Good Afternoon Having been an occasional poster, and avid reader of this thread I must say it’s sad the last few pages seem to be getting more and more personal insults. I would like to contribute but tbh, as has been pointed out to me I’m far too emotionally fragile 😊, maybe others feel the same way. Hope things turn out well for the country post Brexit. This ‘Remoaner’ thing, is it just people who voted remain who are moaning about the current state of all things Brexit, or are those who voted Leave complaining also? Personally think both sides are, so why the emphasis on Remain voters as moaning, is it because it slips easily off the tongue?
Agreed. Why the hostility? We all have our own opinions - as we should.
Good Afternoon Having been an occasional poster, and avid reader of this thread I must say it’s sad the last few pages seem to be getting more and more personal insults. I would like to contribute but tbh, as has been pointed out to me I’m far too emotionally fragile 😊, maybe others feel the same way. Hope things turn out well for the country post Brexit. This ‘Remoaner’ thing, is it just people who voted remain who are moaning about the current state of all things Brexit, or are those who voted Leave complaining also? Personally think both sides are, so why the emphasis on Remain voters as moaning, is it because it slips easily off the tongue?
Agreed. Why the hostility? We all have our own opinions - as we should.
That would be because up and down the country , people have strong opinions about the subject and the divisiveness is widening because of the superior , smug and scaremongering attitude of remoaners . Even when it's all over , there will be clucks of remainers tutting and moaning in the corners of civilisation , whilst everyone looks on in pity .
Given the level of analysis and understanding shown since I've started contributing to this thread, at the poker table I want the jesus seat on @dobiesdraw, directly on his left and I'd prefer @Haysie to be at a different table
Welcome to the forum , with your smug attitude you will fit in very well on this thread .
Didn't seem smug to me, just truthful.
Everyone has their own idea of truth .
I analyse Brexit as a scientist due to my scientific background. From the vast amount of information out there I am convinced Brexit is a terrible idea. I'd say 99% of the friends I did my PhD with and all former colleagues I'm still in touch have come to the same conclusion as me. What are we missing?
You seem very keen to tell us all about your academic achievements , not sure why, unless you think it adds some sort of weight to your arguments . It doesn't ! Try analysing scientifically swathes of a nation feeling left out , ignored ...you can't . You also can't analyse something in a scientific manner ( not if you want it to have any meaningful foundation) , when you really have no idea what will transpire say 10 years down the line .
Point I was trying to make is that I'm good at analysing complex systems as it's what I've been trained to do and having been doing in my job for many years. I'm sure being able to analyse the data is good in an argument? As you say though it goes beyond the data and is a huge emotional thing for people too. Leaving the EU my opinion will not solve people's dissatisfaction with the status quo it will make things a lot worse. Tory austerity has a lot to answer for. Predictions of an 8% drop in GDP by both the bank of England, the IMF and the government's own studies are the best indicators of what could happen in the future in the event of a no deal. They may or may not be entirely accurate but it's all we have to predict the impact. 90 odd percent of economists agree./ I don't see any figures from the Leave side, just 'we'll be fine' which doesn't fill me with confidence.
Perhaps educated leavers know better than to put forward guesstimations /polls /and forecasts ...as they can't be relied on . Lets look at Carneys initial forecast, how did that pan out ?
You are risking a prosecution under the Trades Descriptions Act referring to yourself as an educated leaver.
Both in terms of the educated bit, and the leaver, because you didn't vote, and therefore cannot consider yourself a leave voter.
Are you generally in favour of lowering food standards?
Do you think that we should allow imports of hormone injected beef, gm crops, and chlorine washed chicken?
Do you think that JRM should be undermining the Government, and putting the future of the country in jeopardy, in pursuing his own aims?
Do you think that US companies should be allowed access to the NHS?
Do you now appreciate that the NHS is experiencing problems with drug shortages?
Do you now understand that stopping Freedom of Movement means the loss of the right to live and work in EU member countries?
No.
Maybe.
What's best for the country is subjective.
If you seriously think that will happen , you should prob join the conspiracy theory thread
Yes , but that is in the main due to panic stockpiling .
