well if you insist 4) why not? 5) I would not play micro stakes regularly - save it for special occasions like DTDs, minis & the bankbusters PS saw a ****y music video while in the gym the other day. song wasn't very memorable either. the only thing that was was the name of the group, one that i had only ever heard of before on some poker thread - that's right - it was train. Quite happy to never hear of them again. Posted by GELDY
Thanks for the reply Geldy. Yes I understand you wouldn't play those tournaments, but do you think it's a good idea for those who do?
Thanks for the responses guys, I will reply directly to each and everyone either late tonight or tomorrow. I also have a PM from a well respected reg with some very good points to add to the debate. I need to get grinding right now but feel free anyone and everyone to add more while I'm donking my money off.
5) I like the idea of more rebuys, but I personally wouldn't be too fussed about it continually changing each night. Maybe a 7oclock £3.30 rebuy with a £1k guaratee would be ok just for a trial run, and the guarantee can be altered after the first few weeks. I think there should be a nightly £1.10 freezeout with like a £500 guarantee. It'd always make the guarantee and it'd be great for the micro players to turn a quid into like £90 or something.
4 yes as stops shove fests and wouldn't hurt anyone's strategy.
5. low level bh's areneeded through evening as with success these players will be tomorrows £11 entries. That's why pro teams have youth teams.....because one day it may pay off! Otherwiseyou may lose some traffic to other sites...Seems only sensible...
Regarding speed/turbo tournaments. I think it would be a good idea to run a number of these after 10.30pm at night. Especially in the £1.10 to £5.50 range and NOT rebuys. I used to really enjoy the £1.10 speed tournament at 10.35pm which regularly had 80 - 130 runners and a £100 guarantee. Sky in its infinite wisdom changed it to a rebuy which cut the number of runners to 50ish and then dropped it altogether which was a shame. This tournament attracted alot of regular low stakes players. Don't know many people at work who want to start playing Deepstacks after 10.30pm, which take around 4 hours to reach a conclusion. I really enjoy a tournament lasting around 90 minutes at this time of night.
In Response to Re: The Sky Poker Player's Tweaks, Changes and Improvements Discussion Thread - Current discussion points at top of OP, PM Me to suggest new ones! : Tommy As this is turning into a me and you chat, lets look at what you are proposing. The 3 2 1 idea is not my idea of heaven, but there are bits of it that are possible. Currently DTD3 on a Monday kicks off at 8.30pm and that would affect the Monday night part of the 3 2 1 , however, return this game to every night of the week, as in the old TOTTY, and we have a plan!! The Orfordable on a Friday night is one of the best tournaments of the week. 10 seater deepstack for £3 (forget the rake atm), re-introduce this every night, Tuesday to Friday, make it a weekly league, anything, to stimulate interest. The old 8.45 £2 bh always had 150+ runners, even if it increased to £3, it would still be a winner. This week saw the re-introduction of another site. We have already seen the mains struggling to reach the numbers and over the next few weeks, the challenges will be harder as the other site gets more established. I want to play on SKY but if the choice is not there, I will go elsewhere. How many others who don't post will do the same. Posted by kaymac
Hey Kaymac.
The 3-2-1 idea was far from a cast iron idea. I fully expected discussion to form it into something the majority of people could agree upon.
Picking up on your points:
I really like the idea of running the DTD3 every weeknight at least if not every night. This could easily be incorporated in my 3-2-1 idea.
I'm not so convinced with the Orfordable, purely down to the fact it is a ten seater. Personally I like the idea of SkyPoker being a dedicated 6-max site and I don't know if the numbers can be maintained in it if it's rolled out more often every week. I more than willing to be shown in the minority though. If everyone reading this would play the Orfordable most week nights if it was rolled out like that, tell the thread.
You bring up a great point about a league and it's something I would like to expand on. As many have said to my face and away from my face, I'm a huge supporter of SkyPoker. But as well as trumpeting their good points I always recognise and express the shortcomings as I see it. The dissolving of the league system is one of those in my opinion, not so much ending the old one, it was in desperate need of being revamped I believe. However one of the things that frustrates me somewhat is being told 'new and improved' versions of something is coming only for these things to quietly disappear. The league system is one of them. Now a league system doesn't have to start with something for every bankroll, if you want to roll it out for stages I believe you can as long as you start from the micro end and spread it upwards. A monthly MTT league for <£6 games would be an ideal beginning as far as I'm concerned. You don't even need cash prizes in them, have a Super roller/Primo ticket for the winner and some seats for the smaller mains for 2nd-5th. That will get the recreation low level MTTers interested IMO. That could easily be part of the solution to the schedule we are discussing.
