Hi. Hand 1 with the dynamic you describe then I'm 100% squeezing here pre. You easily have the best hand here a lot so get it HU. As played I like a small turn lead. Can get your opponent to jam over sensing weakness and it can confuse your opponent and getting river value. Hand 2 is totally player dependant. Once we call turn then we have to call this river, looks too bluffy. But I would defo be making a note of what he 3 bet pre with! Posted by CraigSG1
Thanks for the feedback both.
I'm always a bit 'meh' about 4 betting JJ here. vs the 3 bettor I fold worse / have to 4-bet fold if they shove, not sure how much they will call a 4b with. And I likely get called by the original raiser who loves to see a flop and then feel spew if/when I see over cards and am oop to a lively player (albeit you kinda have to call down most boards in that spot).
Leading turn does make a lot of sense though. I think I need to do that more with value and bluff hands given the propensity of players (myself included) to be one-and-done on somewhere around 2/3 of flops.
Hand 1 - my bad. I wrote that from my iphone so completely missed the 3 bet - i thought it was a call by button! So yea, calling here is best for reasons you describe. I would sometime four bet, but that would depend on how BU had been playing his last few hands (tilted/over agg/you folded to an allin few hands ago etc).
Same thing about turn lead though. Betting small is good for like i said - it confuses them and you can get an extra st of value off his worse hands and he can jam thinking your weak. But I also meant to add that by doing this against a reg you can do it in other hands as a cheap bluff as he could put you on a set/v strong hand.
I'm really confused; I've read, double and triple read hand 1 and for the life of me I can't see where the 3b is? It's just a SR pot, so I think 3b to iso is fine. We can flat too because 3b/GII or 3b/fold don't seem too appealing; sort of depends on your image at the table though and if you've been squeezing light or not.
Anyway, flat flop is fine; if villain has a cooler hand then there aren't any turn cards that should slow down the action. I'd also consider leading turn but it's tricky to balance in the first place given your flop line looks pretty strong anyway. Checking is fine too. River I dunno - you already look strong as it is given how you played flop so I'm not sure an overbet is going to help convince villain into a call. I mean what bluffs would you play like this? Are you flatting T9 to flop raise?
2nd hand is WP... open is a bit loose when you have an aggro 3b but it's not terrible. I'm prob folding 22-44 tho. Turn is obv a call and river given his sizing I'm happy to call. He's repping like 8x going for thin value since I don't see this villain checking 9x otf. Or he slow played a set. Either way both pretty unlikely and he can have a ton of picked up FD OTT that bricked river.
Oh my days! I was right the first time - I glanced the post flop action. Back to my original thought to 100% 3 bet pre.
At 10nl we get tonnes of value from the weak utg player and taking JJ multiway OOP we are basically set mining which I think is too weak with Jacks. My personal opinion. No-one else has us beat so that only leaves UTG with the strongest range but as you have said he is weak player playing 100% of hands he is so unlikely to have us beat and as Ive seen loads before can easily overplay/bluff so many hands allin.
Ha ha my bad, am obviously out of practice at reading back over hand histories.
Back to poker school for me
JJ remains a hand I play terribly.
Follow up Q - does it still warrant a 3b when you know that you'll never get folds and will then be facing two people OOP, in an inflated pot, where (if my basic math is accurate) at least one overcard will hit the flop 3/4 of the time.
IP this isn't an issue, I can control the pot far easier, but if I'm getting no fold equity pre, is a more passive line a better option?
Obviously only posting because Forest have fluked back to back victories in the past week. Probably go back in to hibernation after Boro smash us at the weekend. At least we've managed to stay above Derby for another week...
Still be amazed if we do anything but avoid relegation, but on the face of things it looks like we pulled several rabbits out of hats on deadline day to ease the pain of having to cash in on Antonio.
Hopefully back at the pokers more as I slowly become accustomed to managing a team twice the size I used to at work. That's what I blame on having mind melt when it comes to try and focus on cards later in the evenings!
