im listening to QJ now a lot of crazy stuff happening FTP are supposedly planning to re open within a couple hours, without license, taking alderney logo of site, and re-evaluating their T&C, also without a license you will still not be able to take money off of there due to money bookers, mastercard, visa etc going to be ditching ftp pretty soon as they have no license so if anything i would just uninstall the client off of your computer and any money you have on there right now forget about and if you get it over time treat it as a freeroll (sorry to sound harsh but its the truth) ftp are going no where but............ down right now
Alderney provide the licence for FT. Poker stars are regulated from the Isle of Man - different regulating bodies. PS seem to have much greater financial substance than FT.
If the licence to FT has been suspended because of fears over finance or customer deposits then it should not effect PS. However, if it relates to the indictments for money laundering etc. then there could be a knock on effect on PS but it depends on what the detail is.
Tommy's advice regarding deposits and new T&C's on FT is good. Stand clear would be my advice.
just withdrew my cash , but u.s players are blocked at present according to other forums . best advice seems from other forums is, take your money and run . Posted by IRISHROVER
No chance I've lost my $450 you can't even access the site, have been unable to cash out since black friday.
Well the service status on FTP has changed from down for scheduled maintenance to just down for maintenance. Not news you may ask? Well it's the nearest we'll get to a statement from FTP for quite a while I would imagine.
Just received an email from a RB company saying this :-
We appreciate that many of you have funds trapped on FT and they are in talks with the AGCC to resolve the situation and enable real money play ASAP. From what we understand of AGCC rules, player funds should be secure just temporarily inaccessible.
just been reading through this forum and something aint right cos i donked off my bankroll last night at about 4.30am 1st june on pokerstars so games are still going on and lobby is regeristing!!!!
it's only "ftp" that have had there licences suspended/revoked.
so ps's can still supply poker to players outside the "US" for now.
currently ft are being bought out by a european business ... and will be paying out the funds that has been suspended as soon as possible as far as i know anyway.
but i do suspect that it could be a couple weeks possibly months before the issues are resolved because it does look quite messy!
Well the service status on FTP has changed from down for scheduled maintenance to just down for maintenance. Not news you may ask? Well it's the nearest we'll get to a statement from FTP for quite a while I would imagine. Posted by TommyD
Tommy it's a dead cert that is all we will get from FT. At least Pokerstars have tried to keep people informed and repaid monies. Full Tilt has shown complete and utter contempt for its customers and deserves to sink without trace. I really feel for the players who have lost money.
Been following all the news recently .... luckily I never played there but I feel for everyone who's been shafted. And Chris Ferguson was I think the first player I 'looked up to' when I first discovered Hold 'em a few years ago :-/
Yeah I was massively disappointed to find out that Chris Ferguson is essentially a scumbag. Posted by Lambert180
I'm willing to hold off condemning the man until all the information comes out. Heard both sides of it regarding Ferguson (for instance, in a recent interview Mike Matusow claimed Ferguson gave the majority of his dividends to charity and was offered the money as part of his shareholding rather than was behind a nefarious plot). Amazing to think he'll probably never walk into a cardroom again regardless though. Less so for Lederer as he as been more business than play for quite some time. A lot more to come out over this no doubt.
I'm not impressed with Alderney to be honest. Their statement and reaction is essentially them shrugging their shoulders and saying 'We did everything right, it was those guys who messed you up. Don't call us anymore, we're done, call the police.' From what I can see Alderney have technically and legally done nothing wrong. However I feel morally they should have done more to check on the liquidity available to pay FT's client base. Ring fencing of customer funds from company funds should be an absolute requirement rather than a recommendation. And the matters regarding payment processing just looks very messy. I'm glad other sites registered with Alderney have ringfenced, have separate accounts and as far as I can tell run themselves in a much better fashion.
I also think you have to look at the DOJ. Please correct me if I'm wrong but haven't they frozen some of the FT accounts and have a vast amount of the company's funds? As far as I can tell they are showing no interest at this point of treating the players as anything other than another creditor and of course they fully intend to take their cut first, which looks like being the whole of the pie.
The bulk of the blame lies with someone or some people at the top of FT, but I feel both Alderney and the DOJ could have/can do more for the players. Again as far as I can see neither of the later group have done anything technically or legally wrong. In terms of ethics and good practice I have my reservations.
