internal Market Bill, the UK Government has drawn a line under a controversial and - some critics say - damaging chapter in the Brexit negotiations

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/uk-to-ditch-international-law-breaking-clauses-of-brexit-legislation-after-reaching-deal-with-eu/ar-BB1bJAqH?ocid=msedgntp
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
    The idea of ‘sovereignty’ is nonsense – let’s give up the obsession and break the Brexit deadlock




    One of the more baffling features of the negotiations between the EU and the UK is that negotiators from countries which long-prided themselves on their practical, worldly, ability to compromise and strike deals have become so preoccupied with abstract, almost religious, principles.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/other/the-idea-of-sovereignty-is-nonsense-let-s-give-up-the-obsession-and-break-the-brexit-deadlock/ar-BB1bJIzy?ocid=msedgntp
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
    Brexiteer Ratcliffe's Ineos drops Wales for France to build new car


    LONDON (Reuters) - Billionaire Jim Ratcliffe's Ineos will manufacture its first car in France after a deal to take over a site run by Germany's Daimler, ditching plans to build a factory in Britain as COVID-19 disrupts the automotive industry.



    Prominent Brexit supporter Ratcliffe's petrochemicals company said in September 2019 it would build the Grenadier off-roader in Wales, creating up to 500 jobs, with a new plant in Portugal supplying the body and chassis.

    On Tuesday, Ineos confirmed it would take over Hambach, a Daimler facility close to the border with Germany.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/brexiteer-ratcliffe-s-ineos-drops-wales-for-france-to-build-new-car/ar-BB1bJZuM?ocid=msedgntp
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
    Cleverly trots out oven-ready nonsense as No 10 enters Brexit panic mode



    You can sometimes tell how much of a state No 10 is in by its choice of minister for the morning media rounds. And sending out the junior Foreign Office minister James Cleverly – living proof of the fallibility of nominative determinism – rather proved that Downing Street was in full panic mode over the progress of its Brexit trade talks. At a time like this, only a minister too dim to sense the danger he was in would do. Cleverly may have his talents, but the only one that he doesn’t keep hidden – apart from to himself; in his own world he is one of life’s winners – is his inability not to make a bad situation worse.

    It was unfortunate enough for him to claim that there were “plans to get the coronavirus vaccine into the UK in the event of a no-deal Brexit”, just that he couldn’t say what they were, as no one had trusted him with the details. That at least did ring half-true – in a desperate situation, Cleverly is one of the last people you would keep in the loop – but the look of confusion on his face rather suggested that no such details yet existed.

    Worse was to follow, as Cleverly went for the hat-trick on Sky, ITV and the BBC by insisting that Boris Johnson hadn’t lied when he talked about an “oven-ready” deal, because all that he had promised was a withdrawal agreement that was oven-ready. To no great surprise, James got thoroughly rinsed by Kay Burley, Piers Morgan, Susanna Reid and Dan Walker. There can’t have been a conscious being in the whole of the UK – even Boris, who can usually manage to believe his own fibs – who thought that “oven-ready” only applied to the withdrawal agreement.

    Especially not those who had bothered to read the paragraph in the Conservative 2019 election manifesto that said the Tories were the only party with a deal signed, sealed and ready that put the country on a path to a new trade agreement with the EU based on free trade and friendly cooperation. If the new government line that Cleverly had been sent out to defend is to suggest that the public had either been too stupid to understand its message or had been conned, it’s not a great look. Cleverly merely shrugged and repeated his nonsense over and over again. When in doubt, keep digging.

    Not quite so useless was the paymaster general, Penny Mordaunt, stepping in for Michael Gove, who was holed up in Brussels, to answer an urgent question from Labour’s shadow chancellor of the duchy of Lancaster, Rachel Reeves, on the state of the ongoing Brexit negotiations. But only because she made no pretence of knowing anything about anything. Rather, she sounded like a presenter on a 24-hour news channel trying to fill dead air by reading out the same headlines over and over again, telling nobody anything that they didn’t know already. The talks were at a critical stage. She couldn’t say how they were progressing. The sticking points were the level playing field, fishing and governance. And that was about it. Thanks for that, Penny.

    Reeves sounded rather nonplussed, as if she had expected something a little more detailed from a government minister. She raised the issue of GDP falling by a further 2% with a no-deal Brexit than it already would with a bad deal; she wondered how many of the 50,000 new customs officials had been recruited and trained, and she referenced Cleverly’s inspired new take on the semiotics of “oven-ready” and suggested the deal must have got sent to the wrong address, before sitting down with a sense of impending futility.

