In Response to Re: Thinking out loud - Sharkscope. : plenty of regs love to do this, I personally opted out of sharkscope, but u cant win coz then they abuse u about that Posted by CHILLIE
I hate it when people abuse others at the table for ANY reason... I often defend the abusee - unless they are abusing me, in which case I quite enjoy it, quietly chuckle to myself knowing I have tilted them. Sometimes I even enjoy poking the abuser in some way to make sure they stay annoyed. lol. quite fun really.
Try not to be put off by people abusing your play, they are always the bigger idiot no matter what it is you are meant to have done wrong. everyone else at the table will generally think so too.
In Response to Re: Thinking out loud - Sharkscope. : Ahh got a feeling........;) Now then - and I'm defo not picking on you, or isolating you, but you said something there which as at the heart of it. You 'scoped your Final Table, & it was "helpful". (To you....). Well we've all done that, or many of us have, & you've done nothing wrong. Now move it up a level. Have you gained an advantage over others by doing so? You suggested it was "helpful", so presumably, yes? Sharkscope is not available to everyone, or more correctly, some folks can't afford, or don't wish, to subscribe. Now turn it upside down. You can't afford, or don't want, to use Sharkscope, but your opponents do. Is that fair & proper, & would you feel OK about it? Just putting it out there, not having a go at you in any way. It seems to me to be similar to the "HUD's or not" debate really. Posted by Tikay10
lol I know why people are reluctant about s/s.
When I started playing on the site it was only after a few months I discovered sharkscope (through someone discussing it in the chat box/ rhyming of every1s results)
I thought at the time, it was a bit bizarre these reults were public knowledge and why Sky pass this information on, I now of course know that's not the case, and they use software to garner the information from poker lobbies (that anyone can see).
After the 1st week I was never concerned about it, because it showed everyone's results.
When I said I found it helpful s/s the FT, it just confirmed my opinions on the players at the table. For example there was 1 player, who would limp in weak hands, 4/5x hands like 99s, 10s, and with monsters he 7xed it (at a FT when the blinds were massive!!) That was my "tell". S/s, and his results, just confirmed to me what was obvious from his results. Maybe interesting would have been a better word than helpful it certainly wouldn't alter how I played, or did play.
The thing I find most useful about s/s is tracking my own progress, that has been instrumental to me in helping to improve at the game.
I've never paid s/s a penny, I just use the free searches.
In todays world, it wouldn't bother me if sky could some how prevent sharkscope from getting sky results or not.
The thread was already very long by the time I came to it, so I haven't read past the first page.
I have to say, though, that sharkscope don't really sell your information, they sell their services. As has been said, all the information they use is published independently of them. All they do is collate that and put it in a long-term perspective. I can't say there's anything wrong with taking publically accessible information and presenting it in a new way.
They also don't provide any private information. No personal details are used, only your poker alias and other information which you have made public yourself.
Whether scope is good for the game or not, I wouldn't like to say. It's certainly a potentially useful tool for any player hoping to improve. It does take some understanding of poker to make sense of the provided information, though, so naturally the better players benefit more. That doesn't preclude new players benefitting from it, though. We were all beginners once.
For instance if I "sat" into a £110 main event for a £3 all in sat then don't cash in the main event Sharkscope would report I had lost £110. Although I would of only lost £3.
It also does not show cash win/loss, only tournaments. So fluke into the main 6 times a year and never cash you've lost £18, anyone looking at your Sharkscope see's you've lost £660.
I'd be gutted if Sky stopped allowing SS to have the info, although is that even possible because all they do is basically what GaryQQQ does but on a much larger scale. FWIW, you also have to OPT in to have your results appear for Poker 'sparkly things in the Sky' lol. Worst case scenario I think Sky could make it so you have to opt in but I tink it would be a massive shame to just completely block it (if that's possible) Sure it can be used to abuse players in chat etc, but the type of people that do that are te type of people that will just abuse them verbally in some other way if that info wasn't available. I mostly just use it as a means of tracking my own results and getting to see a graph etc without me doing it myself. It's also cool for the leaderboards, a few of which have Sky players on for top 20 profit in the world! I know at least 2 people that have a little competition with each other on who will finish higher on the Sky SS leaderboard. Posted by Lambert180
I'm confused. If you know the information on Sharkscope is flawed, what worth is a graph for anything other than ego? Your diary demonstrates your ability in a much better, more accurate and enjoyable way! If Sharkscope was stopped "bum hunters" (excuse the terminology) would actually have to play proper poker to earn their living. I've followed your progress on the site since you started in no way am I implying the terminology used earlier, applies to you! But there are individuals on all sites who sit on heads up tables waiting for prey, if a recognised player turns up they decline.
