tbh, I know what you're getting at- but I think jacks just aren't strong enough to trap with, which seems to be what you're suggesting- they're extremely vulnerable postflop. With those reads, I know exactly what you're getting at, but I think you need QQ+ to be more confident in trapping, and then I'd agree wholeheartedly- in that spot, you want a full double up so I'm happy to flat preflop, check basically any flop and wait for the c-bet to fully commit my opponent before shoving on them. If I've then let them hit a set or 2 pair or something so be it, I'd still be happy to make the same move again in the future.
I think tens and jacks play so much better preflop than post though that you're much better off getting the decisions out of the way- I like the shove because I think enough hands will call us (raiser has 6k invested with 100k back, it'll cost him ~24k to call. Is he really folding A10/AJ/TT/99/KJ/KQ/AK/AQ there- all hands that we are either a slight favourite against or crushing? Set against that we have QQ/KK/AA that call and crush us. That's a massive range in our favour. Not only that, if he does have a dirty little hand like 67 or some such, we fold it out straight away and add 30% to our stack- that's never a bad thing with a hand like jacks.
If the board comes down AK3, can you really find a bet out of position with jacks? In position he probably can with 67, and can you really call that with jacks- knowing that any ace, any king and you're drawing virtually dead?
Those are my main reasons for just shoving and getting it over with- I think it's definitely a profitable move with what I'd perceive as his calling range. He may even call a fraction lighter than that and call with smaller pairs, which is even better.
deuces while I agree with most of what you say there, we are only 56% against that range, most villains prob call some smaller pairs though
Also 67 folding is a really bad thing imo when we are this shallow. AKx is prob the only flop I dont get it in on, but I definitely get it in on nearly every flop IF I decided to flat pre
I basically shove always here though, as I have no flatting range, he calls with worse, he may fold with KQ sometimes and we add a nice % to our stack if he folds. Also he goes broke pre with hands that fold on lots of flops. I'm more thinking aloud could it be more profitable to flat pre with intention of c/r nearly all flops
Like most I prefer a shove though, just to balance as I'll be shoving wide here so gotta shove my monsters (JJ is massive here)
If I haven't 3b shoved yet, I wouldn't rule out making it 13,921.89 to go then jamming almost every flop, especially if button is agro and capable of going bonkers.
He's probably really bad as I dnt recognise the name and he plays on sky, so you can get away with making plays which a decent player would see right through. He will flat rly rly rly wide, which wud make u feel sick if ur bluffing, but as we're so strong, we don't mind.
Just read the whole thread. Flatting is fine against this villain. Like most I prefer a shove though, just to balance as I'll be shoving wide here so gotta shove my monsters (JJ is massive here) If I haven't 3b shoved yet, I wouldn't rule out making it 13,921.89 to go then jamming almost every flop, especially if button is agro and capable of going bonkers. He's probably really bad as I dnt recognise the name and he plays on sky, so you can get away with making plays which a decent player would see right through. He will flat rly rly rly wide, which wud make u feel sick if ur bluffing, but as we're so strong, we don't mind. Shove pre though. Posted by DOHHHHHHH
thanks for the responce jj, as you all know im not the best (really bad) player so i dont really have that much experiance with late stage tourneys so didnt really know what line to take here, i think i was playing it as i would at the start of a tourney.
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Also 67 folding is a really bad thing imo when we are this shallow. AKx is prob the only flop I dont get it in on, but I definitely get it in on nearly every flop IF I decided to flat pre
I basically shove always here though, as I have no flatting range, he calls with worse, he may fold with KQ sometimes and we add a nice % to our stack if he folds. Also he goes broke pre with hands that fold on lots of flops. I'm more thinking aloud could it be more profitable to flat pre with intention of c/r nearly all flops