This hand made me 'WTF!' out loud last night. Folding for 8p in a £36 pot, good lesson to always shove your whole stack and not try and get funky when you are there to gamble (ps I know my play is poor... Mrs Duck's fault)
Player
Action
Cards
Amount
Pot
Balance
win
Small blind
£0.10
£0.10
£90.26
x
Big blind
£0.20
£0.30
£15.09
Your hole cards
2
2
x
Call
£0.20
£0.50
£7.32
WTF
Raise
£0.90
£1.40
£16.08
x
Call
£0.90
£2.30
£24.11
shakinaces
Call
£0.90
£3.20
£19.10
WIN
Raise
£4.80
£8.00
£85.46
x
Fold
x
Fold
WTF
Raise
£16.00
£24.00
£0.08
x
Fold
shakinaces
Fold
WIN
Call
£12.00
£36.00
£73.46
Flop
10
10
6
WIN
Bet
£0.20
£36.20
£73.26
Noooooo
Fold
WIN
Muck
WIN
Win
£34.20
£107.46
WIN
Return
£0.20
£1.80
£107.66
Also made me WTF when some guy came and started trolling someone at our tables over their negative sharkscope. I know it goes on, but not seen it before. Was also surprised as the player subject to the taunts I've got tagged as a decent tight reg (having only played them at cash) who must be a winning player at the cash tables.
Very impressed with their dignity in response to such troll though. If all people reacted that way to being goaded the world would be a much better place. Class in the face of idiocy until troll scampers off into hiding again.
Final WTF was my own ability now I've spent a week or so playing NL20-NL40 games.
I am SOOOOO far behind the likes of Liamboi, Th1nkerman, Acegooner and the other better players at that level it's unreal lol. Am somehow scraping a few quid here and there (hands up - I am entirely bumhunting) but bit lost as to where to even start studying to try and lift my own game up to the next level.
Table selection and run good remain my biggest skills for the forseeable!
That fold reminds me of my time playing FL back in the day.
I was on a European site with plenty of scandinavians. The standard play if they had any sort of draw would be to raise/reraise all the way up to the limit each street. So when I realised they always folded to a river bet if they missed - it made for some cheap and effective river bluffs, firstly when I too had missed a draw and then I started trying it just repping 2pair/set and carrying on if no draws came in.
I think I carried the concept of river bluffing into my nl game and it doesn't seem to work as well.
PS isnt table selection key to making money for everyone?
I can remember playing over a decade ago where you could shove AA pre-flop and guarantee to get at least 1 caller, normally with utter guff. Was great for getting max value out of any hands. Some may say that I should play low stakes BH games if I want to have a nostalgic revisiting of that period of online poker
WTF moment of the day - Championship football on a Thursday evening?? World has gone mad.
I bet neutral football fans are signing up to Sky Sports in droves just so that they can be entertained by Huddersfield v Forest on a warm autumnal evening
Although, speaking of 'utter guff', this hand came up just as I was about to give up for the evening yesterday, always a nice bonus to bink when the 'sit out next BB' button is ticked.
Had a confused look on my face when cards flipped over, am too fishy to fold a RF draw but figured to be against Kx Tx or a middle pair... took a while to realise that I didn't even need to hit
I take back my moan about Thursday night football temporarily. Still a stupid decision, but having zero phone signal all weekend while traipsing around in the middle of the Lake District made me appreciate that I was able to watch the Forest game before we set off.
Hate motorway now instead. Should have been way less than 5 hours trip, took over 9.
And get to do most of it again at an even busier time this Friday in order to get to the Outlaws poker game. Awesome.
Is there some way that we can just concertina up most of the midlands and shrink the country a bit? Love the Lakes, would be ace to be able to visit more frequently. Can't quite get the same outdoor experience in Swindon...
Need to bink super big. Buy a helicopter.
Don't think that will happen from nl20-nl40 cash though, even if I do keep running God like as I have recently. May need to try and spend some time getting my head around tournies for a change.
Ha cheers Phantom and thanks to you (and the other noisy rabble) for the railing in the later stages.
Didn't think that DTD2 game was ever going to end, never see a game run for so long with such shallow stacks.
Me winning the thing overall reminds me of the old tale about giving an infinite amount of monkeys typewriters and its guaranteed one of them will write the entire works of Shakespeare with their random button bashing. Can't imagine it'll ever be replicated, but always nice to contribute some points to the Outlaws.