While I don't think the reintroduction of Full Tilt will change much in the long term I agree for a month or two a lot of recreational players who already had accounts there will be giving it a spin. However while I think this represents a short term dip in the numbers, I always believe you 'fix the hole in the roof while the Sun is shining.' With popularity going up with traffic here now is the time to make the MTT schedule more attraction and playable accross the board, not when traffic is going down.
Hi Tommy Topic 4) As this is already appearing in some tournaments I think its should be rolled out to them all. For the life of me I can't understand why there are different blind levels for similar games. Topic 5) I definitely think that Sky need to do something for the lower buy in players during the evening. For various reasons I have recently dropped back from the "Medium" level games to "Low" and have been quite disappointed at how few £2 & £3 games there are of an evening, and I'd hate to be a player whose bankroll only allowed them to play at the £1 level. Steve Posted by Kiwini4u
In response to 4) I totally can see why structures would be different. Most people who regularly play on Sky have a day job and don't want to play through the night. You need variety, some speed tournies, some quicker games as a middle ground, so slow boar MTTs and so forth. It's finding the right structure for the right game for the right time and the right buy in.
Can't disagree with much on your answer to (5) though.
4) totally agree. If they were built into the standard tournament level structure, all future new MTT's would automatically have this level. 5) Massive support from me for more choice and more often games for the lower BR players. This though can only be implemented if Sky realises the need for it and it fits into their 'business schedule', which unfortunately going with the current trends, it doesn't seem to be the case. Posted by MAXALLY
4) Put it in as part as the default structure or starting point, completely agree. The blind structure can't be cast iron across all games though IMO
5) I'll let you into a secret why I started this thread Maxy. I was quite tired of the apathy and general discord on other forms of social media breed by comments such as that. This is not a dig at you Maxy, I respect you greatly as you play with a 'straight bat' across the board and don't moan just for the sake of moaning. But too many people are just happy to be the moaners and won't do the long yards by trying to change things for the better. The whole point of doing this is to get together the people who want to help the site and help the players on if enjoy their experience much better, find a consensus of opinion and push ever forward.
Thank you very much for joining the thread Alan, having your opinion here can only be a welcomed addition, regardless if we agree or disagree. I don't agree with the statement I have bolded and I'm going to keep going with this thread with that belief in mind. I sincerely hope you and many others continue on with me.
In Response to Re: The Sky Poker Player's Tweaks, Changes and Improvements Discussion Thread - Current discussion points at top of OP, All comments welcome! : 4) Put it in as part as the default structure or starting point, completely agree. The blind structure can't be cast iron across all games though IMO 5) I'll let you into a secret why I started this thread Maxy. I was quite tired of the apathy and general discord on other forms of social media breed by comments such as that. This is not a dig at you Maxy, I respect you greatly as you play with a 'straight bat' across the board and don't moan just for the sake of moaning. But too many people are just happy to be the moaners and won't do the long yards by trying to change things for the better. The whole point of doing this is to get together the people who want to help the site and help the players on if enjoy their experience much better, find a consensus of opinion and push ever forward. Thank you very much for joining the thread Alan, having your opinion here can only be a welcomed addition, regardless if we agree or disagree. I don't agree with the statement I have bolded and I'm going to keep going with this thread with that belief in mind. I sincerely hope you and many others continue on with me. Posted by TommyD
I respect that Tommy....but.....I will always say it how I see it, and that has often got me in trouble. I am no way knocking your efforts and applaud you for trying to get things at least discussed.
I have always said that Sky Poker would work better with a working party made up of players who could make resonable suggestions and with the help of Sky Poker, get things implemented for the benifit of all.
In Response to Re: The Sky Poker Player's Tweaks, Changes and Improvements Discussion Thread - Current discussion points at top of OP, All comments welcome! : I respect that Tommy.... but .....I will always say it how I see it, and that has often got me in trouble. I am no way knocking your efforts and applaud you for trying to get things at least discussed. I have always said that Sky Poker would work better with a working party made up of players who could make resonable suggestions and with the help of Sky Poker, get things implemented for the benifit of all. Posted by MAXALLY
In Response to Re: The Sky Poker Player's Tweaks, Changes and Improvements Discussion Thread - Current discussion points at top of OP, All comments welcome! : I respect that Tommy.... but .....I will always say it how I see it, and that has often got me in trouble. I am no way knocking your efforts and applaud you for trying to get things at least discussed. I have always said that Sky Poker would work better with a working party made up of players who could make resonable suggestions and with the help of Sky Poker, get things implemented for the benifit of all. Posted by MAXALLY
I think Karl Marx and Vladimir Lenin would agree with this statement but seeing as SKY is owned by the Murdochs I dont like your chances.
