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Can an old dog learn new tricks?

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  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    Sunday 24th November

    Played 25

    Won16

    Lost 9

    Split....

    £2.25 - Played 0, won 0, Lost 0

    £5.50 - Played 19, won 12, lost 7

    £11.00 - Played 6, won 4, Lost 2

    PROFIT/LOSS on Day
    £29.50

    REWARD POINTS = 155



    BANKROLL at close of Play = £482.39

    REWARD POINTS at close of play = 3,069

  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    November so far.....

    Played 452

    Won 267

    Lost 185

    Win-rate, November, 59.07%
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    Steady session yesterday, always nicely ahead of the count, so never under pressure.

    Not many £11 games going, but with the Cash Promo ongoing, plus the Super Roller & UKPC things, the DYM traffic was bound to be a little quieter than usual.
     
    For purely psychological, or "mind game" reasons, I break my games into batches of 5, "sets" if you like, each with 5 "legs", & I try to win each set.

    I won 4 of the 5 sets yesterday, 4-1, 4-1, 3-2, & 4-1.

    The fifth set, which was the third of the 5 that I played (games 11 - 15 inclusive) ....ugh, I lost that 4-1, including an £11-er. If I could just cut those bad periods out, it'd make such a difference.

    Been an odd week, last Sunday I reached my peak of £478, only to give £60 back the next day, then spent all week treading water. This weekend was perfect, then, as I made a profit of a shade under £70 on Saturday & Sunday combined, so am at £482, which is the all-time high under this Challenge. If history repeats itself, I'll give £60 back today. Help yourself guys, help yourself.....

    A nice little threshold was breached yesterday when I exceeded 3,000 Reward Points for the month to date, so my rate increased by 50%. What was £30 yesterday, is £45 today. How neat is that? Even Paul Daniels could not work magic like that. Asumionmg I get to, say, £509 in Reward Points money by the end of the month, that does not go in November's money, that's a sort of bonus in December. (October's was included in November - prudency ftw). £50 might not sound much, but as a % of the original £200, or even the current £482, that is a BIG %. My Dad used to save "Kensitas" Cigarette coupons, & as a young man, I was into Green Shield Stamps. No accounting for the human mind, eh?

    Some interesting visitors yesterday, Chicknmelt is becoming a proper regular, & I had a really lovely convo with Ice_Tiger, who seems a splendid individual, & very gracious.
     
    A good day then, but will it be the Monday downswing today?......   
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    Some interesting folds yesterday. This is not to chirp, but for those new to PLO8, especially migrants from NLH, you MUST learn to do these things, as alien as it may seem.

    Early Levels, all limp to my BB, I idly click "Check", I have no interest with my hand, & if in the Small, I'd have folded. I had 7-7-8-8, no suits. It is hard to imagine ANY worse PLO8 hand. 7's & 8's are KILLER cards, & we should generally bin hands which contain combos of them.

    Flop was 4-5-6, two hearts, so I have flopped the absolute nut high, & I have double blockers, too.
     
    But....I just cannot improve, & my hand is incredibly vulnerable.

    I don't have a (realistic) low, & I don't have hearts. 5 people are queued up behind me. It's an instant check-fold, even to a small bet. If we get VERY lucky, we might get half. Forget it, I'm not a buyer. 

    Later, I was in a very aggressive mode, & one or two were playing back at me. As a general rule, there are some hands I will never fold pre-flop, in "normal" situations. Re-Raise me & I'll re-raise back. See a flop, & if first to bet, I'll bet, or if checked to me, in it goes.

    But this was MOTHER......and MOTHER always has the goods.

    My hand? K-K-10-8, double suited. Straight in the muck, & MOTHER had dem Aces. She had A-A-10-10 in fact, so I was as crushed as a crushed thing.

    Most enjoyable, or satisfying game, was Game #2, just after I started. I can't recall how it happened, but I got coolered in Orbit 2 of Level one, & was left with.....235 chips, ugh.
     
    People panic in these spots, but I still have 12 Bigs, & 12 Bigs in PLO8 is HUGE. No, it really is VERY playable. Anyway, I ran good, found the right hands, callers, & Boards, at the right time, & ended up winning it. Wiiiii! That felt good. 

