Regarding stalling on the bubble, a 'friend of mine' who shamefully plays on another site has noticed that timebank stalling starts pre-bubble, before the hand for hand play starts.
See "Parkinson's Law". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson%27s_law In brief, if you give people more time to complete a task (or space, or whatever) you can be sure they will use it. Posted by Tikay10
A timebank is a reserve amount of time you have to spread across multiple decisions, so I'm not sure how much this would apply - people dont want to use their timebank up incase they need it later. As an example, I would say that I reach the final stages of tournaments with most or all of my timebank far more often than i do with none or a small amount left, because I want to save it for the really big important decisions as much as possible.
Regarding stalling on the bubble, a 'friend of mine' who shamefully plays on another site has noticed that timebank stalling starts pre-bubble, before the hand for hand play starts. Posted by Benchmark
yes, this would happen. its annoying. so is hand for hand. In my opinion its a small price to pay for a bit of breathing room in the other 95% of the tournament
I find playing online poker a nice relaxing interlude to my evening and as I said earlier make my desicions rightly or wrongly in probably the first 2 seconds of play, I do play 3 or 4 tournaments at a time and if timebanks were introduced and used on every table I play ( Which may happen ) I would probably get bored with the gameplay. I may have a short attention span or just like the way things are and am too old for change. I am not a serious player like some are and can understand their points on timebanks for big decisions. I play small stakes so decisions to me are sort of ok if win, ok if I lose- Maybe I am not cut out for the nuances of the game and will never be a big winner or loser so I hope you can see where I am coming from and my previous post doesnt seem as bizzare. Posted by tomgoodun
Just because you hold a different view - one shared by the majority, I suspect - does not make it "bizarre" Tom.
Tolerance to the views of others will get us all to the right place sooner.
In Response to Re: Timebank argument : A timebank is a reserve amount of time you have to spread across multiple decisions, so I'm not sure how much this would apply - people dont want to use their timebank up incase they need it later. As an example, I would say that I reach the final stages of tournaments with most or all of my timebank far more often than i do with none or a small amount left, because I want to save it for the really big important decisions as much as possible. Posted by chicknMelt
wassup melty,
Yes, I do know what a timebank is!
My mention of Parkinson's Law was an attempt to lighten the mood of the debate, & introduce a little levity, as I sensed the thread was descending into cynicism, rudeness & sarcasm.
Clearly, it was a fail, on my part, as it continued in the same vein.
I'm really not sure why it is not possible for grown-ups to be able to debate such things in a calm & civil manner, & without resorting to belittling others. We win debates by winning hearts & minds, not be belittling those who do not agree.
I had high hopes for the thread yesterday, & plenty of similar such threads in the future. Now, not so much.
Never mind, faint heart never won fair lady, whatever that means.
I asked Danny (ItsOver4U) to start this thread, so that a good debate could ensue, & then, once complete, I'd send it upstairs. In turn, they have promised to try & give us clear decisions, as far as they are able, so we all know where we stand.
The plan was to have such debates, about different subjects, every week, & really make this Forum a better & more useful place.
For these to succeed, some tolerance & attempts at understanding the views of others is necessary.
Hi Mr Melt, thanks for your feedback. You have some valid points which make perfect sense to me.
I may have had a bit of a knee jerk reaction to the Op, based on my lifestyle. When I play the DTD games on Monday for instance and if I am fortunate enough to go deep in them it can go on til almost midnight, and I get up at 5.30am for work, and I have to visit the bathroom at least twice a night so I feel rather wiped out in the morning, if you have any advice to alleviate this I would be most grateful - nope the wife won't tolerate a chamber pot
Btw thanks to sky's splendid give aways on the rewards free rolls I am in the super roller tomorrow, so fill your boots if I am on your table good luck.
It would be good to clarify whether the suggestion is all games have timebank or whether only certain games, say main/mini/£55bh would have the timebank. My only issue is when MTTs get near the money and players stall (its bad enough as it is in tournaments like the roller) but apart from that timebanks would be a good idea.