In Response to Re: The Sky Poker Player's Tweaks, Changes and Improvements Discussion Thread - Current discussion points at top of OP, PM Me to suggest new ones! : Hey Kaymac. The 3-2-1 idea was far from a cast iron idea. I fully expected discussion to form it into something the majority of people could agree upon. Picking up on your points: I really like the idea of running the DTD3 every weeknight at least if not every night. This could easily be incorporated in my 3-2-1 idea. I'm not so convinced with the Orfordable, purely down to the fact it is a ten seater. Personally I like the idea of SkyPoker being a dedicated 6-max site and I don't know if the numbers can be maintained in it if it's rolled out more often every week. I more than willing to be shown in the minority though. If everyone reading this would play the Orfordable most week nights if it was rolled out like that, tell the thread. You bring up a great point about a league and it's something I would like to expand on. As many have said to my face and away from my face, I'm a huge supporter of SkyPoker. But as well as trumpeting their good points I always recognise and express the shortcomings as I see it. The dissolving of the league system is one of those in my opinion, not so much ending the old one, it was in desperate need of being revamped I believe. However one of the things that frustrates me somewhat is being told 'new and improved' versions of something is coming only for these things to quietly disappear. The league system is one of them. Now a league system doesn't have to start with something for every bankroll, if you want to roll it out for stages I believe you can as long as you start from the micro end and spread it upwards. A monthly MTT league for <£6 games would be an ideal beginning as far as I'm concerned. You don't even need cash prizes in them, have a Super roller/Primo ticket for the winner and some seats for the smaller mains for 2nd-5th. That will get the recreation low level MTTers interested IMO. That could easily be part of the solution to the schedule we are discussing. While I don't think the reintroduction of Full Tilt will change much in the long term I agree for a month or two a lot of recreational players who already had accounts there will be giving it a spin. However while I think this represents a short term dip in the numbers, I always believe you 'fix the hole in the roof while the Sun is shining.' With popularity going up with traffic here now is the time to make the MTT schedule more attraction and playable accross the board, not when traffic is going down. Posted by TommyD
Tommy
I appreciate the response and the debate. However, despite everything you, me or anyone says, unless SKY POKER want to encourage the lower bankroll players to the site, nothing will change. At the moment it doesn't look as if they are that interested. Every night this week, between 8.30 and 10pm there are only 2 MTT's with a buy in of £3 or less! Now, liquidity is a word that TIKAY likes to use. Recreational players are not going to pay £3 every night to wait for tournaments to come along when they can get 10 a penny on other sites every 5 minutes.
There has to be more choice for all.
And with all due respect, if you think that FT is going to have no overall effect on SP, you really are living in a dreamworld. The marketing alone is going to take away the swaying players.
Sky Poker is where I want to play, but if the games are not there...... well, you know the rest!!
Ok, I received a PM from a respected member on the forum. They didn't ask to not be named but the way I see it, you keep PMs like that Anon unless expressly told otherwise. Putting my reply to him in first, I struggle to argue with a scintilla of what he has stated for point 4. It's all about where you want the play in a MTT and I would like to see it later rather than earlier. Below is all them and IMO they add a lot to the debate so here is a concise version of what they told me:
2) Surely if the forum game is big and fun it should be shown on TV, or at least be able to.
3) Answer seems probably yes, there aren't many especially towards the end of a session. Can't believe the second chances were so big a buy in with no turbos near the end of the night. However can't really do much about this and can't massage the schedule without looking at the figures of tournies/runners/attrition rate/bubble point etc.
4) The question is very specific, and doesn't focus on the issue of how a tournie plays out. If you're going to discuss structures of the mtt's then in general it should be about 'where' the play is. And the solution should be based around having an understanding of how to affect that rather than plucking starting stacks etc out of the air like sky like to.