    Mr Angry (Junior) visited us for a while. "I only play great hands" he says, as he busts 2 players, AIPF (!) with the exotic Q-10-8-8 (what?!). But then he took a tumble or two, & exited in high dudgeon, & we all got a bit of abuse, especially me. I'll not expect a Crimble Card from him.     
  • chicknMeltchicknMelt Member Posts: 1,159
    edited November 2013
    Chicknmelt is becoming a proper regular  

    ...Yeah, I'm playing more than I thought I would - I think I enjoy PLO8 more than PLO, and I think these will be my default option when I'm running a bit low on MTT tables... 2 for 2 last night :D   

    AIPF Q-10-8-8 ...busts 2 people, then still goes out 4th. LOL! at least you aren't going to feel bad taking his money when he is such a bad loser!

    I came across someone yesterday that has won 40 out of their last 50 DYMs (NLH, PLO and PLO8). Abosolutely crazy record! wouldn't of believed it if i didnt see it with my own eyes!

  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can an old dog learn new tricks?:
    Chicknmelt is becoming a proper regular   ...Yeah, I'm playing more than I thought I would - I think I enjoy PLO8 more than PLO, and I think these will be my default option when I'm running a bit low on MTT tables... 2 for 2 last night :D    AIPF Q-10-8-8 ...busts 2 people, then still goes out 4th. LOL! at least you aren't going to feel bad taking his money when he is such a bad loser! I came across someone yesterday that has won 40 out of their last 50 DYMs (NLH, PLO and PLO8). Abosolutely crazy record! wouldn't of believed it if i didnt see it with my own eyes!
    Posted by chicknMelt
    I saw you were Regged in an £11er late last night (11pm?), I was Regged too, but I wanted to watch "Nordic Wild" properly, & I'd had a good day, so I un-regged. Nothing to do with being scared of you, obv.
     
    I have a peculiar weakness - well several, actually - but specifically, I'f I'm nicely ahead on the day, I'll happily quit late evening, rather than risk my profit, but if I'm behind, I tend to chase.

    Daft really, it's a numbers game. If I can win 60% of those I play (still to be proved, sample size etc) then the more I play the better, I should just play as many as I can.

    I did share some Tables with you yesterday, & you seem to have grasped it really well, especially as to THE most important part - DYM strategy. VERY different to MTT or cash strategy.
     
    40 out of 50 DYM's, 80%? Incred! Needs some serious run-good, but he must have a very good game, even so. Think we used to have a chap here, Irish Rover, who used to knock up some eye-watering runs in DYM's.

    I rarely get above 6 or 7, lol, but even at that number, I definitely feel the pressure, which changes my game.

    I've often had 6 straight losses, too....say no more.  
     
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can an old dog learn new tricks?:
    Morning Tikay.  Always enjoy your updates and its nice to see the good guys winning.  I always enjoy seeing TommyD, Ryan, Ross etc etc doing well as they are just nice people.  Do you think your view or attitude would change if you relied on the game to make an income? I am worried about the software, as I play for a living and can't get used to it.  I guess while I still have the option Im going to stick with the old mini view and what I know.  I think making a newer version just replicating the old version as best as possible would keep alot of us mass table grinders happy.  Just a suggestion. Enjoy the rest of your weekend!
    Posted by Donttelmum
    Afternoon Mr Mum. Sorry for delayed reply.

    Yes, definitely, if I were a Pro, my views would change, that's natural. But if I were a Pro, & I was not enjoying the beats & downswings ("enjoying" is the wrong word, but you get my drift) I'd snap quit. I've worked non-stop, bar a short break, for over 40 years, but I'd not stay in a job I did not enjoy. Of course we all have bad days at the Office, be daft to say otherwise, but you have to love your job, or life would be very tiresome.

    I am associated with another poker forum, which has all the Big Boys & High Rollers on it. Monday morning, after the Sunday "grind" (how I LOATHE that word in the poker context!), you would not believe all the angst, "ffs", "I HATE POKER", "I was so unlucky", "how could the idiot call?" sorta stuff, it is a sickening thing to see & read. Ugh. Some of these lads need a serious slap, the real world is out there & it is a tough gig for many people. Watch some Documentaries on how the other half live. Jeez, we are so blessed in Europe.