One interesting thing I have noticed on Sharkscope....Most players showing as winning a lot on Sky are losing on virtually EVERY other site they play on. That is a very strange and interesting fact.
One interesting thing I have noticed on Sharkscope....Most players showing as winning a lot on Sky are losing on virtually EVERY other site they play on. That is a very strange and interesting fact. Posted by VickiPKR
lol and how do you know there alias's on other sites?
Sharkscope is very inacurate, For instance if I "sat" into a £110 main event for a £3 all in sat then don't cash in the main event Sharkscope would report I had lost £110. Although I would of only lost £3. It also does not show cash win/loss, only tournaments. So fluke into the main 6 times a year and never cash you've lost £18, anyone looking at your Sharkscope see's you've lost £660. Posted by VickiPKR
This isn't the case. If you win the satellite scope will (or it's supposed to, lol) show a profit of £100 or whatever the value of the seat is. Fail to cash in that event and it will then show a loss of the value of that tournament buy-in. So it all should end up showing you £3 down but with a £100 upswing, followed by a £100 downswing.
It isn't entirely accurate, as many will know, in the way it displays rebuy profit/loss and (I think) bounty hunters. There are some very misleading scope graphs out there on the back of these.
other than my own results the only real thing i use ss for is when i meet an unknown playing unorthodoxly it's good to know if that player is particularly good and therefore to be careful about so in this case it disadvantages the better player
besides ss is flawed as others have said my scope is 1000s below reality i think i leave it up to fool peeps into thinking i'm more of a fish than i really am
i do not think it is in the same league as HUDs at all as it is so blunt and inaccurate and gives no info on game play so with all due respect to the OP or is that the old man i'm just not that fussed
what i think is important is for peeps to know that sky does not "provide" the data direct for sharkie to use - they have to go get it
In Response to Re: Thinking out loud - Sharkscope. : Are they actually published at such though? Is it not a case of them just literally accessing all the lobbies same as how GaryQQQ would? I don't know which one it is, I'm asking ^^^ Posted by Lambert180
It must be scraping from the lobby- TK already said sky don't make this info available, they just come and get it. Would explain why cash isn't tracked
In Response to Re: Thinking out loud - Sharkscope. : It must be scraping from the lobby- TK already said sky don't make this info available, they just come and get it. Would explain why cash isn't tracked Posted by chicknMelt
Well yeah Ske deffo don't provide it... just not sure how it'd work for something like SnGs. They must ave software to pick up every single time a HU SnG loads for instance and the SnG stats have always been perfect (no games missed) in my experience, the problems only come with some MTTs.
I pay for a Sharkscope subscription, have always been very open about it. It costs me about £9 per month for 150 searches a day plus all the filters and other info non-subscribers don't get, good value imo.
As an MTT specialist it's more of a luxury than an essential, I like having the info but I could easily do without it. Self analysis is one of it's main uses for me, as demonstrated in my recent BR challenge. It tells me nothing about how any particular opponent may play. My notes are much more useful for that. The most likely way it'll boost your profit is if you use it for table-selecting STTs, something I don't actually do that often.
I like having Sharkscope, though I'd happily sacrifice it if it were deemed bad for poker. While it remains available to everybody I'll continue to subscribe.
I hate it when I see chatbox abusers quoting Sharkscope stats. That's its biggest negative as far as I'm concerned.
If Sky bring in an opt-in policy like other sites I'd be cool with that. I'd opt in so I can continue to self analyze. Not sure if I'd still subscribe, it would depend how many others opt in.
Vespa I think that's just because I don't think I've ever seen a site run a 3 or 4man (1table) SnG ever. The only 4man SnG you ever see are HU games where its 1v1 then the 2 winners play each other so it is still a HU SnG.
So I can't see a situation where a SnG would ever have less then 5 runners and not be a HU game.
Vespa I think that's just because I don't think I've ever seen a site run a 3 or 4man (1table) SnG ever. The only 4man SnG you ever see are HU games where its 1v1 then the 2 winners play each other so it is still a HU SnG. So I can't see a situation where a SnG would ever have less then 5 runners and not be a HU game. Posted by Lambert180
Oh ok cheers Why don't they just put 2 players then? lol
Cos of the reason I mentioned above. Alot of places do 4man HU SnGs where you all pay say £1 but winner gets £4 cos instead of winning 1 game, you gotta beat your opponent then the winner of the other first game.