    As well she might, because Mordaunt yet again pleaded ignorance. Please don’t ask difficult questions, she begged, because they were all well above her pay grade. And seemingly above everyone else’s in government. Penny felt everyone’s pain, not least her own. Normally quite composed at the dispatch box, she seemed on the verge of a nervous breakdown. Unlike Cleverly, she has the self-awareness to realise when she’s out of her depth. And right now, she was drowning.

    What followed was an entirely predictable clash between the Tory Brexiters and the worried well on the opposition benches. Iain Duncan Smith, Bernard Jenkin and Liam Fox led the charge for the headbangers, insisting that the government had already delivered on its promises and that the talks going down to the wire were entirely the fault of untrustworthy Johnny Foreigner. Mordaunt agreed – “No retreat, baby, no surrender” – but you could pick up the reservation in her voice. She was buggered if she was going to be the one who had to break the news to them that the choices were either making the country broker still, or accepting a deal that would have most of them shouting, “Betrayal!”

    As for the opposition, Mordaunt had nothing to offer other than to suggest that businesses worried about going bankrupt should log on to the government website. Failing that, she had heard there were some vaguely useful webinars in which she herself had not bothered to participate. Perhaps she should, as she might learn something. Mordaunt had excelled herself at knowing nothing. The unbearable lightness of being as performance art.

    Suggesting that you won’t break international law after all – on a treaty you agreed less than a year ago – providing the EU agrees to your other demands on a free trade agreement doesn’t sound like the strongest negotiating tactic. A bit like promising to obey the Highway Code, so long as your car’s defects are overlooked during its MOT. But it was enough to render the debate on the Lords amendments to the internal market bill, which proposed to break the Northern Ireland protocol, almost anodyne. So much so that the government sent out Paul Scully, the most junior of junior ministers in the business department, to open the debate. To put this in perspective, the departmental cleaners are generally considered better informed.

    After Scully, a man not even known unto himself, had wittered on for 20 minutes, Ed Miliband had the opportunity to enjoy himself at his adversary’s expense. Though the shadow business secretary couldn’t help looking as if he knew his virtuoso display was wasted on such a low-rent opponent. Like shooting fish in a barrel. But never one to look a gift horse, Miliband pointed out that it wasn’t just the opposition who were
    queasy about breaking international law; it was almost every grandee within the Tory party. Scully wished he could make himself invisible. Which, in a sense, he already was
    .

    https://uk.news.yahoo.com/cleverly-trots-oven-ready-nonsense-204253505.html
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
    Brexit latest
    Brexit - and the prospects for a trade deal with Europe - is the other big story appearing on the front pages.

    The i newspaper calls Boris Johnson's trip to Brussels for talks with the EU Commission's president a "showdown on the future of the UK", while the Times says it is a "last ditch push" for a deal and that Mr Johnson faces "an uphill battle".

    "Don't buckle Boris" is the message for the prime minister from the Daily Mail. The paper says it does not desire a painful no deal - but the prime minister must not give in to unreasonable demands by the EU which, it says, refuses to accept that Britain wants unencumbered sovereignty.

    The Sun agrees, saying "Boris Johnson must not falter over Brexit".

    The Daily Express also says Britain must regain sovereignty - but that a failure to secure mutual prosperity because of EU intransigence would be a sickening disappointment.



    In the i newspaper, commentator John Rentoul predicts that the British side will have to make the main concessions - but that Mr Johnson will portray the outcome as a triumph.

    The Guardian suggests that Britain's relationship with Europe now hangs on the success of a three-course dinner between the prime minister and the European Commission president.

    The Telegraph claims the EU will have officials stationed in a permanent office in Northern Ireland from 1 January, as part of a deal to settle outstanding trade disputes.

    The paper calls this "a major concession that rang alarm bells with Brexiteers" and quotes the Democratic Unionist Party as saying the move is "unnecessary" and "concerning".

    Meanwhile, the Times also reports that a secret "nightmare scenario" unit has been set up at Downing Street to co-ordinate the response if a no-deal Brexit coincides with a massive spike in coronavirus and extreme winter weather such as flooding.

    The cell will provide daily briefings to the prime minister, the paper says, to avoid the government being "taken by surprise".

    And the Financial Times focuses on government plans to end punitive tariffs against the US over aircraft subsidies - paving the way for a post-Brexit trade deal with Washington.

    The paper says the decision will be seen as an attempt to win favour with the incoming president, Joe Biden.

    But, it believes, the UK is likely to face a struggle after Mr Biden said last week that he was in no rush to sign any new trade deals and would be prioritising domestic issues.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-the-papers-55240218
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
  • HAYSIEHAYSIE Member Posts: 35,517
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