    You can't get used to the new software? Please try, I know it takes a while, & there are bound tio be a few souls overboard in unsettled seas, but the reality is.....they can't & won't revert to the old, no way. They may try to find some halfway house sort of thing, but it'll mainly be based on the new software. You just can't run an unlimited number of old systems & maintain them all, it just won't work. Imagine 10 years from now, they'd have to maintain & tweak 4 or 5 different platforms!

    I had a bit of a struggle at first, I'm very methodical with how I "organise" my 4 or 5 tables on my screen (lol, I'm old, leave me alone), but I've sussed it now, & it's much much better overall. Much faster, too, or it seems so to me, which helps a lot. There are still a few tweaks needed, but nothing 10 minutes with a big hammer won't fix.
     
    Hang in there, we need you!     
     
  • GELDYGELDY Member Posts: 5,203
    edited November 2013
    You are in a very happy slappy mood today teeks
    and there is nothing wrong with that imho
    which leads me on to my favourite anecdote on the topic
    Eamon Holmes on breakfast tv said of the pop star Rihanna
    a nice singer but if she was his daughter he would give her a good slap
    oops
    the next news story about her was that her boyfriend at the time had done just that
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can an old dog learn new tricks?:
    You are on a very happy slappy mood today teeks and there is nothing wrong with that imho which leads me on to my favourite anecdote on the topic Eamon Holmes on breakfast tv said of the pop star Rihanna a nice singer but if she was his daughter he would give her a good slap oops the next news story about her was that her boyfriend at the time had done just that
    Posted by GELDY
    Ahh, well that's just bad timing.
     
    I do have these odd days when I'm uncontrollably cheerful. I'll seek help.
  • chicknMeltchicknMelt Member Posts: 1,159
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can an old dog learn new tricks?:
    In Response to Re: Can an old dog learn new tricks? : I saw you were Regged in an £11er late last night (11pm?), I was Regged too, but I wanted to watch "Nordic Wild" properly, & I'd had a good day, so I un-regged. Nothing to do with being scared of you, obv.   I have a peculiar weakness - well several, actually - but specifically, I'f I'm nicely ahead on the day, I'll happily quit late evening, rather than risk my profit, but if I'm behind, I tend to chase. Daft really, it's a numbers game. If I can win 60% of those I play (still to be proved, sample size etc) then the more I play the better, I should just play as many as I can. I did share some Tables with you yesterday, & you seem to have grasped it really well, especially as to THE most important part - DYM strategy. VERY different to MTT or cash strategy.   40 out of 50 DYM's, 80%? Incred! Needs some serious run-good, but he must have a very good game, even so. Think we used to have a chap here, Irish Rover, who used to knock up some eye-watering runs in DYM's. I rarely get above 6 or 7, lol, but even at that number, I definitely feel the pressure, which changes my game. I've often had 6 straight losses, too....say no more.    
    Posted by Tikay10

    yeah I did wonder what had happened to you - i just thought "ah, he's old, probably needed an early night"

    Yeah, that probably is a weakness - I would think it should more be based on how good the games are... if they are tough and your winning then why not quit while your ahead, but if they are soft but your running bad, then play thorough it! 

    as for your loathing of the word GRIND... I think its actually quite an accurate description - playing X number of tables for hours on end with just a 5 minute break every hour (unless your also regged for DYMs, in which case you get none!). Of course, that doesn't mean we dont enjoy it, otherwise we wouldnt keep coming back for more! maybe a new word needs to be invented, that describes it as a bit "grindey", but also comes across as fun...

    I try not to complain too much in my diary, although I'm probably guilty at times. it can be difficult not to at times when your on a downswing.

  • alexis74alexis74 Member Posts: 5
    edited November 2013
    Reading through this I see that you might try PLO next month. Personally I hope you don"t , the impact you have made on our little PLO8 backwater is quite astonishing. A huge increase in games at all the levels and players from all over trying the game as well as a definite increase in standard - it's getting rarer to see people busting out in level one for example.