In Response to Re: Thinking out loud - Sharkscope. : plenty of regs love to do this, I personally opted out of sharkscope, but u cant win coz then they abuse u about that Posted by CHILLIE
Chillie, I reckon you could make quite a lot of money by selling your own stats.
How much would it cost me/us for you to unlock your stats for an hour 1 day???
In Response to Re: Thinking out loud - Sharkscope. : Chillie, I reckon you could make quite a lot of money by selling your own stats. How much would it cost me/us for you to unlock your stats for an hour 1 day??? Posted by DOHHHHHHH
Comments
When I started playing on the site it was only after a few months I discovered sharkscope (through someone discussing it in the chat box/ rhyming of every1s results)
I thought at the time, it was a bit bizarre these reults were public knowledge and why Sky pass this information on, I now of course know that's not the case, and they use software to garner the information from poker lobbies (that anyone can see).
After the 1st week I was never concerned about it, because it showed everyone's results.
When I said I found it helpful s/s the FT, it just confirmed my opinions on the players at the table. For example there was 1 player, who would limp in weak hands, 4/5x hands like 99s, 10s, and with monsters he 7xed it (at a FT when the blinds were massive!!) That was my "tell". S/s, and his results, just confirmed to me what was obvious from his results. Maybe interesting would have been a better word than helpful it certainly wouldn't alter how I played, or did play.
The thing I find most useful about s/s is tracking my own progress, that has been instrumental to me in helping to improve at the game.
I've never paid s/s a penny, I just use the free searches.
In todays world, it wouldn't bother me if sky could some how prevent sharkscope from getting sky results or not.
I have to say, though, that sharkscope don't really sell your information, they sell their services. As has been said, all the information they use is published independently of them. All they do is collate that and put it in a long-term perspective. I can't say there's anything wrong with taking publically accessible information and presenting it in a new way.
They also don't provide any private information. No personal details are used, only your poker alias and other information which you have made public yourself.
Whether scope is good for the game or not, I wouldn't like to say. It's certainly a potentially useful tool for any player hoping to improve. It does take some understanding of poker to make sense of the provided information, though, so naturally the better players benefit more. That doesn't preclude new players benefitting from it, though. We were all beginners once.
For instance if I "sat" into a £110 main event for a £3 all in sat then don't cash in the main event Sharkscope would report I had lost £110. Although I would of only lost £3.
It also does not show cash win/loss, only tournaments. So fluke into the main 6 times a year and never cash you've lost £18, anyone looking at your Sharkscope see's you've lost £660.
Your diary demonstrates your ability in a much better, more accurate and enjoyable way!
If Sharkscope was stopped "bum hunters" (excuse the terminology) would actually have to play proper poker to earn their living.
I've followed your progress on the site since you started in no way am I implying the terminology used earlier, applies to you!
But there are individuals on all sites who sit on heads up tables waiting for prey, if a recognised player turns up they decline.
It isn't entirely accurate, as many will know, in the way it displays rebuy profit/loss and (I think) bounty hunters. There are some very misleading scope graphs out there on the back of these.
it's good to know if that player is particularly good and therefore to be careful about
so in this case it disadvantages the better player
besides ss is flawed as others have said
my scope is 1000s below reality
i think i leave it up to fool peeps into thinking i'm more of a fish than i really am
i do not think it is in the same league as HUDs at all
as it is so blunt and inaccurate and gives no info on game play
so with all due respect to the OP or is that the old man
i'm just not that fussed
what i think is important is for peeps to know that sky does not "provide" the data direct for sharkie to use - they have to go get it
Tikay ?
I don't know which one it is, I'm asking ^^^
As an MTT specialist it's more of a luxury than an essential, I like having the info but I could easily do without it. Self analysis is one of it's main uses for me, as demonstrated in my recent BR challenge. It tells me nothing about how any particular opponent may play. My notes are much more useful for that. The most likely way it'll boost your profit is if you use it for table-selecting STTs, something I don't actually do that often.
I like having Sharkscope, though I'd happily sacrifice it if it were deemed bad for poker. While it remains available to everybody I'll continue to subscribe.
I hate it when I see chatbox abusers quoting Sharkscope stats. That's its biggest negative as far as I'm concerned.
If Sky bring in an opt-in policy like other sites I'd be cool with that. I'd opt in so I can continue to self analyze. Not sure if I'd still subscribe, it would depend how many others opt in.
"What counts as an Heads Up Game?
For the purposes of the leaderboards a heads up game is any game with less than 5 entrants."
Interesting
Why don't they just put 2 players then? lol
How much would it cost me/us for you to unlock your stats for an hour 1 day???