That depends entirely on what we negotiate with the EU post brexit. If we joined the EEA, or substantially replicated EEU arrangements (as Switzerland does) then relatively little would change.
Good Afternoon Having been an occasional poster, and avid reader of this thread I must say it’s sad the last few pages seem to be getting more and more personal insults. I would like to contribute but tbh, as has been pointed out to me I’m far too emotionally fragile 😊, maybe others feel the same way. Hope things turn out well for the country post Brexit. This ‘Remoaner’ thing, is it just people who voted remain who are moaning about the current state of all things Brexit, or are those who voted Leave complaining also? Personally think both sides are, so why the emphasis on Remain voters as moaning, is it because it slips easily off the tongue?
Agreed. Why the hostility? We all have our own opinions - as we should.
That would be because up and down the country , people have strong opinions about the subject and the divisiveness is widening because of the superior , smug and scaremongering attitude of remoaners . Even when it's all over , there will be clucks of remainers tutting and moaning in the corners of civilisation , whilst everyone looks on in pity .
Good Afternoon Having been an occasional poster, and avid reader of this thread I must say it’s sad the last few pages seem to be getting more and more personal insults. I would like to contribute but tbh, as has been pointed out to me I’m far too emotionally fragile 😊, maybe others feel the same way. Hope things turn out well for the country post Brexit. This ‘Remoaner’ thing, is it just people who voted remain who are moaning about the current state of all things Brexit, or are those who voted Leave complaining also? Personally think both sides are, so why the emphasis on Remain voters as moaning, is it because it slips easily off the tongue?
Agreed. Why the hostility? We all have our own opinions - as we should.
That would be because up and down the country , people have strong opinions about the subject and the divisiveness is widening because of the superior , smug and scaremongering attitude of remoaners . Even when it's all over , there will be clucks of remainers tutting and moaning in the corners of civilisation , whilst everyone looks on in pity .
Why not try standing back and seeing the wider picture?
Good Afternoon Having been an occasional poster, and avid reader of this thread I must say it’s sad the last few pages seem to be getting more and more personal insults. I would like to contribute but tbh, as has been pointed out to me I’m far too emotionally fragile 😊, maybe others feel the same way. Hope things turn out well for the country post Brexit. This ‘Remoaner’ thing, is it just people who voted remain who are moaning about the current state of all things Brexit, or are those who voted Leave complaining also? Personally think both sides are, so why the emphasis on Remain voters as moaning, is it because it slips easily off the tongue?
Agreed. Why the hostility? We all have our own opinions - as we should.
That would be because up and down the country , people have strong opinions about the subject and the divisiveness is widening because of the superior , smug and scaremongering attitude of remoaners . Even when it's all over , there will be clucks of remainers tutting and moaning in the corners of civilisation , whilst everyone looks on in pity .
Why not try standing back and seeing the wider picture?
Life is not ALL about Brexit.
As you are a very occasional poster , perhaps it's worth pointing out to you this is a thread about Brexit ...what would you like us to talk about on here ? ...#funnyashell
Good Afternoon Having been an occasional poster, and avid reader of this thread I must say it’s sad the last few pages seem to be getting more and more personal insults. I would like to contribute but tbh, as has been pointed out to me I’m far too emotionally fragile 😊, maybe others feel the same way. Hope things turn out well for the country post Brexit. This ‘Remoaner’ thing, is it just people who voted remain who are moaning about the current state of all things Brexit, or are those who voted Leave complaining also? Personally think both sides are, so why the emphasis on Remain voters as moaning, is it because it slips easily off the tongue?
Agreed. Why the hostility? We all have our own opinions - as we should.
That would be because up and down the country , people have strong opinions about the subject and the divisiveness is widening because of the superior , smug and scaremongering attitude of remoaners . Even when it's all over , there will be clucks of remainers tutting and moaning in the corners of civilisation , whilst everyone looks on in pity .
If we ever leave.
Oh we will , and that is something , you will have to get over .
Are you generally in favour of lowering food standards?
Do you think that we should allow imports of hormone injected beef, gm crops, and chlorine washed chicken?