    Also although I have no interest in HH's normally it is fascinating when you muse about one or two interesting hands or situations from the night before.

    Anyway really enjoyed reading this, good luck whichever way you decide to go.

    PS New tables are fine.

  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    Hi guys,

    Thanks for the feedback & questions, will reply tomorrow, been a bit waylaid today, just back from a lonnnnnng drive up to Leeds & back.

    Will also Update Mondays numbers & results, nothing spectacular (except the sheer volume of traffic, especially @ £11), & the results were sort of usual schmusual. 

    Off to get some PLO8 DYM's in now, all are welcome!
     
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    Monday 25th November

    Played 25

    Won13

    Lost 12

    Split....

    £2.25 - Played 0, won 0, Lost 0

    £5.50 - Played 6, won 3, lost 3

    £11.00 - Played 19, won 10, Lost 9

    PROFIT/LOSS on Day
    £12.00

    REWARD POINTS = 220



    BANKROLL at close of Play = £470.39

    REWARD POINTS at close of play = 3,289

  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    Tuesday 26th November

    Played 13

    Won 9

    Lost 4

    Split....

    £2.25 - Played 0, won 0, Lost 0

    £5.50 - Played 4, won 4, lost 0

    £11.00 - Played 9, won 5, Lost 4

    PROFIT/LOSS on Day
    £19.00

    REWARD POINTS = 110



    BANKROLL at close of Play = £489.39

    REWARD POINTS at close of play = 3,399

  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    November so far.....

    Played 490

    Won 289

    Lost 201

    Win-rate, November, 58.98%
  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    Monday was incred!

    Never been so many PLO8 DYM's running, I played 19 @ £11, & I missed several.

    The Tables were a bit tougher, though, inevitably, & all the Big Boys were out in force.

    I did not have the best of times ealy doors, kept getting coolered or quartered, & actually bust three of them in Level One. Unheard of.

    I was pretty sure I'd done my conkers, but ran better at the end. Eventually, I edged the game count 13-12, but lost £12 in doing so. All things considered - I was deffo not on my A-Game - a bit of a result really.
     
    Got no less than 220 Reward Points though, & moved above the 3,000 threshold, so that increases my dividend by 50%. As of now, that's over £50, which will be wool on my back for December's numbers (not going to include it in November).

    Tuesday, well I had to drive up to Leeds & back from London, left home @ 04.45, so I was pretty tired, & decided on a short session. Went pretty good really, won the Game Count 9-4, & made a profit of £19, so recovered Monday's slight setback.

    Lovely atmo on the Tables last night, plenty of banter & rubs. Nothing beats "fun poker" with a bunch of like-minded people.  

    Only 3 sessions left for me in November, as I've got the Show tomorrow night, with Jules Sowas, & earlier, I've been lucky to be invited to The Sir Peter O'Sullevan Award Lunch, for their annual do. Last year they honoured Sir Hency Cecil, God bless him, & Joanna Lumley gave a speech. Be interested to see who they Honour this year. I'm sharing a Table with David Pipe, & Lord Grumpy.  

    It's at The Dorchester Hotel in London, VERY posh, got 5 Restaurants & everything. Very interesting building, too, of which Wikipidea notes.....

    Some 40,000 tonnes of earth were excavated to make room for the hotel's extensive basement which is one-third of the size of the hotel above the surface. The upper eight floors were erected in just 10 weeks, supported on a massive 3 feet (0.91 m) thick reinforced concrete deck that forms the roof of the first floor.

    How fascinating! Might take some photos of the building, I know you'd love that. Concrete facade, too, oooh.
     

  • Tikay10Tikay10 Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 172,170
    edited November 2013

    I got myself in a nasty corner with "footsie" last night. First, you gotta respect this guy, his game, as to technical side, is pretty good. (Understatement ftw).

    I had nut clubs & a bad low, & turned the nut flush, BOOM. I potted, he flatted. Good man, in you come.

    The river paired the turned deuce. Ugh.
     
    I Pot, he REPOTS.
     