Given the no antes structure the tournaments play differently to those the blind increments are based upon. Combining the no antes factor and a good slow structure leads to, if the field were full of really good players, the tournament playing out something along the lines of everyone folding forever. As it is the looseness and recreational element of a chunk of the sky player pool means that loads of people bust early when they shouldn't. But at points you get people folding down to the 0.8 big blinds etc.
I would suggest 'quicker' earlier levels and longer later levels. When people say they want 'play' they generally don't know what that is or what they even mean.
To give an example: WSOP $1ks where you start with 3k chips. 25/25 first level, 1 hour levels!
so you start with 120bbs, 2nd level starting stack is 60bbs, 3rd level 30bb, 4th level 30bb w/antes, 5th level 20bb antes... etc.
I am very sure that if you started them with 50/100 level and 10k chips with a slightly different or worse (less shallow/quicker) structure they'd think that was better even though it's not. But they have many thousands of chips though, you get the point.
If you start everyone a bit shallower, yes there are people who will go out quicker because of 'one mistake or two, etc' but once the field contracts down a bit the stacks are good and the blinds go up with shallow increments. Huge stacks early just lead to lots of folding then suddenly everyone needs to start shoving and now 'play' is to be able to re-raise someone allin, that's the move other than someone all in then do you call or not. There're no raises and flops (or at least there shouldn't be, but obv on sky you have questionable open then fold from less than 10BB stacks, or the limps from any stacksize etc) later on in the tournament, or at the FT. Given that all the money is payed out on the final table it's surely much better to aim to have some kind of play there rather than during just the first few levels.
Regarding the changes to the Thursday night BHer structure, the stack size you play with is a pretty big factor in how that structure plays out. As is knowing it's a 2k starting stack, the fact that the stack is relatively smaller than most people would want, is a good thing especially given it's a week night and it's the main event, but not if you look at it and think about the different stages at which money comes into play and thereby where you want the play. So if level 15 is the bubble (given the new late reg, and especially unnecessarily long the late reg is open for) and level 26 is the final table (i'm purely guessing here just to make a point, much easier to have the info). The first 6 levels go up really shallow, so your stack hardly changes essentially just being very deep, suddenly from level 7 to the bubble the increments aren't so shallow, similarly from the bubble onwards there are loads of 'levels' that could be added.* And it's these additions later on in the schedule, potentially combined with reductions in the earlier shallow levels that would have the most affect on the sky games IMO. Essentially this 'slower' structure is both slow at the start and even more at the end than normally on sky tournies. start with 5k and start at 50/100 would be much more play later and less faffing about early (this would also be GOOD for the recreational/punty player as there is less time at the start where they can make fairly cardinal mistakes).
* Take a look in the the major sites' lobbys on a Sunday. The tournaments that they run with the large numbers of runners have no massive stacks at the start but the level changes later on are incredible, you get numbers like 65k/130k 70k/140k. They have antes so their tournaments play out quicker from 5 levels onwards, hence why on Sky I think we should look to do away with some of the ridiculous earlier deep stacked levels and have more time to play with medium stacks at all points of the tournament if possible.
4) definitely 5) I like the idea of more rebuys, but I personally wouldn't be too fussed about it continually changing each night. Maybe a 7oclock £3.30 rebuy with a £1k guaratee would be ok just for a trial run, and the guarantee can be altered after the first few weeks. I think there should be a nightly £1.10 freezeout with like a £500 guarantee. It'd always make the guarantee and it'd be great for the micro players to turn a quid into like £90 or something. Posted by percival09
Hey Perce.
The reason I proposed a rotation in the form of MTTs was to be inclusive for people who can only play £1 or £2 games and can't do the £3s, it gives them variety and choice, they might prefer Rebuys for instance and they'd actually be looking forward to the night/nights where the rebuy version of their level was running. It is a little faffy I admit but it's amount inclusion.
TBH I don't mind a rebuy myself. Let's not drift into the reg fee on rebuys debate again, I think it's pretty obvious what everyone would prefer however most sites don't have a dedicated TV channel or forum so you need, in my opinion, to take the rough with the smooth to make a balance choice of site to play on.
While I like the idea of that nightly MTT I don't think we should be proposing GTDs from the off. GTDs will come with the support a game is shown, let's see if there is support for it first and then look at suggesting a GTD.