Do you think that JRM should be undermining the Government, and putting the future of the country in jeopardy, in pursuing his own aims?
Do you think that US companies should be allowed access to the NHS?
Do you now appreciate that the NHS is experiencing problems with drug shortages?
Do you now understand that stopping Freedom of Movement means the loss of the right to live and work in EU member countries?
No.
Maybe.
What's best for the country is subjective.
If you seriously think that will happen , you should prob join the conspiracy theory thread
Yes , but that is in the main due to panic stockpiling .
That depends entirely on what we negotiate with the EU post brexit. If we joined the EEA, or substantially replicated EEU arrangements (as Switzerland does) then relatively little would change.
Given the level of analysis and understanding shown since I've started contributing to this thread, at the poker table I want the jesus seat on @dobiesdraw, directly on his left and I'd prefer @Haysie to be at a different table
Welcome to the forum , with your smug attitude you will fit in very well on this thread .
Didn't seem smug to me, just truthful.
Everyone has their own idea of truth .
I analyse Brexit as a scientist due to my scientific background. From the vast amount of information out there I am convinced Brexit is a terrible idea. I'd say 99% of the friends I did my PhD with and all former colleagues I'm still in touch have come to the same conclusion as me. What are we missing?
You seem very keen to tell us all about your academic achievements , not sure why, unless you think it adds some sort of weight to your arguments . It doesn't ! Try analysing scientifically swathes of a nation feeling left out , ignored ...you can't . You also can't analyse something in a scientific manner ( not if you want it to have any meaningful foundation) , when you really have no idea what will transpire say 10 years down the line .
Point I was trying to make is that I'm good at analysing complex systems as it's what I've been trained to do and having been doing in my job for many years. I'm sure being able to analyse the data is good in an argument? As you say though it goes beyond the data and is a huge emotional thing for people too. Leaving the EU my opinion will not solve people's dissatisfaction with the status quo it will make things a lot worse. Tory austerity has a lot to answer for. Predictions of an 8% drop in GDP by both the bank of England, the IMF and the government's own studies are the best indicators of what could happen in the future in the event of a no deal. They may or may not be entirely accurate but it's all we have to predict the impact. 90 odd percent of economists agree./ I don't see any figures from the Leave side, just 'we'll be fine' which doesn't fill me with confidence.
Perhaps educated leavers know better than to put forward guesstimations /polls /and forecasts ...as they can't be relied on . Lets look at Carneys initial forecast, how did that pan out ?
You are risking a prosecution under the Trades Descriptions Act referring to yourself as an educated leaver.
Both in terms of the educated bit, and the leaver, because you didn't vote, and therefore cannot consider yourself a leave voter.
Perhaps read my post back back to yourself and tell us all , where exactly I have referred to myself as being either in that statement . Not really very bright are you !
None of the prominent Leavers give a toss about the country and see Brexit as an opportunity for themselves. JRM wants to make money from it. Boris & Gove want to be leader of the Tory party at the expense of even the country falling apart. Raab wants to strip workers of their rights and deregulate everything. I don't understand how Leavers can't see this and think, maybe I'm on the wrong side?
None of the prominent Leavers give a toss about the country and see Brexit as an opportunity for themselves. JRM wants to make money from it. Boris & Gove want to be leader of the Tory party at the expense of even the country falling apart. Raab wants to strip workers of their rights and deregulate everything. I don't understand how Leavers can't see this and think, maybe I'm on the wrong side?
Obv you are on the wrong side ...back in 2016, 17.4 million people voted to leave ...that will be what happens , so it really doesn't matter how much you and the other remoaners moan and whinge , that is the reality of the situation . So I really don't see the point of you and your ilk constantly going over it . As already said all you are doing is causing more divisiveness , instead of getting behind getting the right deal for the country . View it as a cleansing .
None of the prominent Leavers give a toss about the country and see Brexit as an opportunity for themselves. JRM wants to make money from it. Boris & Gove want to be leader of the Tory party at the expense of even the country falling apart. Raab wants to strip workers of their rights and deregulate everything. I don't understand how Leavers can't see this and think, maybe I'm on the wrong side?