    What to do? As played, he MUST have nut nut here, & easily so if he was playing A-2-3 combos. I grimaced, & eventually found a reluctant fold. He then came across to another of my Tables & asked "nut flush there T?". Yes yes. "I rivered the boat with the nut low" he tyops. Oooh, what an escape.

    On Monday, v the Argonaut, I busted in Level one, when the flop came A-K-2, & I had top two & an emergency low. He can't POSSIBLY have A-A-x-x here, as played, that'd be the case Ace which flopped. He did. Outrageous. 

    One very odd & frustrating game last night, when 4 of us remained, one of whom had a monster stack. I was middling, but OK, & Amarie & Argonaut were both on life-support stacks. In fact, I'd quartered the Argonaut earlier in a cooler spot for him, very rare to prise any chips from him. He just sat quietly though, biding his time, & was still hanging in with 4 left. He is VERY good. 

    Anyway, with 4 left, this Monster Stack kept LIMPING into every pot, even with the Blinds pretty big. And first doubled up Argonaut, (NEVER a good thing) & then doubled Amarie. Yikes, I might have to sit back in & play again. 

    With experienced players, in spots like this, they never "make up" the Small. So Argonaut was mostly folding to me from the Small, & I was (mostly) folding to MOTHER from my Small. Without exception, we folded, or Raised -NEVER limped. But Mr Monster limped into EVERY hand, ugh. It was making life really difficult.
     
    I was down to fumes eventually, but AMARIE got very unlucky, & exited, what a (bittersweeet) relief.

    In these spots, it feels quite frustrating when someone keeps limping in & doubling up the others, but they are entitled to, & after all, we should not rely on others to do our work for us. I openly admit, if I have plenty of chips, 4 handed, I sort of "hide", & let the others do the work.

    Lazy so & so, me.     
      
  • GELDYGELDY Member Posts: 5,203
    edited November 2013
    Really enjoyed the games this week Tikay
    And yes an old dog can learn new tricks
    With help from this diary

    prior to this week I had been a losing hilo dym player played 5 won 2 loss £13
    but thanks to this diary I have improved this week played 13 won 10 profit £53 roi 43%
    have to mention it now because I know it cannot last
  • VespaPXVespaPX Member Posts: 12,463
    edited November 2013
    Hi TK

    Any tips for playing a PLO8 MTT please?

    Cheers
    Mick
  • DOHHHHHHHDOHHHHHHH Member Posts: 17,929
    edited November 2013
    In Response to Re: Can an old dog learn new tricks?:
    Hello Guy`s Been a bit of a rollercoaster in the Last few DYMs sessions ..... I could smell a change on the horizon for a downturn. You really can tell a downswing if you look deep , before it really Kicks in and take the action needed. The hole cards , flop , and especially the river killer`s will give you the clues needed to take action. In my last few sessions ....I have still made profit, But I know if I had taken no action...Then I would defiantly of bled. So I must adjust my game adoringly which has helped stem the downswing....... The past few sessions have been a grind with some Nit play. We cannot expect our hands to hold all the time so we must adjust our style to suit, until we are confident that the cards , flop and especially that river!! Hold....We must tread carefully at these crucial times and stealth really is the Key. I have seen a Fantastic!  influx of new players entering the PLO DYMs and must commend T on this upward swing and revival to this Beautiful game. Hopefully many more will share their experiences in this Excellent thread (Jason you hear me) as this will only help the new and in turn  freshen up the whole PLO8 scene. T..... roll on the Monkey!  for this calendar month....100% you gonna bust through Sir. Best Regards
    Posted by footsie66
    Are you saying you have some kind of sixth sense, where you know taking a non-optimal line in the hand will be best as you somehow 'know' or 'feel' the deck is going to punish the optimal play on this occasion??? 

    Surely every hand is different, and although everyone has periods of good or bad luck there is no way of knowing how lucky or unlucky you are going to be before each individual hand/card is dealt??? So all we can do is make the best possible decision which will reward us the most long term?

    Unless you can predict the rng ;)

    I know some people watch what cards are coming out on the flop a lot on a specific table, so if a lot of diamonds are flopping they'll try and see flops with suited diamond hands, or if a lot 6's are flopping they'll call with any 6x hand.

    Obviously nonsense, but amusing! :)
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