Quality to see so many other team-members in the points as well. Fingers crossed we can bink a monthly win one day and break the grip of the pink mob
I take back my moan about Thursday night football temporarily. Still a stupid decision, but having zero phone signal all weekend while traipsing around in the middle of the Lake District made me appreciate that I was able to watch the Forest game before we set off. Hate motorway now instead. Should have been way less than 5 hours trip, took over 9. And get to do most of it again at an even busier time this Friday in order to get to the Outlaws poker game. Awesome. Is there some way that we can just concertina up most of the midlands and shrink the country a bit? Love the Lakes, would be ace to be able to visit more frequently. Can't quite get the same outdoor experience in Swindon... Need to bink super big. Buy a helicopter. Don't think that will happen from nl20-nl40 cash though, even if I do keep running God like as I have recently. May need to try and spend some time getting my head around tournies for a change. Posted by shakinaces
In Response to Re: Further misadventures of a fish at the cash tables : Someone has to carry my shoes!!! WD on the bink too. Posted by samantha25
I thought Harry had that responsibility now, normally first to grab for them so that he can totter round in your heels and not look quite so tiny next to Giant.
Comments
I'm always a bit 'meh' about 4 betting JJ here. vs the 3 bettor I fold worse / have to 4-bet fold if they shove, not sure how much they will call a 4b with. And I likely get called by the original raiser who loves to see a flop and then feel spew if/when I see over cards and am oop to a lively player (albeit you kinda have to call down most boards in that spot).
Leading turn does make a lot of sense though. I think I need to do that more with value and bluff hands given the propensity of players (myself included) to be one-and-done on somewhere around 2/3 of flops.
Back to poker school for me
JJ remains a hand I play terribly.
Follow up Q - does it still warrant a 3b when you know that you'll never get folds and will then be facing two people OOP, in an inflated pot, where (if my basic math is accurate) at least one overcard will hit the flop 3/4 of the time.
IP this isn't an issue, I can control the pot far easier, but if I'm getting no fold equity pre, is a more passive line a better option?
Obviously only posting because Forest have fluked back to back victories in the past week. Probably go back in to hibernation after Boro smash us at the weekend. At least we've managed to stay above Derby for another week...
Still be amazed if we do anything but avoid relegation, but on the face of things it looks like we pulled several rabbits out of hats on deadline day to ease the pain of having to cash in on Antonio.
Hopefully back at the pokers more as I slowly become accustomed to managing a team twice the size I used to at work. That's what I blame on having mind melt when it comes to try and focus on cards later in the evenings!
Very impressed with their dignity in response to such troll though. If all people reacted that way to being goaded the world would be a much better place. Class in the face of idiocy until troll scampers off into hiding again.
Final WTF was my own ability now I've spent a week or so playing NL20-NL40 games.
I am SOOOOO far behind the likes of Liamboi, Th1nkerman, Acegooner and the other better players at that level it's unreal lol. Am somehow scraping a few quid here and there (hands up - I am entirely bumhunting) but bit lost as to where to even start studying to try and lift my own game up to the next level.
Table selection and run good remain my biggest skills for the forseeable!
I can remember playing over a decade ago where you could shove AA pre-flop and guarantee to get at least 1 caller, normally with utter guff. Was great for getting max value out of any hands. Some may say that I should play low stakes BH games if I want to have a nostalgic revisiting of that period of online poker
WTF moment of the day - Championship football on a Thursday evening?? World has gone mad.
I bet neutral football fans are signing up to Sky Sports in droves just so that they can be entertained by Huddersfield v Forest on a warm autumnal evening
Although, speaking of 'utter guff', this hand came up just as I was about to give up for the evening yesterday, always a nice bonus to bink when the 'sit out next BB' button is ticked.
Had a confused look on my face when cards flipped over, am too fishy to fold a RF draw but figured to be against Kx Tx or a middle pair... took a while to realise that I didn't even need to hit
Would of been a sickener had turn been a brick with the 8 on the river. definate wtf ; )
Hate motorway now instead. Should have been way less than 5 hours trip, took over 9.
And get to do most of it again at an even busier time this Friday in order to get to the Outlaws poker game. Awesome.
Is there some way that we can just concertina up most of the midlands and shrink the country a bit? Love the Lakes, would be ace to be able to visit more frequently. Can't quite get the same outdoor experience in Swindon...
Need to bink super big. Buy a helicopter.
Don't think that will happen from nl20-nl40 cash though, even if I do keep running God like as I have recently. May need to try and spend some time getting my head around tournies for a change.
Didn't think that DTD2 game was ever going to end, never see a game run for so long with such shallow stacks.
Me winning the thing overall reminds me of the old tale about giving an infinite amount of monkeys typewriters and its guaranteed one of them will write the entire works of Shakespeare with their random button bashing. Can't imagine it'll ever be replicated, but always nice to contribute some points to the Outlaws.
Quality to see so many other team-members in the points as well. Fingers crossed we can bink a monthly win one day and break the grip of the pink mob