Hey remainer
Great to have another, new perspective to join @HAYSIE’s detailed, independent objective inputs to try to discuss this serious issue, which just gets sidelined by condecendjng,patronising remarks on occasions- see reference to your postgraduate PHD studies as an example.( btw when I call out the rude old*woman** I get told I’m trolling her and get abuse as her defence mechanism)
Please don’t apologise for being a remainer, NOT a remoaner-as my children keep telling me, it’s the old people that have sold their futures down the river....
Let’s hope you aren’t put off and continue to contribute to this and other forum threads as I for one-Ex educationalist myself- recognise the additional level of study your PHD needed
*old is relative, ** some people use a female avatar for their own reasons so don’t assume all is as it seems
None of the prominent Leavers give a toss about the country and see Brexit as an opportunity for themselves. JRM wants to make money from it. Boris & Gove want to be leader of the Tory party at the expense of even the country falling apart. Raab wants to strip workers of their rights and deregulate everything. I don't understand how Leavers can't see this and think, maybe I'm on the wrong side?
Hey remainer
Great to have another, new perspective to join @HAYSIE’s detailed, independent objective inputs to try to discuss this serious issue, which just gets sidelined by condecendjng,patronising remarks on occasions- see reference to your postgraduate PHD studies as an example.( btw when I call out the rude old*woman** I get told I’m trolling her and get abuse as her defence mechanism)
Please don’t apologise for being a remainer, NOT a remoaner-as my children keep telling me, it’s the old people that have sold their futures down the river....
Let’s hope you aren’t put off and continue to contribute to this and other forum threads as I for one-Ex educationalist myself- recognise the additional level of study your PHD needed
*old is relative, ** some people use a female avatar for their own reasons so don’t assume all is as it seems
Just can't help yourself can you ....a aging man who thinks it's acceptable to stalk and troll a woman on an internet forum ...you must be amazingly proud of yourself . Makes one wonder what sort of people the offspring of such people turn out to be like ( my heart goes out to the unfortunate kids) ...good case for neutering !
None of the prominent Leavers give a toss about the country and see Brexit as an opportunity for themselves. JRM wants to make money from it. Boris & Gove want to be leader of the Tory party at the expense of even the country falling apart. Raab wants to strip workers of their rights and deregulate everything. I don't understand how Leavers can't see this and think, maybe I'm on the wrong side?
Obv you are on the wrong side ...back in 2016, 17.4 million people voted to leave ...that will be what happens , so it really doesn't matter how much you and the other remoaners moan and whinge , that is the reality of the situation . So I really don't see the point of you and your ilk constantly going over it . As already said all you are doing is causing more divisiveness , instead of getting behind getting the right deal for the country . View it as a cleansing .
You missed my point. I was asking why leavers don't question the motives of the prominent Leavers and realise that those individuals are only interested in their own agendas. They don't care about the country and the impact of Brexit on it's citizens.
It just saddens me that so many people still believe /are in denial about the lies of the Leave campaign when everything points to the fact that we'll be worse off if we leave. The issues everyone is experiencing are not down to the EU. The main contributor to the problems in the UK are Tory policy.
Good Afternoon Having been an occasional poster, and avid reader of this thread I must say it’s sad the last few pages seem to be getting more and more personal insults. I would like to contribute but tbh, as has been pointed out to me I’m far too emotionally fragile 😊, maybe others feel the same way. Hope things turn out well for the country post Brexit. This ‘Remoaner’ thing, is it just people who voted remain who are moaning about the current state of all things Brexit, or are those who voted Leave complaining also? Personally think both sides are, so why the emphasis on Remain voters as moaning, is it because it slips easily off the tongue?
Agreed. Why the hostility? We all have our own opinions - as we should.
That would be because up and down the country , people have strong opinions about the subject and the divisiveness is widening because of the superior , smug and scaremongering attitude of remoaners . Even when it's all over , there will be clucks of remainers tutting and moaning in the corners of civilisation , whilst everyone looks on in pity .
Why not try standing back and seeing the wider picture?