Feel free to be corrected on any of the above, with so much misinformation/hysteria going around it's quite easy to get the wrong end of the stick.
In Response to Re: DOJ indicts U.S. poker sites : Tommy it's a dead cert that is all we will get from FT. At least Pokerstars have tried to keep people informed and repaid monies. Full Tilt has shown complete and utter contempt for its customers and deserves to sink without trace. I really feel for the players who have lost money. Posted by FlyingDagg
You're quoting me from months ago and it still holds true. I think that in itself proves your point.
I'm willing to hold off condemning the man until all the information comes out. Heard both sides of it regarding Ferguson (for instance, in a recent interview Mike Matusow claimed Ferguson gave the majority of his dividends to charity and was offered the money as part of his shareholding rather than was behind a nefarious plot). Amazing to think he'll probably never walk into a cardroom again regardless though. Less so for Lederer as he as been more business than play for quite some time. A lot more to come out over this no doubt.
There is a difference in the responsibilities of a Shareholder and a Director. Directors are responsible and accountable for the operational aspects of a company. Shareholders are not. The roles of the individuals will be crucial in the forthcoming court action. I'm a British Gas shareholder - if they fiddle the tax man I cannot be held responsible.
I'm not impressed with Alderney to be honest. Their statement and reaction is essentially them shrugging their shoulders and saying 'We did everything right, it was those guys who messed you up. Don't call us anymore, we're done, call the police.' From what I can see Alderney have technically and legally done nothing wrong. However I feel morally they should have done more to check on the liquidity available to pay FT's client base. Ring fencing of customer funds from company funds should be an absolute requirement rather than a recommendation. And the matters regarding payment processing just looks very messy. I'm glad other sites registered with Alderney have ringfenced, have separate accounts and as far as I can tell run themselves in a much better fashion.
The AGCC have shown themselves to be toothless tigers. Once the DOJ actions are completed it will be interesting to see if any claims are made against the AGCC by players who had money deposited in a site that was supposedly overseen by them. All sites that come under the jurisdiction of the AGCC are supposed to have ringfenced the players funds as it's a condition of their licence to operate. That may make the AGCC culpable in any losses incurred by players.
I also think you have to look at the DOJ. Please correct me if I'm wrong but haven't they frozen some of the FT accounts and have a vast amount of the company's funds? As far as I can tell they are showing no interest at this point of treating the players as anything other than another creditor and of course they fully intend to take their cut first, which looks like being the whole of the pie.
This is normal practice for government agencies both in the USA and in Britain. Any company that goes into liquidation, or is forced into liquidation, then the state agencies such as Tax, VAT and National Insurance are the number one creditors. Everyone else forms a queue behind them and fight over the scraps.
The bulk of the blame lies with someone or some people at the top of FT, but I feel both Alderney and the DOJ could have/can do more for the players. Again as far as I can see neither of the later group have done anything technically or legally wrong. In terms of ethics and good practice I have my reservations.
This is no different to any company going into receivership. Customers in a holiday firm that goes bust lose their holidays and deposits (unless they have insurance to cover it). Other businesses that supply the liquidated company generally get very little back. The state agencies come first, followed by banks or similar who have joint and several guarantees from the Directors and everyone else takes whatever they are owed as a percentage of what's left.
Feel free to be corrected on any of the above, with so much misinformation/hysteria going around it's quite easy to get the wrong end of the stick.
You understand it correctly Tommy, I'm just pointing out the fact that this is normal practice. Poker players are no different to any customer or supplier in any other business.
Comments
I'll give you the 56p stop worrying ;o)
If the licence to FT has been suspended because of fears over finance or customer deposits then it should not effect PS. However, if it relates to the indictments for money laundering etc. then there could be a knock on effect on PS but it depends on what the detail is.
Tommy's advice regarding deposits and new T&C's on FT is good. Stand clear would be my advice.
Well the service status on FTP has changed from down for scheduled maintenance to just down for maintenance. Not news you may ask? Well it's the nearest we'll get to a statement from FTP for quite a while I would imagine.
From what we understand of AGCC rules, player funds should be secure just temporarily inaccessible.
so ps's can still supply poker to players outside the "US" for now.
currently ft are being bought out by a european business ... and will be paying out the funds that has been suspended as soon as possible as far as i know anyway.
but i do suspect that it could be a couple weeks possibly months before the issues are resolved because it does look quite messy!