No idea on what the line would be in cash games for when the timebanks would be added. Cant see a need in DYMs for a timebank.
While it is great to discuss this, it all boils down to have feasible it is to add it in. If it is not simple to add then it should be a non starter.
It would be good to clarify whether the suggestion is all games have timebank or whether only certain games, say main/mini/£55bh would have the timebank. My only issue is when MTTs get near the money and players stall (its bad enough as it is in tournaments like the roller) but apart from that timebanks would be a good idea. No idea on what the line would be in cash games for when the timebanks would be added. Cant see a need in DYMs for a timebank. While it is great to discuss this, it all boils down to have feasible it is to add it in. If it is not simple to add then it should be a non starter. Posted by MattBates
THIS.
When the debate has run it's course, I'll send it Upstairs, & if they say it's not something they can reasonably do within, say, x months, or justify the development resource, then I'll tell everyone accordingly.
It can't be a bad thing for them to know what the players think, though, to assist them in their decision making.
I think one of the benefits of a small timebank will be a help to those who suffer disconnections. The Sky Download in particular is very sensitive to minute fluctuations in wireless broadband signal.
The other point I'd like to make is that if it is going to be implemented in a particular format, is that it must be implemented at all levels in that format. Giving facilities to those who play higher stakes while denying the same to those of us with more modest ambitions should not be a starter.
I think one of the benefits of a small timebank will be a help to those who suffer disconnections. The Sky Download in particular is very sensitive to minute fluctuations in wireless broadband signal. The other point I'd like to make is that if it is going to be implemented in a particular format, is that it must be implemented at all levels in that format. Giving facilities to those who play higher stakes while denying the same to those of us with more modest ambitions should not be a starter. Posted by FCHD
From the (admittedly very limited) feedback it seemed as thought it was not welcome at all levels so thats why I suggested it was just included in certain games.
When Ive played with timebanks on other sites, and you get a few tables where people use up their timebank to pretend they are thinking it creates a unsavory atmosphere.
If I run out of times at the tables, im either not focused or im playing too many tables.
Hi Mr Melt, thanks for your feedback. You have some valid points which make perfect sense to me. I may have had a bit of a knee jerk reaction to the Op, based on my lifestyle. When I play the DTD games on Monday for instance and if I am fortunate enough to go deep in them it can go on til almost midnight, and I get up at 5.30am for work, and I have to visit the bathroom at least twice a night so I feel rather wiped out in the morning, if you have any advice to alleviate this I would be most grateful - nope the wife won't tolerate a chamber pot Btw thanks to sky's splendid give aways on the rewards free rolls I am in the super roller tomorrow, so fill your boots if I am on your table good luck. Posted by tomgoodun
This I understand much better.... in the grand scheme of things though I think and extra minute per hour would make minimal difference and would certainly not be worth quitting this fabulous game over
When Ive played with timebanks on other sites, and you get a few tables where people use up their timebank to pretend they are thinking it creates a unsavory atmosphere. If I run out of times at the tables, im either not focused or im playing too many tables. Leave alone is my vote. Posted by mumsie
Yes but most sites have a 1 minute tieback which is very very different from what is suggested.... in my oppinion the benefits far outway the cons
Yeah I can understand being against big timebanks but just 10 seconds would have virtually no impact on the gameplay.
I mean, assume you don't want them, don't need them so won't use them etc, but every other one of the 5 people on your table use every single second of their timebank, that's 50 seconds per hour. You get about 80 hands per hour online at 6max, so the average length of a hand increases by 0.6 seconds, and that's assuming 100% of players use 100% of their timebank 100% of the time... hardly worth quitting online poker over.
Seems like a no brainer when it benefits some, and adversely affects no-one. But as Mr Bates said, it all cmoes down to how easy it is for Sky to actually implement it.
Trying to alter someone's opinion by stating mathematical "facts" sometimes makes the recipient dig there heels in further, it can be proved by maths that 1 plus 1 doesn't equal 2
Having given thought rather than basing my opinion on selfish lifestyle reasons I can see the benefit of an extra few seconds for the higher stakes players, I am not convinced however for the lower stakes like myself but I am just one voice of many and will try out if implemented, if it does have a detrimental effect on me I will have to alter my game, maybe just go to bed at a reasonable hour and let folk steal my blinds.