Life is not ALL about Brexit.
As you are a very occasional poster , perhaps it's worth pointing out to you this is a thread about Brexit ...what would you like us to talk about on here ? ...#funnyashell
None of the prominent Leavers give a toss about the country and see Brexit as an opportunity for themselves. JRM wants to make money from it. Boris & Gove want to be leader of the Tory party at the expense of even the country falling apart. Raab wants to strip workers of their rights and deregulate everything. I don't understand how Leavers can't see this and think, maybe I'm on the wrong side?
Hey remainer
Great to have another, new perspective to join @HAYSIE’s detailed, independent objective inputs to try to discuss this serious issue, which just gets sidelined by condecendjng,patronising remarks on occasions- see reference to your postgraduate PHD studies as an example.( btw when I call out the rude old*woman** I get told I’m trolling her and get abuse as her defence mechanism)
Please don’t apologise for being a remainer, NOT a remoaner-as my children keep telling me, it’s the old people that have sold their futures down the river....
Let’s hope you aren’t put off and continue to contribute to this and other forum threads as I for one-Ex educationalist myself- recognise the additional level of study your PHD needed
*old is relative, ** some people use a female avatar for their own reasons so don’t assume all is as it seems
Just can't help yourself can you ....a aging man who thinks it's acceptable to stalk and troll a woman on an internet forum ...you must be amazingly proud of yourself . Makes one wonder what sort of people the offspring of such people turn out to be like ( my heart goes out to the unfortunate kids) ...good case for neutering !
The debate would be much better, & involve a lot more poeple, if;
a) We stopped insulting each other & being so brusque with our replies.
b) We don't HAVE to respond to insults, we can rise above them.
No debate was ever won by slinging insults around.
TIA.
Apologies, I agree and for my part thanks for the reminder- we had a great new insightful post from @remainer, which had responses to his significant educational achievements belittled early on...my last post on this topic
We would genuinely - I promise you - have a better balance to the debate, with input from all sides, & more folks getting involved if we were all a little more respectful of each other, if not respectful of each other's views.
Debates are never helped & problems never solved when we trade insults.
Comments
We all have our own opinions - as we should.
Both in terms of the educated bit, and the leaver, because you didn't vote, and therefore cannot consider yourself a leave voter.
What do you think ?
I was asking you as you are defending him?
Life is not ALL about Brexit.
I was asking you as you are defending him?
And I'm asking you a question .
I don't understand how Leavers can't see this and think, maybe I'm on the wrong side?
So I really don't see the point of you and your ilk constantly going over it . As already said all you are doing is causing more divisiveness , instead of getting behind getting the right deal for the country .
View it as a cleansing .
Great to have another, new perspective to join @HAYSIE’s detailed, independent objective inputs to try to discuss this serious issue, which just gets sidelined by condecendjng,patronising remarks on occasions- see reference to your postgraduate PHD studies as an example.( btw when I call out the rude old*woman** I get told I’m trolling her and get abuse as her defence mechanism)
Please don’t apologise for being a remainer, NOT a remoaner-as my children keep telling me, it’s the old people that have sold their futures down the river....
Let’s hope you aren’t put off and continue to contribute to this and other forum threads as I for one-Ex educationalist myself- recognise the additional level of study your PHD needed
*old is relative, ** some people use a female avatar for their own reasons so don’t assume all is as it seems
"join @HAYSIE’s detailed, independent objective inputs"
It just saddens me that so many people still believe /are in denial about the lies of the Leave campaign when everything points to the fact that we'll be worse off if we leave. The issues everyone is experiencing are not down to the EU. The main contributor to the problems in the UK are Tory policy.
The debate would be much better, & involve a lot more poeple, if;
a) We stopped insulting each other & being so brusque with our replies.
b) We don't HAVE to respond to insults, we can rise above them.
No debate was ever won by slinging insults around.
TIA.
^^^^^
No problem.
We would genuinely - I promise you - have a better balance to the debate, with input from all sides, & more folks getting involved if we were all a little more respectful of each other, if not respectful of each other's views.
Debates are never helped & problems never solved when we trade insults.