Hi Tommy 4 yes as stops shove fests and wouldn't hurt anyone's strategy. 5. low level bh's areneeded through evening as with success these players will be tomorrows £11 entries. That's why pro teams have youth teams.....because one day it may pay off! Otherwiseyou may lose some traffic to other sites...Seems only sensible... Posted by profman15
In reply to 4, read up in this thread for the excellent piece about what constitutes a shovefest or a good MTT. I'd love your take on that if you'd be so kind.
On 5, People like BHers (with the exception of forum purists of course) and some people have small rolls or only so much disposable income. They were popular before and it's rather a 'no-brainer' for me.
Hi Tommy, Regarding speed/turbo tournaments. I think it would be a good idea to run a number of these after 10.30pm at night. Especially in the £1.10 to £5.50 range and NOT rebuys. I used to really enjoy the £1.10 speed tournament at 10.35pm which regularly had 80 - 130 runners and a £100 guarantee. Sky in its infinite wisdom changed it to a rebuy which cut the number of runners to 50ish and then dropped it altogether which was a shame. This tournament attracted alot of regular low stakes players. Don't know many people at work who want to start playing Deepstacks after 10.30pm, which take around 4 hours to reach a conclusion. I really enjoy a tournament lasting around 90 minutes at this time of night. Posted by ZEON49
Remembering that most of the SkyPoker MTT playerpool is made up of people with day jobs, what sort of numbers do you think these speed games would make at each buy in level? Genuine question, I'd like your estimate on it. Also how late would you run them. I was a bit arbitrary in my proposal, what sort of timeframe are we going to get enough traffic to give these proposals 'legs?' I'm not suggestion starting D/S games at 10.30pm, but how many speed games could you run and get support for?
In Response to Re: The Sky Poker Player's Tweaks, Changes and Improvements Discussion Thread - Current discussion points at top of OP, PM Me to suggest new ones! : Tommy I appreciate the response and the debate. However, despite everything you, me or anyone says, unless SKY POKER want to encourage the lower bankroll players to the site, nothing will change. At the moment it doesn't look as if they are that interested. Every night this week, between 8.30 and 10pm there are only 2 MTT's with a buy in of £3 or less! Now, liquidity is a word that TIKAY likes to use. Recreational players are not going to pay £3 every night to wait for tournaments to come along when they can get 10 a penny on other sites every 5 minutes. There has to be more choice for all. And with all due respect, if you think that FT is going to have no overall effect on SP, you really are living in a dreamworld. The marketing alone is going to take away the swaying players. Sky Poker is where I want to play, but if the games are not there...... well, you know the rest!! Posted by kaymac
Kaymac please don't give up on this thread just when it's starting to get traction. Also I don't think it's fair to say Sky Poker are not encouraging lower bankroll players to the site. The whole point of this is to provide SkyPoker with feedback and evidence that a significant amount of the players on the site would like to see certain changes. It's my honest opinion rational arguments will not be ignored, just because something hasn't snap changed or snap changed back is to proof of not being listened to.
Re: The dreamworld comment. Didn't like it to be quite honest. Full Tilt = Stars. Stars = Full Tilt. Yes there will be effect over the short term with people playing with released money but I honestly don't think it will have a long term huge effect on traffic here on the fact it has been reopened. Stars has been there all along, and yes if players can't play the games they want they may well leave, but that has always been the case regardless if Full Tilt was open or closed. Stars has been there all along and will always represent an alternative choice for the customer, as do many other sites.
In Response to Re: The Sky Poker Player's Tweaks, Changes and Improvements Discussion Thread - Current discussion points at top of OP, All comments welcome! : I think Karl Marx and Vladimir Lenin would agree with this statement but seeing as SKY is owned by the Murdochs I dont like your chances. Posted by jonjo75
Communism and Capitalism combining in the thread. Happy days.
In Response to Re: The Sky Poker Player's Tweaks, Changes and Improvements Discussion Thread - Current discussion points at top of OP, All comments welcome! : Remembering that most of the SkyPoker MTT playerpool is made up of people with day jobs, what sort of numbers do you think these speed games would make at each buy in level? Genuine question, I'd like your estimate on it. Also how late would you run them. I was a bit arbitrary in my proposal, what sort of timeframe are we going to get enough traffic to give these proposals 'legs?' I'm not suggestion starting D/S games at 10.30pm, but how many speed games could you run and get support for? Posted by TommyD
There used to be a £300 gtd velocity starting @ 11-15. It always beat the gntee. It was £5.
Admittedly it was a rebuy.