Been following all the news recently .... luckily I never played there but I feel for everyone who's been shafted. And Chris Ferguson was I think the first player I 'looked up to' when I first discovered Hold 'em a few years ago :-/
I'm not impressed with Alderney to be honest. Their statement and reaction is essentially them shrugging their shoulders and saying 'We did everything right, it was those guys who messed you up. Don't call us anymore, we're done, call the police.' From what I can see Alderney have technically and legally done nothing wrong. However I feel morally they should have done more to check on the liquidity available to pay FT's client base. Ring fencing of customer funds from company funds should be an absolute requirement rather than a recommendation. And the matters regarding payment processing just looks very messy. I'm glad other sites registered with Alderney have ringfenced, have separate accounts and as far as I can tell run themselves in a much better fashion.
I also think you have to look at the DOJ. Please correct me if I'm wrong but haven't they frozen some of the FT accounts and have a vast amount of the company's funds? As far as I can tell they are showing no interest at this point of treating the players as anything other than another creditor and of course they fully intend to take their cut first, which looks like being the whole of the pie.
The bulk of the blame lies with someone or some people at the top of FT, but I feel both Alderney and the DOJ could have/can do more for the players. Again as far as I can see neither of the later group have done anything technically or legally wrong. In terms of ethics and good practice I have my reservations.
Feel free to be corrected on any of the above, with so much misinformation/hysteria going around it's quite easy to get the wrong end of the stick.
I'm willing to hold off condemning the man until all the information comes out. Heard both sides of it regarding Ferguson (for instance, in a recent interview Mike Matusow claimed Ferguson gave the majority of his dividends to charity and was offered the money as part of his shareholding rather than was behind a nefarious plot). Amazing to think he'll probably never walk into a cardroom again regardless though. Less so for Lederer as he as been more business than play for quite some time. A lot more to come out over this no doubt.
There is a difference in the responsibilities of a Shareholder and a Director. Directors are responsible and accountable for the operational aspects of a company. Shareholders are not. The roles of the individuals will be crucial in the forthcoming court action. I'm a British Gas shareholder - if they fiddle the tax man I cannot be held responsible.
I'm not impressed with Alderney to be honest. Their statement and reaction is essentially them shrugging their shoulders and saying 'We did everything right, it was those guys who messed you up. Don't call us anymore, we're done, call the police.' From what I can see Alderney have technically and legally done nothing wrong. However I feel morally they should have done more to check on the liquidity available to pay FT's client base. Ring fencing of customer funds from company funds should be an absolute requirement rather than a recommendation. And the matters regarding payment processing just looks very messy. I'm glad other sites registered with Alderney have ringfenced, have separate accounts and as far as I can tell run themselves in a much better fashion.
The AGCC have shown themselves to be toothless tigers. Once the DOJ actions are completed it will be interesting to see if any claims are made against the AGCC by players who had money deposited in a site that was supposedly overseen by them. All sites that come under the jurisdiction of the AGCC are supposed to have ringfenced the players funds as it's a condition of their licence to operate. That may make the AGCC culpable in any losses incurred by players.
I also think you have to look at the DOJ. Please correct me if I'm wrong but haven't they frozen some of the FT accounts and have a vast amount of the company's funds? As far as I can tell they are showing no interest at this point of treating the players as anything other than another creditor and of course they fully intend to take their cut first, which looks like being the whole of the pie.
This is normal practice for government agencies both in the USA and in Britain. Any company that goes into liquidation, or is forced into liquidation, then the state agencies such as Tax, VAT and National Insurance are the number one creditors. Everyone else forms a queue behind them and fight over the scraps.
The bulk of the blame lies with someone or some people at the top of FT, but I feel both Alderney and the DOJ could have/can do more for the players. Again as far as I can see neither of the later group have done anything technically or legally wrong. In terms of ethics and good practice I have my reservations.
This is no different to any company going into receivership. Customers in a holiday firm that goes bust lose their holidays and deposits (unless they have insurance to cover it). Other businesses that supply the liquidated company generally get very little back. The state agencies come first, followed by banks or similar who have joint and several guarantees from the Directors and everyone else takes whatever they are owed as a percentage of what's left.
Feel free to be corrected on any of the above, with so much misinformation/hysteria going around it's quite easy to get the wrong end of the stick.
You understand it correctly Tommy, I'm just pointing out the fact that this is normal practice. Poker players are no different to any customer or supplier in any other business.