Trying to alter someone's opinion by stating mathematical "facts" sometimes makes the recipient dig there heels in further, it can be proved by maths that 1 plus 1 doesn't equal 2 Having given thought rather than basing my opinion on selfish lifestyle reasons I can see the benefit of an extra few seconds for the higher stakes players, I am not convinced however for the lower stakes like myself but I am just one voice of many and will try out if implemented, if it does have a detrimental effect on me I will have to alter my game, maybe just go to bed at a reasonable hour and let folk steal my blinds. Posted by tomgoodun
Your mathematical facts comment made me think of this.
Kent Brockman: Mr. Simpson, how do you respond to the charges that petty vandalism such as graffiti is down eighty percent, while heavy sack beatings are up a shocking nine hundred percent?
Homer Simpson: Aw, you can come up with statistics to prove anything, Kent. Forty percent of all people know that.
If 10 seconds has no impact on gameplay what's the point bringing it in?
The overwhelming majority of players will still play the same number of tables as they do now (one table in most cases) whether there's time bank available or not. Therefore any increase in available decision time will equate to fewer hands being played.
Are Sky Poker really going to be inclined to spend a load of money developing a new feature that will in all likelihood lead to a slight reduction in rake collected? I think not.
If 10 seconds has no impact on gameplay what's the point bringing it in? The overwhelming majority of players will still play the same number of tables as they do now (one table in most cases) whether there's time bank available or not. Therefore any increase in available decision time will equate to fewer hands being played. Are Sky Poker really going to be inclined to spend a load of money developing a new feature that will in all likelihood lead to a slight reduction in rake collected? I think not. Posted by GaryQQQ
What about the additional players that would play on the site if there was timebanks available?
The additional tables players could play given timebanks?
Comments
Tolerance to the views of others will get us all to the right place sooner.
Yes, I do know what a timebank is!
My mention of Parkinson's Law was an attempt to lighten the mood of the debate, & introduce a little levity, as I sensed the thread was descending into cynicism, rudeness & sarcasm.
Clearly, it was a fail, on my part, as it continued in the same vein.
I'm really not sure why it is not possible for grown-ups to be able to debate such things in a calm & civil manner, & without resorting to belittling others. We win debates by winning hearts & minds, not be belittling those who do not agree.
I had high hopes for the thread yesterday, & plenty of similar such threads in the future. Now, not so much.
Never mind, faint heart never won fair lady, whatever that means.
Just so everyone knows....
I asked Danny (ItsOver4U) to start this thread, so that a good debate could ensue, & then, once complete, I'd send it upstairs. In turn, they have promised to try & give us clear decisions, as far as they are able, so we all know where we stand.
The plan was to have such debates, about different subjects, every week, & really make this Forum a better & more useful place.
For these to succeed, some tolerance & attempts at understanding the views of others is necessary.
Thanks.
When the debate has run it's course, I'll send it Upstairs, & if they say it's not something they can reasonably do within, say, x months, or justify the development resource, then I'll tell everyone accordingly.
It can't be a bad thing for them to know what the players think, though, to assist them in their decision making.
The other point I'd like to make is that if it is going to be implemented in a particular format, is that it must be implemented at all levels in that format. Giving facilities to those who play higher stakes while denying the same to those of us with more modest ambitions should not be a starter.
Kent Brockman: Mr. Simpson, how do you respond to the charges that petty vandalism such as graffiti is down eighty percent, while heavy sack beatings are up a shocking nine hundred percent?
Homer Simpson: Aw, you can come up with statistics to prove anything, Kent. Forty percent of all people know that.
The overwhelming majority of players will still play the same number of tables as they do now (one table in most cases) whether there's time bank available or not. Therefore any increase in available decision time will equate to fewer hands being played.
Are Sky Poker really going to be inclined to spend a load of money developing a new feature that will in all likelihood lead to a slight reduction in rake collected? I think not.