But the existing speed tournaments on sky are all £100 gtd, between the hours of 8pm - 10pm. So even a £100 gtd after this time is fine. Better than nothing anyway.
To help you/people out, skys turbo MTT schedule between 7pm and midnight is as follows....
7-50, £100gtd, £3.30 rebuy SPEED.
8-10, £50 gtd, £2.20 rebuy, SCARY
8-55, £100gtd, £3.30 rebuy SPEED.
9-45, £100gtd, £5.50 rebuy SPEED.
9-55, £200 gtd, £5.50, freezeout, VELOCITY.
This is pretty good imo so far. As a turbo enthusiast, I can accept this as a reasonable scheduled for 'minor' MTTs between 7-10 (prime time)
I think considering most players are playing cash/big mtts during these periods, we are doing reasonably well with the turbos.
But then I totally agree with the above poster....
After 10pm, as players are dropping out, and turbo liquidity should be high.....
we have.....
11-45. £50 gtd speed. £3 rebuy. With a slower structure than all the previous speeds.
Nothing for around 2 hours.
When we have 3 catagories of turbo tournaments (speed, velocity, scary) why on earth would tournaments given the same title, be given different structures?
It smacks of people having no idea what they're doing.
--------------
A seperate, but less urgent issue (imo) is the size of the add on in all the above tournaments in relation to the first blind level back after the add on period.
It is always no more than 3/4/5/6/7xbb.
It's like a token gesture.
The issue of 'bigger' turbo tournaments is also one that can be looked at.
In Response to Re: The Sky Poker Player's Tweaks, Changes and Improvements Discussion Thread - Current discussion points at top of OP, PM Me to suggest new ones! : Kaymac please don't give up on this thread just when it's starting to get traction. Also I don't think it's fair to say Sky Poker are not encouraging lower bankroll players to the site. The whole point of this is to provide SkyPoker with feedback and evidence that a significant amount of the players on the site would like to see certain changes. It's my honest opinion rational arguments will not be ignored, just because something hasn't snap changed or snap changed back is to proof of not being listened to. Re: The dreamworld comment. Didn't like it to be quite honest. Full Tilt = Stars. Stars = Full Tilt. Yes there will be effect over the short term with people playing with released money but I honestly don't think it will have a long term huge effect on traffic here on the fact it has been reopened. Stars has been there all along, and yes if players can't play the games they want they may well leave, but that has always been the case regardless if Full Tilt was open or closed. Stars has been there all along and will always represent an alternative choice for the customer, as do many other sites. Posted by TommyD
Tommy
Considering it was my post on Facebook that was the catalyst to this thread, I think you are being unfair if you think I am giving up.
So where do you see the encouragement for lower level bankroll players? As I stated the choice of games in the evening are minimal, and as I have already provided an analogy regarding the BH's on this thread, I will not repeat it!
You are also taking my comment re FT totally out of context. I work in a market where any loss of market share is hard to replace and whenever a new kid on the block opens, a share is lost. But when you get a little brother of the Big Guy it's even harder, so liquidity will be affected, especially if the variety is not available on SKY.
My thoughts on the evening schedule have not changed and as of yet, bankbuster apart, sky is doing nothing to change them.
Comments
4 yes as stops shove fests and wouldn't hurt anyone's strategy.
5. low level bh's areneeded through evening as with success these players will be tomorrows £11 entries.
That's why pro teams have youth teams.....because one day it may pay off! Otherwiseyou may lose some traffic to other sites...Seems only sensible...
The 3-2-1 idea was far from a cast iron idea. I fully expected discussion to form it into something the majority of people could agree upon.
Picking up on your points:
I really like the idea of running the DTD3 every weeknight at least if not every night. This could easily be incorporated in my 3-2-1 idea.
I'm not so convinced with the Orfordable, purely down to the fact it is a ten seater. Personally I like the idea of SkyPoker being a dedicated 6-max site and I don't know if the numbers can be maintained in it if it's rolled out more often every week. I more than willing to be shown in the minority though. If everyone reading this would play the Orfordable most week nights if it was rolled out like that, tell the thread.
You bring up a great point about a league and it's something I would like to expand on. As many have said to my face and away from my face, I'm a huge supporter of SkyPoker. But as well as trumpeting their good points I always recognise and express the shortcomings as I see it. The dissolving of the league system is one of those in my opinion, not so much ending the old one, it was in desperate need of being revamped I believe. However one of the things that frustrates me somewhat is being told 'new and improved' versions of something is coming only for these things to quietly disappear. The league system is one of them. Now a league system doesn't have to start with something for every bankroll, if you want to roll it out for stages I believe you can as long as you start from the micro end and spread it upwards. A monthly MTT league for <£6 games would be an ideal beginning as far as I'm concerned. You don't even need cash prizes in them, have a Super roller/Primo ticket for the winner and some seats for the smaller mains for 2nd-5th. That will get the recreation low level MTTers interested IMO. That could easily be part of the solution to the schedule we are discussing.
While I don't think the reintroduction of Full Tilt will change much in the long term I agree for a month or two a lot of recreational players who already had accounts there will be giving it a spin. However while I think this represents a short term dip in the numbers, I always believe you 'fix the hole in the roof while the Sun is shining.' With popularity going up with traffic here now is the time to make the MTT schedule more attraction and playable accross the board, not when traffic is going down.
Can't disagree with much on your answer to (5) though.
5) I'll let you into a secret why I started this thread Maxy. I was quite tired of the apathy and general discord on other forms of social media breed by comments such as that. This is not a dig at you Maxy, I respect you greatly as you play with a 'straight bat' across the board and don't moan just for the sake of moaning. But too many people are just happy to be the moaners and won't do the long yards by trying to change things for the better. The whole point of doing this is to get together the people who want to help the site and help the players on if enjoy their experience much better, find a consensus of opinion and push ever forward.
Thank you very much for joining the thread Alan, having your opinion here can only be a welcomed addition, regardless if we agree or disagree. I don't agree with the statement I have bolded and I'm going to keep going with this thread with that belief in mind. I sincerely hope you and many others continue on with me.
I think Karl Marx and Vladimir Lenin would agree with this statement but seeing as SKY is owned by the Murdochs I dont like your chances.
2) Surely if the forum game is big and fun it should be shown on TV, or at least be able to.
3) Answer seems probably yes, there aren't many especially towards the end of a session. Can't believe the second chances were so big a buy in with no turbos near the end of the night. However can't really do much about this and can't massage the schedule without looking at the figures of tournies/runners/attrition rate/bubble point etc.
4) The question is very specific, and doesn't focus on the issue of how a tournie plays out. If you're going to discuss structures of the mtt's then in general it should be about 'where' the play is. And the solution should be based around having an understanding of how to affect that rather than plucking starting stacks etc out of the air like sky like to.
If you start everyone a bit shallower, yes there are people who will go out quicker because of 'one mistake or two, etc' but once the field contracts down a bit the stacks are good and the blinds go up with shallow increments. Huge stacks early just lead to lots of folding then suddenly everyone needs to start shoving and now 'play' is to be able to re-raise someone allin, that's the move other than someone all in then do you call or not. There're no raises and flops (or at least there shouldn't be, but obv on sky you have questionable open then fold from less than 10BB stacks, or the limps from any stacksize etc) later on in the tournament, or at the FT. Given that all the money is payed out on the final table it's surely much better to aim to have some kind of play there rather than during just the first few levels.
The reason I proposed a rotation in the form of MTTs was to be inclusive for people who can only play £1 or £2 games and can't do the £3s, it gives them variety and choice, they might prefer Rebuys for instance and they'd actually be looking forward to the night/nights where the rebuy version of their level was running. It is a little faffy I admit but it's amount inclusion.
TBH I don't mind a rebuy myself. Let's not drift into the reg fee on rebuys debate again, I think it's pretty obvious what everyone would prefer however most sites don't have a dedicated TV channel or forum so you need, in my opinion, to take the rough with the smooth to make a balance choice of site to play on.
While I like the idea of that nightly MTT I don't think we should be proposing GTDs from the off. GTDs will come with the support a game is shown, let's see if there is support for it first and then look at suggesting a GTD.
On 5, People like BHers (with the exception of forum purists of course) and some people have small rolls or only so much disposable income. They were popular before and it's rather a 'no-brainer' for me.
Re: The dreamworld comment. Didn't like it to be quite honest. Full Tilt = Stars. Stars = Full Tilt. Yes there will be effect over the short term with people playing with released money but I honestly don't think it will have a long term huge effect on traffic here on the fact it has been reopened. Stars has been there all along, and yes if players can't play the games they want they may well leave, but that has always been the case regardless if Full Tilt was open or closed. Stars has been there all along and will always represent an alternative choice for the customer, as do many other sites.